Any reason not to go All Grain right from the start?

[Rhys]

This is looking like a rather enjoyable hobby that I'm considering. Can you give me any real reason not to go AG from the start? The additional steps don't look to be exactly rocket sience, just involve temp control more than anything.

 

[jtlawlor]

I did! It might not be for everyone though. I read a lot here - and Palmers How to Brew... gathered equipment... even used a friends brew kettle for my first batch. Oh and I recommend searching YouTube too.

I planned out everything ... really researched the steps. So far I have done 3 batches... a Scottish Ale, a Wit and most recently an IPA. So far, all have been good... I think. Definitely Beer and definitely drinkable.

I would say you should go for it. Keep everything clean and sanitary.. it will be beer. My reasons were similar to yours... I like to cook, and I really like to cook from scratch, and to me, using DME/LME was just not the full experience.

 

[ruffdeezy]

I think doing extracts is a good way to get a better understanding and getting your technique down, but once I started doing all grain I felt a lot more comfortable doing it and thought it was easier than doing extracts and steeping grains so it could be that way right from the start.

 

[Rhys]

Last year I was given the infamous Mr.Beer the result was definately alcohol and drikable, but making it didn't amount to much. Disolve can of goo in water let cool add yeast and wait. I wanted to let it sit longer as it was still fermenting pretty good but the seals on the "keg" failed and I had to bottle a bit early. I don't really see extract brewing as being much more involved than that. As with most other things I'm involved in I like to have as much control over the entire process as possible.

 

[Montanaandy]

I feel a lot more confident going to AG after doing several extract/partial mash brews. There is a bit of a jump in the learning curve with AG as opposed to extract (getting the temps of the water in the correct range before striking or sparging, etc.) that you don't have to concern yourself with with extract. The first couple of batches of extract are learning experiences because you are doing things during the 3 hours of the brewing process that you have not done before (i.e sanitizing everything, having everything weighted and measured out, adding the LME or DME at the proper times, steeping your grains, adding hops on schedule, cooling the wort, transferring to a carboy, taking a OG reading, adding your yeast) You are also taking into account you efficiency with AG which you don't concern yourself with when extract brewing. The boiling, addition of hops, and cool down are the same as with extract. I brewed some great beers with extract and I know that they will be that much better with AG. Montanaandy

 

[killian]

I would say if you have the right equipment go all grain.

 

[Richabt]

I think the equipment needed and not having a clear understanding of the brewing process are what caused most of us to start with extracts before moving to all grain. If those aren't obstacles then go for it.

I still have some apreciation for using extracts for partial mashes and occasionally bumping up my gravity as needed on all grain recipes.

 

[The Pol]

No reason not to go AG first. I did, it isnt that hard. It comes down to temp. and time BASICALLY. Now, later you can play with water chemistry, the crush.. but that will not be necessary now.

Get a cooler, or two, do single infusion mashing, it is hands off.

MANY great kits out there from all of the HBS online, get the grain crushed for you (I recommend AHS or BMW for that, some others have had some shady crushes lately).

Brewing an extract IMHO isnt going to teach you anything about brewing AG, I have never done it, but I dont know how mixing sugar with water will teach you anything about the mashing process and lautering. GREAT resources here, AG primers, and a wealth of knowlege. A week of reading here will do more to get you ready for AG than a year of extract brewing ever could.

Just my $.02

It is very doable.

 

[rwinzing]

I went AG after 2 batches......read up and you will be fine.

 

[AnOldUR]

It comes down to temp. and time . . .

And money!

In the long run, you'll spend more making and improving a system from extract to all-grain over time. But there is the advantage of spending money in small chuncks that softens the blow. And personally, I found the growing process fun and entertaining. Isn't that what a hobby is about? If all I wanted was beer, I'd buy beer!

That said, if you have the money and an experienced mentor to guide you on system and technique, it'll save you a lot of time.

Brew-In-A-Bag is the cheapest way to try AG.

 

[The Pol]

BIAB and NO CHILL... you can AG easy peasy

 

[masonsjax]

When I first started researching this hobby it was clear that I would want to go AG, and probably sooner than later. After reading every sticky here, all active topics, and every other blog I could get my hands on, I couldn't see what everyone was so afraid of. I saved a lot of cash not having to buy everything twice (and kegging from the start saved me bottling setup expenses). AG is incredibly simple, if you want it to be. Single infusuon, batch sparge, make sure your thermometer is calibrated and you can't go wrong. it really is simple, go for it.

 

[WenValley]

I brewed an all grain oatmeal stout two days ago, it was 22 degrees F during the brew session. Took an hour to get the hose thawed out. Ended up with a skating rink in the driveway. I was thinking that maybe switching back to extract during the winter would be a good option. So the time and experience that I gained from my extract brewing days is still useful. It's all part of the learning curve, there are some really great extract recipes and techniques.
Good Luck....

 

[The Pol]

DO this to the cooler
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f51/10-thru-wall-therms-pics-too-24946/

Insert this as the thermometer

Use an online mash temp. calculator

Viola, you are a mashing pro. It is really that simple.

Like was stated earlier... if you buy a burner and a pot that is too small for AG, then you have to buy another pot that is large enough for all grain boils... what are you saving exactly? Sure sure, some people here have pricey AG systems, but that is not needed at all.

One cooler
Braid in the bottom
Thermometer in the side.
Heat the batch sparge water on the stove.
Drain to the kettle.
Boil.
Transfer to one of these $15 fermentors while still hot:

Let cool 24 hours.
Pitch yeast.

You are an AG brewer

 

[The Pol]

Actually, here are my build threads on how to go from a plain cooler... to converting it to a MLT, to adding thermometers, to adding sight guages... to then converting that SAME equipment to E-HERMS to converting the BK to electric, to creating a closed wort cooling system!

Start simple, and you can use that SAME equipment to build something much more complex in the future.

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f51/pols-electric-herms-thread-compilation-95566/

 

[The Pol]

I brewed an all grain oatmeal stout two days ago, it was 22 degrees F during the brew session. Took an hour to get the hose thawed out. Ended up with a skating rink in the driveway. I was thinking that maybe switching back to extract during the winter would be a good option. So the time and experience that I gained from my extract brewing days is still useful. It's all part of the learning curve, there are some really great extract recipes and techniques.
Good Luck....

Or go no chill in the winter at least.

 

[KopyKat]

I see that you have been on this forum since Feb of 2008 and have posted 27 times. What, spend all your time looking at the brew babes? I think not! Time to get started. The worse you can do by starting all grain is to screw up your first beer. And you don't even have to tell anyone about it.:rockin:

 

[SnickASaurusRex]

I did one extract batch before I went all grain. The learning curve is different, not necessarily steeper. There are a lot of processes that you just have to trust are working out, and when things seem to be going horribly wrong they usually aren't. You have to remember to just chill and go with the punches. In the end I always end up with beer, good drinkable intoxicating beer.

I rehearsed each step and walked through exit strategies to potential problems before I did my first AG batch. It might seem silly, but when things didn't go as I thought It gave me an understanding of how to solve the problems.

G'luck

 

[wildwest450]

One cooler
Braid in the bottom
Thermometer in the side.
Heat the batch sparge water on the stove.
Drain to the kettle.
Boil.
Transfer to one of these $15 fermentors while still hot:

Let cool 24 hours.
Pitch yeast.

You are an AG brewer

Actually that makes you a no chill brewer, one step below an actual all grain brewer.

I keed, I keed.

 

[Trencher]

I brewed a few full-boil extract batches before starting partial-mash and small all-grain brews. The biggest thing I learned from those extract batches was sanitation and fermentation management, which is really what you need to make a good beer. It's much easier to make bad beer by screwing up your pitch than by screwing up your mash.

Since I started with a kettle, burner and chiller moving to all-grain was simple. Partial-mash was pointless - if I'm mashing, I don't want to bother with extract unless it's necessary.

 

[mithion]

I feel starting with extract is a way to reduce the number of variables at first. You can experiment with different hops and yeasts and see what changes. It's also a good way to test fermentation temps, and fermentation schedules as well as sanitation methods. No matter how efficient your mashing equipment is or how steady your wort from mash to mash, you won't produce good beer with poor sanitation and an inconsistent fermentation environment.

However, I can see an exception to the above statement. When I started brewing, I moved to AG after 3 batches. I didn't really understand the fundamentals and it didn't turn out so well. I didn't have very good documentation, I hadn't discovered this amazingly useful website and I didn't personally know anyone who could show me what to do. I don't need to say my first few AG beers were terrible. If you're interested in starting in the hobby but want to move directly to AG, then I would try to find a more experienced fellow homebrewer, offer to split the cost of his next recipe in exchange for him to show you how it's done. Take good notes and you should do much better than I did with my first batch.

 

[Montanaandy]

"I feel starting with extract is a way to reduce the number of variables at first." This is what I was alluding to but Mithion expressed it better. If you feel you are ready for AG brewing from the start then go for it. Not trying to dissuade anyone. I personally would have been a bit overwhelmed going AG my first batch and I might have been discouraged from continuing with home brewing. That's me though.

With respect to equipment, I would agree that if you plan on going AG right off the bat then get equipment appropriate to AG brewing. I had/have a 6 gal thick walled Aluminum pot that I used for almost full boils with my extract. I purchased a 15 gal Polarware for AG and to give me the option of doing 10 gal batches down the line.

I use the 2 cooler method (HLT & MLT) but in a very basic fashion. My goal is to build a system like the one Pol uses but I am not all that technically inclined and absent step by really detailed step instructions such as the ones that I used to turn the 10 gal Rubbermaid into an MLT it will not happen for a while. Montanaandy

 

[samc]

If you start with AG you will not be able to second guess yourself and say why didn't I do that in the first place.

AG is a much more satisfying process for ME. If I was only still doing extract I think I would be bored with it by now.

 

[MultumInParvo]

I wish I started with AG first. I ended up buying all of the stuff for extract, and now I just have a smaller pot I never use.

You're right that AG isn't exactly rocket science. There is more to play with, which is what I like...

 

[jeffmeh]

Actually, if you know you want to go all-grain and do not want to buy equipment twice, just buy a large enough kettle deal with your intended batch size, and whatever you need to heat it. You can certainly do full-boil extract in a 15 gallon kettle, then use it for all-grain as well.

That being said, I still have not made the transition to all-grain, but the only item that I may no longer use is the 7.5 gallon pot that came with the turkey fryer kit. And even that might be of use as an HLT. Am I missing something?

 

[KYB]

Nothing wrong with starting out with All Grain. I, as well as quite a few other did and everything worked out just fine. All you really need is a cooler. I read up on everything, ordered ingredients from Midwest crushed, and brewed a Stout. The only thing that went wrong is I accidentally dumped the whole pound of roasted barley in (actually I think it was Black Barley and it called for regular roasted, 500 v 300). I didn't freak out, and in the end I still made some pretty good beer. Pretty roasty but still good. My 2nd AG was my first recipe, and got a 43 in a comp from a BJCP judge. All you have to do is read up on everything and understand it completely before you start brewing. I use a 6gal pot for a HLT and an 8gal to boil in, both Aluminum. People make AG out to be some huge difficult process. With a single infusion mash, it's pretty easy. Heat water to certain temp, dump in cooler, stir in grains, let sit, drain, add more water, let sit, drain.

 

[ghpeel]

I'm teaching a friend of mine to brew and I just started her on all grain from the get-go.

I'm still helping her make recipes, but she's getting the gist of it quickly. We're doing bag-mashing (sorta like BIAB, so no stuck sparges), dry yeast only and No Chill. If you stick to "traditional" recipes (Brewing Classic Styles), this takes a lot of extra complexity out of the process.

Only problem is that she's a d*mn cook , which means all 4 batches she's made so far have an average of about 3 different spices in them, lol. I think she's used Chicory, Lemon Zest, Pumpkin, Cinnamon, Nutmeg, Ginger, Juniper, Vanilla, and Sarsaparilla (cream soda flavor, not sasparilla). Beer's been good though!

 

[B33R]

I just did my first brew ever and i started off all grain. If you do your research and make sure you have all the equipment you need and it works the way its suppose to then I'd say go for it. Get your mash tun set up, your chiller set up and make sure your stove can boil the kettle volume or else you'll need a burner before you can start brewing. Also just be sure you have a large enough brew kettle to avoid boil overs.

 

[Scut_Monkey]

I would not equate extract brewing as adding sugar to water and getting beer. I think it is a good way for new brewers to learn the basics of brewing while not having to perform all of the steps that can be daunting at first. Plus I think you will most likely get better beer if your first batch is extract compared to AG simply because there is less room for you to make an error.

Brewing extract for my first two batches allowed me to understand gravity readings, fermentation, hop additions, types of hops, alpha acid levels, isomerization, driving off DMS, cold break, hot break, cooling the wort, and much more. I think the great thing about doing an extract batch is it allows you to concentrate more on proper sanitation which should be your main goal with your first batch.

If you have the equipment to do AG off the bat I don't see a problem with it but extract brewing has some advantages for the new brewer that should be considered.

 

[Baldy_Beer_Brewery]

I started with extract because most of what I read (this site included) suggested that it may be better to start that way, maybe go mini-mash and then go all grain when I have everything "dialed in". Dialed in? WTF?

In retrospect, AG isn't that hard. If you have or can get the equipment go for it. A simple infushion mash recipe is not that hard to master.