alternatives to malt extract?

[shafferpilot]

I'll never understand why some get all up in a huff when someone wants to make a really light beer. It IS beer. My suggestion would have been to use the lightest pilsner extract you can find and some rice solids. then bolster the alcohol content with corn sugar (no more than 10% of the fermentable sugar). And stick to an ABV of 4% or less. It's tempting to try and make it stronger than that, but you'll be sorry if you do. You can't get much lighter than that. The hops should be bittering hops only, and use very very little of them. Be prepared to let it sit in secondary for a month or two as it'll take a while for those subtle flavours to mature.

But since you're now making barleywine.... which is quite a switch... I guess it doesn't matter any more.

Do yourself a favor and don't cave the next time a fellow homebrewer tries to beat you with the rheinsgebot. What's the point of a hobby where you don't get to do what you want, and you end up with a product that doesn't even resemble what you wanted in the first place?

 

[Orfy]

It's not a light beer and it's nothing to do with some old purity law.
I've wrote thread helping brewers create ligh beers and to help them see what is involved.

The OP wanted to create an alcholic brew that was as far removed from beer as possible.

 

[Special Hops]

I think he is talking about "ZIMA".

 

[Chad]

nooner, you are wrong .
The Ancient Egyptians made beer by bakeing extra yeasty loaves of barley
that thay would crumble in a crock with water and more yeast and mabe a few dates if there where any at the LHBS (the bazaar

Actually Nooner is exactly right. There are many types of beer all over the world that never see a barley kernel.

• Chica: a maize beer from South America made from unmalted maize
• Chang: Rice beer of Himalaya
• Kvass: Russian small beer made from rye bread and lemons
• Pissionia: Yuma native beer made from roasted wheat
• Pombe: East African beer made from millet
• Tesguino: Aztec beer made from malted corn

and a bunch of others, like roggenbier or sahti, where barley is just one grain or even an adjunct rather than the main grain. The type of beer we usually talk about on HBT is primarily barley, but Nooner's point is valid. All beer is not made with barley.

Chad

sources: Radical Brewing, Randy Mosher, Brewers Publications 2004
Origin and History of Beer and Brewing, John P. Arnold, Wahl-Henius Institute of Fermentology 1911; reprint Beerbooks.com 2005

 

[TeleTwanger]

I'll never understand why some get all up in a huff when someone wants to make a really light beer. It IS beer. My suggestion would have been to use the lightest pilsner extract

Of course light beers are beers but the OP wanted to use NO malt extract, not very light, or a little bit, but ZERO. Obviously it can be done but I don't know how.

 

[Orfy]

Actually Nooner is exactly right. There are many types of beer all over the world that never see a barley kernel.

• Chica: a maize beer from South America made from unmalted maize
• Chang: Rice beer of Himalaya
• Kvass: Russian small beer made from rye bread and lemons
• Pissionia: Yuma native beer made from roasted wheat
• Pombe: East African beer made from millet
• Tesguino: Aztec beer made from malted corn

and a bunch of others, like roggenbier or sahti, where barley is just one grain or even an adjunct rather than the main grain. The type of beer we usually talk about on HBT is primarily barley, but Nooner's point is valid. All beer is not made with barley.

Chad

sources: Radical Brewing, Randy Mosher, Brewers Publications 2004
Origin and History of Beer and Brewing, John P. Arnold, Wahl-Henius Institute of Fermentology 1911; reprint Beerbooks.com 2005

Those are fermented drinks but not beer.
If you've tasted some of these drinks you will know that they are not beer and do not taste like beer.
I have shared a pot of Pombe or "Kaffir beer" as it was know in the area. It does not taste, smell or look like beer. When it comes down to it you can ferment anything containing starch if it has the correct enzymes to convert it to sugar.

Here is a tried and tested recipe. Try this if it's what you want to do.

"African Opaque Beer"
1/2 kilo (1.1 lbs) sorghum malt
1/2 kilo (1.1 lbs) unmalted millet
Packet Red Star baking yeast

 

[chazzman]

I am glad this came up. The beers in question were called "mock beers"
in the 70's when I made my first miserable attempts at beermaking. There
was a small well-written book back then I used to own called "Home Brewed
Beers and Stouts" that had a recipe called Bran Ale which it described as
an "excellent, cheap ale" that I am currently looking for. That is, am
currently looking for both the recipe and the book, both at home and
online. Anybody have it?

 

[rabidgerbil]

Pretty much any definition that I can find anywhere, dictionaries, wikipedia, etc, all match up to what wikipedia says:

It is produced by the brewing and fermentation of starches, mainly derived from cereals — the most common of which is malted barley, although wheat, corn, and rice are also widely used. Most beer is flavoured with hops, which add bitterness and act as a natural preservative, though other flavourings such as herbs or fruit may occasionally be included. Alcoholic beverages fermented from non-starch sources such as grape juice (wine) or honey (mead) are not classified as beer.

That being said, I have to agree that it sounds like the OP wants to reproduce a commercial malt beverage like Zima.

 

[CBBaron]

Those are fermented drinks but not beer.
If you've tasted some of these drinks you will know that they are not beer and do not taste like beer.
I have shared a pot of Pombe or "Kaffir beer" as it was know in the area. It does not taste, smell or look like beer. When it comes down to it you can ferment anything containing starch if it has the correct enzymes to convert it to sugar.

Here is a tried and tested recipe. Try this if it's what you want to do.

Orfy,
I have to disagree, by definition they are beer.
However you are correct in that they will not taste anything like beer made with malted barley. You could say they are not "real" beer. And I feel you gave good answers to the OP.

It sounds like the goal of the OP was to make hooch. HBT is about beer (mead and wine). And 99.9% of the time it is about beer made from malted barley and hops.

Craig

 

[shafferpilot]

fair enough. I just got the impression the OP was looking for an extremely light beer and had made the incorrect assumption that the only way to do so was to work without malted barley entirely.

I do think we have a new topic for the debate forum, though.

Beer: What is it exactly?

 

[HOOTER]

Beer: What is it exactly?

Good question. Clearly it's not what the OP wants to make, or at least didn't before the barleywine idea.

Beer to me is based on four main ingredients- Malted barley, hops, yeast, and water. I don't subscribe to the Reinheitsgebot religiously, considering that I've used honey, wheat, brown sugar, etc., but it is the necessary foundation for any real beer, IMO.

 

[Lurpinator]

I have no choice BUT to make sorghum beers or anything that does not contain barley, wheat, or rye. Is this my ideal situation? NO. I used to drink good beer before I found out I was severely Celiac. Why do I try to brew "beer" with non-traditional "beer" ingredients? Because Beer is my drink of choice, and I want to have that again but can't in any traditional sense. So, we can get technical with the rules and regulations of ancient beer traditions, or we can call the drinks we spend the time to brew and enjoy to ourselves what we want. I prefer to call my brews "beer" even though some of you may frown on this. It is beer to me, thats all I care about.

Thats my rant.

My opinion on the OP's topic is that he is on a completely different level, and he wanted to brew ZIMA as others have said.

 

[Orfy]

Okay. I give in.
The way to make a ZIMA.......or a Zero SRM Zero malt flavour alcoholic beverage.

Sugar
Water
Turbo yeast.
Ferment
Add passive charcoal
Leave to settle.
Filter.
Dilute with water to get from 20%+ ABV to 4 or 5% ABV
Add a flavouring extract.

Now if any one really believes that is beer then I have now wish to educate you further.
I do not dispute you can make a beer alternate with other ceral. I don note dispute there is a need for such brews.
This forum is not about brewing hooch type drinks and I do not believe it should be encouraged.

 

[patpend3]

Zima; man I hate that stuff. I think I once drank about 6oz's I had to find a shrub to pore the rest out on.

here in Utah there is a limit on alcohol content in store bought beer, all my friends are used to beer with an alcohol content of no more than 3.2%.

What I really want to do is make some thing that i can give to the Mormon missionary's that pop in once and a while.

 

[batches_brew]

Zima; man I hate that stuff. I think I once drank about 6oz's I had to find a shrub to pore the rest out on.

here in Utah there is a limit on alcohol content in store bought beer, all my friends are used to beer with an alcohol content of no more than 3.2%.

Isn't that 3.2% alcohol by weight? That would make it 4.2% ABV. Still pretty sad. You can only buy the stonger stuff in the very few state run liquor stores. SLC has some tasty brewpubs, though. Brewvies rules.

 

[Orfy]

I'm confused now.

Can you give us a commercial example of what you are after?

 

[CBBaron]

I'm confused now.

Can you give us a commercial example of what you are after?

+1
Zima sounded exactly like patpend3 originally described.

patpend3 you are going to have to give us more to go on than you have so far. Barleywine is about the farthest from a light flavored beverage you can make. Zima is a clear malt based beverage with little flavor. Your descriptions are becoming very contradictory. If you are interested in a beer go to this style guide and tell us which style best fits. If its not beer then give us some commercial examples.

Craig

 

[Homercidal]

Zima; man I hate that stuff. I think I once drank about 6oz's I had to find a shrub to pore the rest out on.

here in Utah there is a limit on alcohol content in store bought beer, all my friends are used to beer with an alcohol content of no more than 3.2%.

What I really want to do is make some thing that i can give to the Mormon missionary's that pop in once and a while.

Ok, you can EASILY brew a lighter beer without going to the extreme of making a completely colorless and tasteless beverage. There are several basic recipes here that will lead to a nice, mild beer, with low alcohol and still be considered beer by everyone (although there will be some who would not consider it a very tasty beer).

If that is what you wanted to make, then you should have said so. Personally, I was interested seeing if anyone could come up with a recipe for this nothing beer, and seeing if anyone has ever tried it.

That all said, once you have the light beer for your buddies, make sure to let them taste your other beers and see what they think. There are plenty of people here that live within the areas where making beer or heavier beers is illegal. The consensus is that the authorities will leave you alone as long as you don't advertise.

Maybe try a Kolsch, or something (I'm not really up on the lighter stuff now). I like a belgian wit for a lighter beer, but it has spices like orange and coriander that some might not like.