After Only 4 Batches I have an Investor? WAH?

[Nitsua]

Calling me an amateur home brewer is an understatement. Only two beers have been finished and distributed to friends, others are fermenting and bottle conditioning.
One of my buddies wants to give me some of money to start brewing on a larger scale ($500 -$1000). I know it's not a LARGE sum of money but I'm not sure he is taking a wise bet. He obviously does not want a full brewery, he just wants to sell beer to friends. While selling beer w/o a license does seem "exciting", I'm not quite sure it is such a good idea.

I had never thought about trying to make money off my friends for a hobby.

If I took the money could upgrade to all-grain, and maybe larger batch sizes. Then sell beer to friends until I repaid him.
OOOOO maybe even set up a small bar in the garage :rockin:

Question 1: Should I take the money?
Question 2: Would you/ Should I, have any ethical problems selling to friends?

I am torn on what to do.
Your thoughts would be greatly appreciated
Thanks

 

[Nurmey]

Whatever you decide it is a really bad idea to commit a Federal offense.

 

[llazy_llama]

Whatever you decide it is a really bad idea to commit a Federal offense.

Yeah... I don't know about you folks, but spending time in a federal prison just doesn't sound like fun to me.

 

[winzerz]

TABC (texas alcohol and beverage commision) frowns rather severly on this practice

I believe its called "bootlegging"

 

[Nitsua]

The Legal aspects are by far my biggest concern. The risk far out out weigh any reward.
I mostly wanted to play devils advocate and see if anyone made a good argument for.
Many thanks for the input.

 

[BoyScout]

So don't sell them beer, sell them memberships in a social club or beer admiration society.
Provide the beer absolutely free as a bonus for showing up at club meetings.

 

[Mustangfreak]

I don't sell my beer, but I do accept donations and tips.

 

[hayabusa]

Your friends can buy your ingredients for you; so you brew for free and then you give them 1/2 of the beer. That's fair and legal.

 

[Tenchiro]

So don't sell them beer, sell them memberships in a social club or beer admiration society.
Provide the beer absolutely free as a bonus for showing up at club meetings.

there is a club like that in Seattle, the owner got tired of the smoking laws in bars and created his own club. There is no fee to join and no admission just BYOB or make a donation and donate to the club. The only way to get in is word of mouth but once they like you you can go back whenever you want. Since it is a private establishment that is not open to the public they fly under the radar for the man.

It is one of the coolest places I have hung out in.

 

[ChshreCat]

Your friends can buy your ingredients for you; so you brew for free and then you give them 1/2 of the beer. That's fair and legal.

I'm going to be doing that. My boss is hooked on chocolate stout, so she's going to buy the ingredients for a batch, I'll brew it and we'll split the spoils.

 

[carnevoodoo]

I'm going to be doing that. My boss is hooked on chocolate stout, so she's going to buy the ingredients for a batch, I'll brew it and we'll split the spoils.

I do this with some of my friends too. It is just fun for me to brew, so everyone is happy. I usually give them 90% of the beer, not just half.

 

[Yuri_Rage]

Involving friends with business often turns out poorly.

Besides, taking money from one friend to make money from other friends is...well...douchie.

 

[carnevoodoo]

Involving friends with business often turns out poorly.

Besides, taking money from one friend to make money from other friends is...well...douchie.

So so true. Making money off of friends is just weird.

 

[Nugent]

I can smuggle whiskey across the border to you, like in the 1930's. We could open some speakeasies!

Who wants to be Elliott Ness? I can be Al Capone.

 

[Mustangfreak]

I do this with some of my friends too. It is just fun for me to brew, so everyone is happy. I usually give them 90% of the beer, not just half.

Thats what I do. I take a 6'er from it, and they have the rest.

 

[Coastarine]

I had a "happy hour" party at my house yesterday. Not an all out party, because it wrapped up around 8, it was just a good time and a beer on the way home from work. I'm going to make it a regular thing, and I might put out a donation jar but probably not. I get all excited at the idea of kicked kegs, because there is always something delicious coming. If I wanted to though, I could just make it 5$ per person for the snacks and beer, and I think that would more than cover it. I don't think I will though, I like the atmosphere of hospitality. No need to bring pen and paper into this.

 

[GunnerMan]

I agree if you want to sell your beer, you need to avoid the legal aspects of it. I.E. put the beer out as "free" and have a "tip" jar. But as far as you and everyone that gets beer knows this tip is..mandatory. Or take the money for ingredients/and labor, kind of like an escort service, you are not paying for the sex officially, instead you are paying for the accompanyment/time.

I would just tell your buddy that you don't want to sell your beer but you will take his money and upgrade with it, then you can give him brews untill you have paid him off.

 

[mmb]

Selling homebrew is a good way to run afoul of your friendly, local ATF officer and the TTB.

ATF has guns, TTB will just sell everything you own to cover the fines and then let the ATF take you to jail.

I like the club idea but I don't like making money off of friends. If they want to push a couple bucks forward to cover ingredients that's fine, but a "tip" jar just sticks in my craw.

That said... I have a 1900's till on the back bar at home..

 

[Denny's Evil Concoctions]

There's a guy here with a 6 bbl system in his back shop. Yes; 6 barrels.

People volunteer to help him brew, in turn you "chip in" for ingredients and operarting costs. He collects the money based on how many bottles you take home.

He even has his own bottling system.

That said, this is in BC and is technically legal but each state or province or federal law is different. You really do have to watch out. This guy is right on the edge of the law. He doesn't have a large number of "co-brewers" so no one really cares anyway. If he had hundreds then he'd be watched like a hawk. He had a lwayer friend come up with this system.

I bought ingredients off him for my owb brewing. I do know you never mention the words "buy" and "beer" in the same sentance when talking to him or he'll quickly show yu the door.

Man, would it be nice if there were no laws about selling alchohol without licences. Would sure make things easier in these economic times.

 

[Baldy_Beer_Brewery]

While I wouldn't do it, I do recognize that there are a good many good old boys around these parts that sell 'shine. AFAIK, they have yet to be busted, but I have a long standing policy of avoiding anal rape and staying out from behind bars goes a long way towards maintaining that.

As far as making money brewing beer... I also have a policy of not making a job out of this hobby. I enjoy brewing, I enjoy beer, and I enjoy my friends and family enjoying my beer.

 

[Yooper]

Don't forget to check your laws in your state- most allow 100 gallons of homebrewed wine, beer, mead, cider per person for personal use. If you have more than one over-21 adult in your home, you can make up to 200 gallons per year legally. In Canada, the legal age is younger, of course, but in the US it's 21.

 

[SeeGeeBee]

Yeah... I don't know about you folks, but spending time in a federal prison just doesn't sound like fun to me.

No no no. You'll be going to federal POUND ME IN THE ASS prison.

 

[Denny's Evil Concoctions]

Don't forget to check your laws in your state- most allow 100 gallons of homebrewed wine, beer, mead, cider per person for personal use. If you have more than one over-21 adult in your home, you can make up to 200 gallons per year legally. In Canada, the legal age is younger, of course, but in the US it's 21.

I don't think we even have a limit on production here. I think it's 19 in everywhere but Alberta (18). Quebec used to be 18, not sure if they still are.

 

[Denny's Evil Concoctions]

No no no. You'll be going to federal POUND ME IN THE ASS prison.

lazy lama might actually enjoy that.

 

[GunnerMan]

Don't forget to check your laws in your state- most allow 100 gallons of homebrewed wine, beer, mead, cider per person for personal use. If you have more than one over-21 adult in your home, you can make up to 200 gallons per year legally. In Canada, the legal age is younger, of course, but in the US it's 21.

100-200 gallons...how will that ever be enforced...lol why do we waste time with such "laws"

 

[The Pol]

I agree with those that say regardless of laws, it is douchie to charge friends for such things. I have a neighbor that charged his "friend", another neighbor, $20 to mow his grass because he didnt have a mower last year. Super douchie... you dont charge neighbors for doing them a favor, and you dont charge friends for beer. Next thing you know, you are over at thier house watching the game and they charge you a buck for each beer you take from thier fridge. Now, that would be funny!

Dont take the money, dont charge your friends...

 

[Beernip]

Just remember that it will only take one pissed off customer to notify the ATF. Doesn't matter if it was your friend or his ex-girlfriend who he just cheated on.

 

[Denny's Evil Concoctions]

Having buddies give you some cash for brew supplies is one thing but running it as a brew business is pretty dodgy IMO. Might as well make shine for sale.

 

[newbeerpig]

I just got my neighbor brewing his own and then we share, great program, I have twice the brews around with half of the work and no issues with the ATF of federal pound me in the prison. Just an idea, especially if someone is ready to invest... might even get them to upgrade to all grain and then borrow their stuff

 

[Denny's Evil Concoctions]

Give your friends beer then make them do stuff like wash your car, mow your lawn, change your brakes, take your GF to the shoe store..