13 hop QIPA (AKA Plinyfish Heady 120)

[carton132]

I meant to ask how you were taking gravity readings. Hydrometer in vessel or returning samples? Did you purge the headspace with co2 after or trust that the new activity would take care of it, or maybe just not worry because a blanket of co2 was already there? Just curious for my own future experiments. Fun project so far, hope it finishes nicely for you.

 

[ianmatth]

I used a hydrometer basing 21+% ABV off the Alternate formula on brewersfriend.com. Standard formula would still put ABV at 18+%. I had to constantly take measurements, so if I hadn't returned the sample, I would have finished the beer before it was ready. I made sure to sanitize every single time, but I don't get crazy about oxidation. It was actively fermenting the whole time it was in primary, so it was constantly blowing CO2 through the airlock. I never let it sit open for any longer than I had to, and in secondary I would give it a little shake after closing it back up and was always able to get a few bubbles from the airlock, so I assume there was still some fermentation and CO2 being produced. Since I plan for my sugar/yeast combo to be active when I bottle I figure it will create enough CO2 to push out any oxygen at that point as well. I also have oxygen absorbing caps.

 

[carton132]

Cool, thanks! Looking forward to your review when it's done.

 

[RachmaelBenApplebaum]

How, if you don't mind my asking, do you think this will bottle condition if at all? I'm not sure with those gravities it's possible in less than a year or more in ideal conditions.

 

[ianmatth]

No idea, but it's a full packet of champagne yeast and it only has to attenuate 16g of sugar. My assumption is that since it will be active before I pitch it, it will actually convert most of that pretty quickly before the 18-21% ABV environment kills it or significantly slows it down, so I don't think giving it a year vs giving it 6-12 weeks would make a huge difference. I might give it 6 weeks tops, but I really don't think I'm that patient. At the very least I'm sure I'll drink one of the beers after 3 weeks.

I've had plenty of 1.080 OG batches carbonate perfectly in less than a week, although I will say 2 weeks is ideal for most of my 1.060-1.090 batches with my current methods (not sure why, but doing primary fermentation in the kettle drastically improves carbonation time). This beer is twice the ABV, but I used a yeast that can handle twice the ABV of most American yeasts (WLP099 can handle 20+% ABV, and WLP045 can obviously handle it as well), plus I'm pitching a full packet of champagne yeast for ~8 beers.

 

[Silentnoiz]

This sounds like a fun experiment. Looking forward to hearing your results. I've been considering doing something either similar to this or the Eisbock method.

 

[ianmatth]

Bottled the beer tonight. Could have filled 8 bottles, but I would have been slightly under-filling, and I felt the proper fill was extremely important if I wanted them to carbonate. So ultimately I would say I got 9 bottles out of this gallon batch since I drank about a bottle worth throughout all the tastings, I filled 7 bottles of really clear beer tonight, and I put a bit less than a bottle through a coffee filter (the trubbed up part) that I am drinking right now.

 

[brewski09]

I've done some high gravity experiments with the WLP099 and it's a champ ABV wise, but the attenuation is low compared to other strains in my experience. I'm interested I. If you get this carbonated. I've had problems with carbonation over 18%. There are some interesting articles on co2 and other gaseous solubility in alcohol solutions over 20%. Took some out of bottles and diluted it down, carved up no problem at about 16%. Interested in what you end up with.

 

[ianmatth]

I opened a beer today. It had zero carbonation after 3 weeks in the bottle. It tastes great, but it would have definitely needed longer than 3 weeks. I've got 6 bottles left. I'm going to give it another 3 weeks and see if anything happens.

 

[thisisbeer]

How are things lookong now?

 

[ianmatth]

There was no carbonation after 6 weeks either. Don't think it's gonna happen, but I still have 4 bottles left so we'll see.

 

[thisisbeer]

Could you pop the top on a couple and add a high gravity yeast to it?

 

[ianmatth]

It already used high gravity yeast, plus I pitched enough active champagne yeast (which is high gravity yeast as well) for 5 gallons into 8 bottles. If that isn't going to carbonate it nothing is.

 

[thisisbeer]

The champagne yeast I don't think I'd as tough as the high gravity. I could be wrong. I was thinking it may benefit from some fresh yeast.

 

[brewski09]

What's your estimated ABV? There is a theoretical limit to solubility of co2 in alcohol solutions that is around 20%. Have you thought about diluting a bottle and seeing if it will carb up that way?

 

[ianmatth]

1.150 OG/1.012 FG, ~21% based on the Alternate formula and ~18% based on the Standard formula. I only have 4 bottles left so I'm not going to mess with them. If I do a similar recipe again, I'll probably just keep the OG 10-20 points lower and repitch some active WLP099 at bottling instead to see if that does the trick.

 

[thisisbeer]

Well, how does it taste?

 

[ianmatth]

It definitely tastes like an IPA, major fruity hop taste, but it has a syrupy sweet taste that I would say comes from all the attenuated sugar.

 

[nab911]

No method of force carbing?

 

[RachmaelBenApplebaum]

At that ABV you won't get much in the way of carbonation even with force carbonation, think champagne light fizzy numerous bubbles that disappear, and champagne is only about 12-13% usually. Ever put any though to toning this one down to about 13-15%? then it would be carb-able and you could have more to enjoy. Would still take a lot of time to carb, which would dull the hops, but could be good and carbonated.

 

[ianmatth]

I did another QIPA at ~18% using the Tap-A-Draft system. I added bottling sugar to start, and my Tap-A-Draft bottle had no carbonation after a week so I hit it up with a CO2 cartridge and let it sit for another week. It now has great carbonation, but tasted a little sweet. Most of the sweet taste is from attenuated sugar, but it's possible some is from unattenuated bottling sugar. I also have 4 12-oz bottles conditioning. I'm going to give my bottles a few more weeks to see how they end up, but if they don't have good carbonation I will probably just stick to force carbonating for any 15+% ABV beers from now on. I would say the Tap-A-Draft system can get it done. Properly carbonated 18% ABV beer.