12X16 building with a loft big enough?

[OHIOSTEVE]

Got everything enclosed today. we ended up pulling my truck in the yard and hooking a come along to it then to the corner of the building to pull it straight enough to get the side walls on. That went easy as pie. We got down to the last 3 boards ( back) and had to go get the neighbor who works on stuff like this all he time to come take a look at it. Even with his help we spent probably 3 hours putting up 3 boards and they still were not right due to the screwed up condition it was in. BUT everything is enclosed and now I can take my time and do a little at a time on the inside.

 

[OHIOSTEVE]

As you can see in these pics the building was leaned a lot. We pulled my truck in front of it and hooked a come along from the truck to the building ( wish I had taken a pic of that) and pulled the side straight and then reattached the side walls.

This is the same wall I posted a pic of earlier that had the boards stair stepped.

 

[OHIOSTEVE]

Of the entire job, so far this was the biggest pain in the ass. The framing was way wrong and it was twisted so squaring it up was impossible.we did as much as we could with jacks and wedges and saws. And even with all of that the bottom right side was out about 4 inches while the bottom left was about 4 inches short. We got everythimng on and did some sawing and trimming and it looks ok now'

A couple of pics of my son screwing down the floor of the loft. everythimng we have done so far has been a series of screw ups and fixes. I know there are some boards we have nailed down and removed 5-6 time each. I learned from his that building something has to be easier than fixing something.

 

[OHIOSTEVE]

I have a friend who works where they manufacture steel tubing.. he just called me and told me they are running what I need to build a brew stand...So the metal for the brew stand is on its way!

 

[Rivenin]

Jealous! good job mandingo!

 

[jafo28]

Looks great!

 

[OHIOSTEVE]

I jut called for an estimate to do spray in foam insulation for a 6x8 cold room plus the floor and ceiling...$1200.00 NOT counting moisture barrier!! back to the drawing board.

 

[BrewMoreBeers]

sounds to me like the job was too small and they did not want to do it. where are you at in Ohio... i might have an idea.

 

[OHIOSTEVE]

sounds to me like the job was too small and they did not want to do it. where are you at in Ohio... i might have an idea.

I live in sidney. just north of dayton.

 

[BrewMoreBeers]

Check this out... http://www.tigerfoam.com/

I have a friend that works for the manufacturer. He thinks you probably only need about a 1"-2" layer of this for what you are doing. He also suggested putting the vapor barrier on the outside (the warm side) and making sure that you do not have any air leaks around the AC unit as this will let excessive moisture in. He also highly recommends you head the personal safety warnings and get a good respirator, gloves, eye protection and so on. You do not want to breath this stuff or get it on you.

 

[BrewMoreBeers]

we used some of this stuff to make coolers out of cardboard boxes for a recent cook out. it held ice for days.

 

[BrewMoreBeers]

he suggests the 600 foot fast rise kit for your application.

 

[bendavanza]

Steve
As you've probably figured out, the sheathing is what keeps the building square more than the 2x4's.

 

[OHIOSTEVE]

I have figured and refigured and mocked it up several ways and it seems the most practical way is to make a cool room ( 60 degrees) and set a chest freezer in there. i THINK I have found a 14 cu ft one that works well for 25 bucks. IF It works out the way I want it to, I will run taps from the freezer through the wall. I also think that a 60 degree room will have FAR less issues with moisture and will not need nearly as much insulation. I figure 6x8 will give me enough room for fermenting and the freezer. The freezer is big enough to accomodate the tapped kegs and maybe a lager if I decided to try that.

 

[Coldies]

So will you just cut a hole in the top of the freezer lid with a fan blowing the air out into the cold room? Is that the idea.

 

[jeepinjeepin]

I have figured and refigured and mocked it up several ways and it seems the most practical way is to make a cool room ( 60 degrees) and set a chest freezer in there. i THINK I have found a 14 cu ft one that works well for 25 bucks. IF It works out the way I want it to, I will run taps from the freezer through the wall. I also think that a 60 degree room will have FAR less issues with moisture and will not need nearly as much insulation. I figure 6x8 will give me enough room for fermenting and the freezer. The freezer is big enough to accomodate the tapped kegs and maybe a lager if I decided to try that.

Remember that freezers don't make cold air. They just take the heat and put it somewhere else. A freezer is cold on the inside but hot on the back or bottom. The laws of thermodynamics are pretty strict.

Do you have room to place the freezer outside of the cool room? If so, maybe you can build a collar on it and duct are into the cool room.

 

[OHIOSTEVE]

So will you just cut a hole in the top of the freezer lid with a fan blowing the air out into the cold room? Is that the idea.

no, completely seperate cooling system

 

[OHIOSTEVE]

Remember that freezers don't make cold air. They just take the heat and put it somewhere else. A freezer is cold on the inside but hot on the back or bottom. The laws of thermodynamics are pretty strict.

Do you have room to place the freezer outside of the cool room? If so, maybe you can build a collar on it and duct are into the cool room.

Yeah I know. You should see peoples faces when I tell me a refrigerator does not put cold in, it takes heat out. I figured with only wanting to maintain a 60 degree ambient temp, the heat exchange would not be a huge deal. However if you guys think it will be, I am sure that I could set it up to blow the heat from the back of the freezer out of the cool room somehow.However if I build it specifically to a particular freezer and ever have to replace it then I am screwed.

 

[OHIOSTEVE]

always a day late...on craigslit, 4' x 8' x 6" sheets of styrofoam insulation 20 bucks a sheet...already all gone.

 

[jeepinjeepin]

Yeah I know. You should see peoples faces when I tell me a refrigerator does not put cold in, it takes heat out. I figured with only wanting to maintain a 60 degree ambient temp, the heat exchange would not be a huge deal. However if you guys think it will be, I am sure that I could set it up to blow the heat from the back of the freezer out of the cool room somehow.However if I build it specifically to a particular freezer and ever have to replace it then I am screwed.

I think it will be an issue. When you factor in that the freezer is not 100% efficient and you are adding energy to the system via electricity and the heat that you take out of the room is put back into the room canceling itself out you should get a temperature rise.

 

[OHIOSTEVE]

I think it will be an issue. When you factor in that the freezer is not 100% efficient and you are adding energy to the system via electricity and the heat that you take out of the room is put back into the room canceling itself out you should get a temperature rise.

makes sense. there is PLENTY of room to have the freezer outside the cool room. plus i would then be able to make the room smaller. seriously who need a 6x8 ferment chamber anyway......aaaagggghhhh. tis is giving me a headache

 

[OHIOSTEVE]

ok another question..I picked up a chest freezer today so no need to get the room that cold.just need it for fermenting and bottle conditioning /long term storage.. anyway if I am only trying to maintain 60 degrees, how much of an issue will fiberglass insulation be? I know the moisture is an issue trying to maintain cold room temps and foamboard is the way to go....but then again in the winter time it gets COLD here and I will have to heat the room......

 

[LarryC]

I found this thread a little late to be asking this question but I will anyway. In a few of your pictures it looks like there is some serious black mold on the roof sheeting. Besides being unhealthy for humans, I am guessing it could be unhealthy for beer as well. Maybe before you insulate, you should get some mold killer on that?

 

[OHIOSTEVE]

I found this thread a little late to be asking this question but I will anyway. In a few of your pictures it looks like there is some serious black mold on the roof sheeting. Besides being unhealthy for humans, I am guessing it could be unhealthy for beer as well. Maybe before you insulate, you should get some mold killer on that?

it isn't mold...some sort of spray (paint or sealer or something) I thought thesame thing when i first saw it.

 

[LarryC]

it isn't mold...some sort of spray (paint or sealer or something) I thought thesame thing when i first saw it.

That's good to hear - so now I am officially jealous

By the way, I grew up in Cuyahoga Falls and although I love where I live now, I sure could go for a big yard with trees and green grass like you have!

 

[OHIOSTEVE]

That's good to hear - so now I am officially jealous

By the way, I grew up in Cuyahoga Falls and although I love where I live now, I sure could go for a big yard with trees and green grass like you have!

tell ya what..get back to me this dec-jan,,,we can switch houses for a couple months lol.

 

[LarryC]

tell ya what..get back to me this dec-jan,,,we can switch houses for a couple months lol.

That would be a part I don't miss!

Have a great 4th of July

 

[OHIOSTEVE]

OK, the building has been put on hold for quite a while due to a crash in the local economy ( or at least in my house) I was given some 2x4's and R13 insulation from my son who over bought for a project on his house so the cool room is framed and since I am only shooting for 60 degree temps I will use the R13 on the walls, and double it for the ceiling ( 2x6 studs) And probably spray foam the floor.... The room is 4'x4' BEFORE putting the interior walls on and probably 7 feet tall so I can put a shelf in for more space. I figure a small AC unit will keep it in the low 60's fairly easily. And this winter a small electric heatr with a fan should be able to maintain 60+ degrees easily enough also.

 

[OHIOSTEVE]

This has been a slow slow process. everything in the world has kept me from doing anything else to the shed. Over the last two days we have gotten the walls inside and out on the ferment room. I built and hung the door frames today and hopefully will insulate then ( double doors kinda like french doors) cover them tomorrow. drop in a digitally controlled small heater and I am good to go for the rest of the winter. I took some carboys out today to just see how many I can fit in the room.. looks like I can get nine 6.5 gallon ones just on the floor before I put any shelves in so I am happy right now.