100% homegrown

[COLObrewer]

Awesome, I love to see others that like to do it ALL from scratch. I will be following this thread although I wish there were a better section to place it in. I have stated before and suggested that there be a seperate malt or malting section on HBT but it has yet to happen. I mean if it weren't for malt alot of this other stuff would be mute (Or at least alot different).

I would question your earlier statement that malting is easier than brewing however, I suppose it depends on what quality of malt you want to end up with.

Your planting method looks different (more tedious) than I've seen for any grain type product but to each his own, we use what we have right. I would have just broadcast with the same spreader you used for fertilizer or simply hand broadcast for that small of plot.

Good luck and keep us posted, the pictures are always helpful.

Brew on my friend

 

[drummstikk]

I have stated before and suggested that there be a seperate malt or malting section on HBT but it has yet to happen.

I also found it a little surprising! I guess fewer people grow barley or malt at home right now. Hopefully more people get into it in the future.

I would question your earlier statement that malting is easier than brewing however, I suppose it depends on what quality of malt you want to end up with.

It's not hard to make very high quality malt at home.

Yes, it took some time and several batches of crappy malt, but I worked out the following procedure: soak grains to > 40% moisture, measured by weighing, then drain well using a grain bag. Then pour 4-5" deep into plastic bins in a chest freezer set to 51F. This keeps the malt close to 16C where it should be. Mix daily and spray with water if grains begin to dry before malting is finished. You can also just spread out a tarp on your basement floor and spray with water every day. Even if the malt goes over 16C, it will still make decent quality. Quality drops as temperatures climb over 25C, because the malting becomes uneven, and if moisture precipitates on the grains, you can get fungal growth.

Do a low temperature rest (40, 50, or 60C, depending on the type of malt) before kilning using your mash tun and a fermwrap heater + temperature controller. Commercial Pilsner malt is dried at 40C, Munich malt undergoes a wet 50C rest before kilining, and crystal malts undergo a wet 60-70C rest. It will be hard to get up to 70C using the fermwrap, so I just hit 60C and do a long rest. You don't need to dry with heat like the pros do, since you're not really concerned with the throughput of your malthouse. Just do the low temp rest for 3-4 hours, then dry with a box fan at room temp for 2-3 days.

For the kilning stage, I'm lucky that my gas oven can achieve the temps (80-120C) required. It might be difficult if I didn't have the right oven.

Remove rootlets after kilning by placing malt in a tied pillowcase and running in the dryer with no heat for 10 minutes. Pour malt in front of a fan outside to blow rootlets away.

I haven't noticed that the quality of the beer I make with my malt is any less than what I can make from commercial malt.

The big exception is roasted malts, which really require a roaster to get right. I would have to play around with a coffee roaster -- I only know that it's very hard to get a consistent result with aluminum foil and a propane burner!

 

[drummstikk]

COLO,
I just read your thread about malting at home -- time to insert my foot in mouth! I see you know exactly what you're doing when it comes to malting, and I could probably learn a thing or two from you.

Anyway, for higher throughput, like the 50 lb you started with, I agree that malting is not easy. But it would not be easy to brew 40 gallons of beer in a single batch either. You'll need lots of equipment.

I have only had an easy time with smaller batches of 15 lbs of malt. Enough for a single 5 gal batch of beer.

 

[drummstikk]

Your planting method looks different (more tedious) than I've seen for any grain type product but to each his own, we use what we have right. I would have just broadcast with the same spreader you used for fertilizer or simply hand broadcast for that small of plot.

Good luck and keep us posted, the pictures are always helpful.

Brew on my friend

Thanks for the encouragement! Good to know I'm not the only crazy person trying to do it all at home!

A lot of people seem to have a problem with the rows. But making them didn't take much time or effort (one hour with a seeder), and they allow me to walk through the field to weed, fertilize, and do things I didn't even expect, like put up netting. You can still walk through a broadcast field, but you crush plants under your boots.

Maybe the question is more about why I would want to bother with increasing my yield in the first place? Well, that's because I don't have a big plot. If I had a big space, like a half acre or more, I could afford to broadcast and take a hit to weeds and predators. I'd still get plenty of grain.

But if you have a small space like I do, you really want to get the most out of it. It's essentially a large garden, and I've been trying to give it the attention a gardener would give their vegetable crop. With a small plot, I think you want to spend more time, not less, bothering with potentially tedious stuff like weeding.

But again, making the rows themselves took one hour with an Earthway seeder -- not too tedious.

COLO, did you ever make malt from the barley you planted in your thread? And did you ever make try making roasted malts at home?

 

[COLObrewer]

. . . . . . COLO, did you ever make malt from the barley you planted in your thread? And did you ever make try making roasted malts at home?

I only grew a couple of plants to determine variety so no I haven't malted anything I grew myself.

The roasting is on page 12 of the hapiness thread.

Keep on malting my friend

 

[drummstikk]

Awesome! So it looks like you used a normal electric oven, but you placed it outside and and turned the malt frequently by hand. Is that right?

It sounds like the smoke is the biggest thing keeping me from doing this in my plain old oven.

 

[COLObrewer]

Awesome! So it looks like you used a normal electric oven, but you placed it outside and and turned the malt frequently by hand. Is that right?

It sounds like the smoke is the biggest thing keeping me from doing this in my plain old oven.

Correct on all accounts, it is an old oven that stays outside by the shed, works great. If I ever get my "all-in-one" malt rig set up I will be able to do the roasting in it as it slowly rotates.

 

[drummstikk]

I don't think the predation is happening any more. Every plant I see that has been chomped has damage to the first and second leaves, but the second leaf is always longer.

In normal plant growth, the first leaf grows quickly, then slows down as the second leaf grows. So either the predators always eat the first leaf down further (unlikely), or all this chomping happened in the past.

If the predation were still occuring, I would expect to see some plants with both leaves eaten down to the same extent, and I don't. That's good news!

I still don't know what caused it, so I'll leave the netting up for now.



Most of the Conlon in the middle plot, which was seeded at 2x density and is in partial shade, is at the 2-3 leaf stage:

But in the lower plot, which has 1 x Conlon density and far more sunshine, some plants are farther along,

like this guy that has three leaves, a coleoptillar tiller, a leaf-1 tiller, and what may be the prophyll of a leaf-2 tiller.

Overall, the plants are taller than they were last week

but growth seems to be happening slowly. It is December after all, so you can expect growth to be slow. But how do you know if growth is slow because of the temps, or if there's another, more fixable cause?

There is a heuristic that farmers use to evaluate and predict the growth of crops called Growth Degree Days. GDD is just the time-integral of temperature, and not surprisingly, it has units of Degree*Day. It's usually expressed in Fahrenheit in the States, and it's calculated by taking the average of the high and low temperatures for a day, subtracting a baseline temp (usually 5.5C or 40F for barley), then summing up the adjusted mean for each day in a period.

For example, the GDD for barley yesterday in Palo Alto was (60F + 42F)/2 - 40F = 11, and for the past two days the GDD was 11 + (55F + 32F)/2 - 40 = 14.5

In practice, just use this calculator to make things easy.

All other things being equal, GDD is roughly proportional to the developmental progress of plants. So you can compare the progress of plants grown in different climates and at different times of year by checking how far along they are with respect to their GDD. If they're behind where they should be, this helps you identify water, disease, or nutrient stress.

I can compare my progress to Merit, another malting barley variety. Merit had 2 leaves at 177 GDD since emergence, and 3 leaves plus tillers at 277.5 GDD. I'm not really sure when my plants emerged since it happened over the Thanksgiving weekend, so I'll say it was Dec 1, the first day I saw them above ground. Then, I've had 168 GDD since emergence.

It has taken me 3 weeks for the slower Conlon plants in the middle plot to match the progress that Merit made in 9 days, but my GDD (168) is about the same as Merit's GDD (177) at the 2 leaf stage. The Conlon in the sunnier lower plot and the bere seem to be closer to the stage Merit achieved after 277 GDD.

So even though the plants are growing slowly, they're well on track given the cold temperatures we've had. At least it isn't frosting hard at night!

 

[drummstikk]

Oops, it turns out that when calculating GDD, temperatures below the baseline do not count as negative GDD. Any temps below 40F are just set to 40F. In the example I gave, the GDD for the past 2 days should be 11 + (55F + 40F)/2 - 40F = 18.5

 

[wardenwheat]

That small damage shouldn't do much to decrease yeild with such a young plant. It appears to be insect damage. If it were eaten off completely, then you may have some problems.

Nothing against rows, but ceral grains really aren't grown that way. Think of barley as grass. If you had a yard with grass in rows, you would have tons of weeds inbetween them. By broadcasting or drilling the barley in high population, you could grow multiple times more in a very small plot. This also controls weeds by shading and discourages pest damage, but I admir your efforts. The seedlings look excellent.

P.S. if I could figure out how to post pictures on BN. I would have put it there. Good Farming!

 

[drummstikk]

By broadcasting or drilling the barley in high population, you could grow multiple times more in a very small plot. This also controls weeds by shading and discourages pest damage, but I admir your efforts. The seedlings look excellent.

Thanks warden! I appreciate the kind words. I don't know anybody who's grown small grains before, so it's really important for me to get this feedback on HBT.

Don't drills plant seeds in rows? I was really just trying to copy the style of planting a drill would do. BTW, I have already given up on digging the hills and furrows next year -- that was a total waste of time. But I am confused as to why broadcasting might help with shading. I don't want to be a stubborn dick , but here me out:

Here's why I'm confused: for a given planting density (the same number of seeds per acre whether you're broadcasting or drilling in rows), crowding the seeds up into rows increases the local barley density when compared to broadcasting, and increases shading of weeds that grow right next to the barley plants. The weeds that grow between rows of barley are definitely less shaded when you plant in rows as compared to broadcasting, but it doesn't matter, because these weeds are easily destroyed by manual cultivation.

On the other hand, if I kept the seeding rate per acre constant but switched to broadcasting, then the same number of barley plants per acre would be spread out into a more uniform distribution, and the shading near each barley plant would decrease. I also wouldn't be able to remove any weeds by cultivation.

If this is wrong -- what part of the reasoning is incorrect? Thanks for any help y'all can provide, and thanks again for the kind words!

 

[wardenwheat]

Ok I skimmed the earlier posts, but I think you planted around 40 - 50 lbs per acre? Figuring on about 10,000 seeds per acre for the 2 row planted would be around ~ 130 lbs per acre. You have approximately .065 of an acre. So your seeding rate should be around 8.5 lbs per your 3,000 sq ft plot.

If you plant that in rows, your plants will compete for available nutrients with each other planted at that density. If you plant less dense, you aren't maximizing your yeild. Broadcasting or drilling will spread out the seeds and allow for more room per plant per acre and shade and outcompete weeds. By cutting the rate in half all you do is create half the potentional and 3 times the work. If you want to weed everything in rows, more power to you, but you'll get more production and less work by broadcasting or drilling.

 

[wardenwheat]

It's basically this:














Vs this:

 

[drummstikk]

So, when you say drilling, does that imply narrower rows? Like maybe 6 or 7.5 inches? If so, I think I get what you're saying now. I want to try your recommendations (130 lb/acre seed, no weeding) next year.

When I was planning back in November, I saw the rate of 130 lb / acre that you recomend, but I also saw that the seed distributor recommended 85 lb / acre. I wasn't sure which one was correct, and I went with lower rates for a few reasons:

The field manager warned me about the weed seeds in the field, so I wanted to be able to walk through and cultivate by hand. I also wanted to be able to walk through to apply pesticide and fungicide if required. I chose 14" rows based on research done in wheat at Ohio State, indicating that yield only drops 5-15% when you plant 15" rows at 25 seeds / foot, compared to 7.5" rows at the same linear seeding rate (twice the lb / acre). I thought that I might easily loose more than 5-15% to hardy weeds, and that the wider rows would be worth it. I also assumed that barley would behave similarly to wheat. I didn't want to exceed the linear seeding rate in the study, to avoid the competition you mentioned. 14" rows at 25 seeds / foot equals 94 lb / acre, assuming 10,000 seeds / lb, a typical value for Conlon.

So, I planted 1/3 of my field (the middle plot) at 24 seeds / foot, or 90 lb / acre. (This was the seeding rate that two passes down each row with my Earthway seeder gave.) I chose to plant the other 2/3 at 45 lb / acre (12 seeds / foot, or one pass with the Earthway) because light is limited by nearby trees. I was concerned that if I asked my shady field to perform at the high seeding rates recommended for open plains, I might actually reduce yield. I don't know if that assumption is true for barley or not -- what do you think? The same NDSU article as above states that planting Conlon at 50 lb / acre only decreases yield by 15% (not 50% or more), because of increased tillering at the lower density. To me, this justified the lower planting rate --I would be sure not to exceed the intrinsic yield of the shady field, but if I undershoot the optimal rate, tillering will still get me within 15% of the maximum yield. Anyway, If the crop works, I will separate the harvest from the two seeding rates and compare yields.

If I guessed wrong on all my assumptions, I'll only lose 15% yield due to underseeding and another 15% due to the worst-case losses with 14" rows, or 28% all together. At the time I planted, I figured that weeds and overseeding might easily decrease yield by more than 28%.

Your recommendation might still be the way to go. I'll try it next year and compare results -- I wish I had talked to you back in November!

 

[wardenwheat]

Yes it will be interesting to see how it works. How do you plan on harvesting, thershing, winnowing, etc.

 

[drummstikk]

Harvesting may have to be done by hand. I wish I had access to a scythe, or at least a sickle. Knives may work in a pinch.

The field manager generously volunteered the use of a thresher, and I think it does winnowing as well. If not, I can winnow the old-fashioned way with a stiff breeze.

 

[fifelee]

If we were a bit closer I could get your field harvested in a few second.
I raise mostly winter wheat, but barley prices are good enough I may get back into it next year. Skimming the thread I think most of your questions have been answered, but ill help however I can.

I do think your weeds will be a problem, if you are worried about a yield hit. Once your crop canopies then the shade will prevent further weeds, but from what I see you have plenty now. If you aren't against herbicide then try a little 24D in an test area. I think the plants need to be tillering before application. It will only take a day to see results. I bet it will get your weeds.

 

[drummstikk]

Farm porn!!!!!1 I love it. Fife, I'm not even sure if your combine would fit on my field...

So 24D sounds really great -- it will kill dicots but leave my grasses alone. I had never heard of that until now. Some of the barley are tillering now, but I bet more will be soon. I'll go ahead and purchase some 24D.

How about safety when you apply it? Do you wear gloves and long sleeves? How about goggles and a face mask -- are those necessary? I have access to a pressurized spray machine -- basically a backpack with a battery-powered pump and an applicator wand. Do you think that will be a safe way to apply?

 

[fifelee]

Farm porn!!!!!1 I love it. Fife, I'm not even sure if your combine would fit on my field...

So 24D sounds really great -- it will kill dicots but leave my grasses alone. I had never heard of that until now. Some of the barley are tillering now, but I bet more will be soon. I'll go ahead and purchase some 24D.

How about safety when you apply it? Do you wear gloves and long sleeves? How about goggles and a face mask -- are those necessary? I have access to a pressurized spray machine -- basically a backpack with a battery-powered pump and an applicator wand. Do you think that will be a safe way to apply?

Hummm. I believe 2-4D is the main ingredient in Weed-B-Gon so threat it as you would spray your yard. I am bad and will likely soon die of cancer as i don't wear as much protection as I should. When I spray ditches and other areas with my ATV I just try to always turn into the wind. I use just gloves when mixing. Doing it on foot will suck and you will likely get a lot on you, so as much protection that makes you feel comfortable is what you should do. Those Tyvek suits only cost a few dollars. That said I generally think the fears of herbicide are over blown. Everyone I know likely see 10,000% more chemical then the average Joe and my kids only have one extra arm.

I'm 99% sure you are fine, but I would hate for some obscure issue to cause harm to your crop on my recommendation. So read the label and maybe even do a test area at double rate. If it will work you will see whatever will die start to curl up in a day or so (likely a few hours).

 

[fifelee]

Any more 24D is kind of a generic term for a family of herbicides like 2,4D-LV6 and E-99. The best deal may be called something else. We use E-99 as it does a bit better job and doesn't smell as bad.
AgriSolutions - Herbicides

 

[fifelee]

Here is a pic from some of the last barley we raised a few years ago. This is what 300,000 bottles of beer look like.

 

[drummstikk]

I may need some alone time with those photos, Fife...

Well, thanks for the great advice -- I picked up some Lawn Weed Killer from Orchard Supply -- it's a mixture of 2,4-D, mecoprop, and dicamba, all herbicides that target dicots and spare the grasses. I sprayed a test strip yesterday after the irrigation system did its job.

It definitely didn't harm the barley, but I can't say it affected the weeds either. I think here's why: all those herbicides rely on plant growth to work, and it only got up to 59F today. Highs in the upper 50's through the weekend too. Hmm, I hope it remains in the soil long enough for the weeds to do some growth and die.

Like Fife pointed out, most manufacturers advise waiting until plants are tillering before applying herbicides, so I just put it on the sunniest plot, where the plants started tillering in earnest last week.

Tomorrow, I'm going home to Colorado for a week to see the folks. (They have an acre out back that's lying fallow. What a shame!)

Happy holidays everybody!

 

[bottlebomber]

Subscribed. Guaranteed you'll have more success than this kid.

 

[wardenwheat]

2-4D takes a little time to work. It isn't like roundup in hot sun. They wilt slowly and eventually die. I'm not sure what the other two ingredients are. I used some 2-4D ester for broadleaf control once, but after it started shading, I had very little weeds.

 

[fifelee]

Wow. I've had the opposite experience. Roundup takes days to see results. With 24d we see leaf curling in hours. We also spray in 50 deg weather alot. Was it a hand squeeze sprayer? I have had much luck with those as they have a really coarse mist. The finer mist The better as long as it isn't so fine the wind takes it away.

 

[B-Hoppy]

2,4-D, mecoprop, and dicamba This combination is a very common '3-way' type of broadleaf herbicide and has a very broad spectrum of weeds that it'll knock out. Soil temp and air temp are two different things. (50F in the Summer/ 50F in the Spring etc.) Most of the weeds you are seeing at this time are probably Winter annuals and have already germinated, but are not growing too vigorously. That's what they do. If they're not growing too vigorously the herbicide will take longer to be absorbed into the plant and you won't see the immediate 'curling' response like if you had treated earlier in the season. If you know that you applied the product at the proper rate, put the sprayer away until next Spring. Whatever didn't get controlled can be retreated at that time. Merry Christmas!!

 

[drummstikk]

Vegetative growth is coming along! But, the lawn weed killer didn't really work

probably because the weather has been too cold.

Caterpillar/squirrels are still at work:

although the fraction of plants affected is tiny, and I'm not putting up any more netting.

Most Conlon and Bere plants have multiple tillers, which is very nice to see.

Here's how the numbering system works: Single digits are the leaves of the main shoot. So "4" = leaf 4 of the primary plant. T indicates tillers, the first number after T indicates which tiller, and the number after the dash is the leaf number within the tiller. So T0-2 is the second leaf of the coleoptillar tiller, and T1-1 is the first leaf of the tiller that emerged from the axil (the armpit) of the first primary leaf. P indicates prophyll, and the number indicates the tiller the prophyll belongs to.

The previous image is of the slower Conlon plants (seeded at 24 seeds/ft), while this image is of the less-densely-seeded Conlon (12 seeds/ft)

The less-dense Conlon is still one leaf ahead (5 vs 4 fully-developed leaves), and the T1 and T2 tillers are each one leaf ahead as well! It's pretty interesting how the development is happening like clockwork.

The slower Conlon is at the same stage Merit was at 360 GDD. There have been 306 Growing Degree Days since December 1st, so I'm on track, if not slightly ahead.

The less-dense Conlon is one leaf ahead -- it's at the same stage that Merit was after 434 GDD! It's hard to know if seeding density is causing the difference in developmental rate, because the less-densely-seeded plot also gets more sunlight. Suffice to say that the same seeds planted at the same time can be hundreds of GDD apart from each other in development due to differences in environment.

Tillers can be aborted, and I don't want to count my heads before they hatch. But each tiller that forms is one more potential head of grain, so keep 'em coming!

Anybody else have 2,4-D, mecoprop, or dicamba fail to work in cold weather? (below 50F)

 

[drummstikk]

Lots of damage from predation now! About every other plant has at least one leaf clipped, and some have every leaf clipped!

I was wondering again what could be causing it, when yesterday I saw the farm's flock of guinea fowl walking through the field and pecking at the leaves. Sure enough, they were ripping off the leaf tops!

Not sure what to do. I could net the whole field, but the barley will soon begin to elongate, growing up above the net height.

Thinking of putting a fence around the perimeter -- the guineas can easily fly over anything up to 20-30 feet, but it may deter them, especially if I attach some sort of metal (pie pans?) at intervals that will blow in the breeze and make noise. There is plenty more field with a cover crop for them to peck at -- all I need to do is make my field the least attractive of their options.

The only upside to this is that with the guineas around, I can relax a bit about aphids carrying yellow dwarf virus. Those birds should devour insects.

*

403 GDD so far, and the plants are at 5-6 leaves with 2-3 tillers typical. Still right on / slightly ahead of Merit's schedule. U Idaho blog states that now is the time maximum kernel number will be determined for the main shoot in the 5-leaf plants, and in the tillers for the 6-leaf plants. I hope the predation doesn't affect the plants' decision negatively.

 

[markmc40]

I read this whole thread and I'm very impressed by the time and labor you've put into this. I thought staring at my primary for a month and not touching it was patience!

 

[SenorPepe]

I love reading these updates. Thanks for documenting.