The GaP (Grocery and Produce) Beer Experiment

Tenchiro · Jun 16, 2008

Using items only found in your local grocery/produce store, attempt to craft as drinkable of a beer as possible. Ciders, wines and mead do not count. Otherwise you are free to use any ingredient you find in the store.

Keep a detailed log to post here along with pics, tasting notes, etc. If people are up for an exchange after everything is said and done we can do that too.

:mug:

Freezeblade · Jun 16, 2008

Ok, so this interests me quite a bit and I'd like some clarification on some rules. First and foremost, what kinda local grocery store are we talking here, I live in a pretty ethnic neighborhood, and they will have stuff that wouldn't be in a normal store, so are we keeping to like Albertsons, Ralphs, Vons, etc? Number two, is it ok to get a beer that has live sediment and get the yeast there and cultivate it into a starter? and three, how strict is the "no juices or honey" thing? are we saying like 50% of the fermentables need to come from grain? what are the exact rules here?

Bob · Jun 16, 2008

Here's a recipe you could try. I made it - once. Definitely an acquired taste.

George Washington's porter recipe:

To Make Small Beer:

Take a large Siffer [Sifter] full of Bran Hops to your Taste.

Boil these 3 hours then strain out 30 Gall[ons] into a cooler put in 3 Gall[ons] Molasses while the Beer is Scalding hot or rather draw the Melasses into the cooler & St[r]ain the Beer on it while boiling Hot.

Let this stand till it is little more than Blood warm then put in a quart of Yeat if the Weather is very Cold cover it over with a Blank[et] & let it Work in the Cooler 24 hours then put it into the Cask - leave the bung open till it is almost don[e] Working - Bottle it that day Week it was Brewed.

The problem here is hops. You can get hops pellets in the more well-stocked organics sections of some stores, or in some health food stores. Otherwise, it'd have to be a selection of some other bittering herb.

Sounds like fun!

(Just don't make me drink any of Washington's Molasses Porter. Yich!)

Bob

Tenchiro · Jun 16, 2008

Freezeblade said:
Ok, so this interests me quite a bit and I'd like some clarification on some rules. First and foremost, what kinda local grocery store are we talking here, I live in a pretty ethnic neighborhood, and they will have stuff that wouldn't be in a normal store, so are we keeping to like Albertsons, Ralphs, Vons, etc? Number two, is it ok to get a beer that has live sediment and get the yeast there and cultivate it into a starter? and three, how strict is the "no juices or honey" thing? are we saying like 50% of the fermentables need to come from grain? what are the exact rules here?

I would think juice is ok as long as you are not making just straight up cider or wine. You could also harvest yeast from a beer, as long as you used something from the grocery store to culture it.

Although in RI you can't get beer from the Grocery store so some people would be at a disadvantage there.

effigyoffaith · Jun 16, 2008

In my grocery store they sell bags of whole wheat berries. They are in the 'middle eastern' ethnic food section. These can be malted. I've done that before. You could then mash other starch adjuncts: oatmeal, sweet potatoes, pearl barley, pumpkin...
As far as bittering. I think I'd use chocolate, coffee, or maybe just use citrus and ginger and skip the bittering.
What about using an off the self IPA to bitter a smaller beer?

Arneba28 · Jun 16, 2008

Ok Rules Post!!
#1 Anything from the grocery store can be used
#2 Juice can only be used if its in conjunction with other ingredients, No meads, ciders or wines.
#3 Yeast, Harvesting from a bottle is ok but you have to step it up using things from the store, no dme or dextrose in a starter.
#4 No hops, Alternative bittering agents should be used.!

Come on people lets see some cereal mashing. maybe some vegetable beers?

effigyoffaith · Jun 16, 2008

Using hops is too much of a cheat for me. I think that alternative bittering should be required.

Arneba28 · Jun 16, 2008

ok ill edit. No Hops

Glibbidy · Jun 16, 2008

One of our local supermarkets sell LME in the baking section.
There is even a coop that I know of that sell brewing supplies along with the groceries.:rockin:

k1v1116 · Jun 16, 2008

whatever you do dont use wormwood for bittering, I tried that once and it tastes like cough syrup. In some asian stores you can get the mold that converts rice starch into sugar for rice wine, is this cheating?

Arneba28 · Jun 16, 2008

Damn you people. How about we put this bluntly. If it says malt, dont use it. ok to use malted milk balls, powdered malted milk etc etc Just not LME or DME

Arneba28 · Jun 16, 2008

Sure that is cheating. Major grocery, no specialty asian or other grocers. Now if your store has an ethnic section like mine does then your ok to use it.

Tenchiro. Official Rules Post Needed I think

Revvy · Jun 16, 2008

If you can find malta goya at your grocery store (usually with the other mexican soda pop) a lot of people use that for yeast starters. (I didn't believe it til I googled it awhile back.)

Hmmm...rather than using it for a starter, I wonder if it could be used as a liguid base extract...Maybe boosted with bakers malt extract (like what was shown on the other thread) and maybe some treacle or Lyle's golden syrup....

Hmmm...maybe I will be in on this...(another use for the gathering dust Mr Beer Keg).

Arneba28 · Jun 16, 2008

Good idea revvy. I was just looking for that post about that.

Revvy · Jun 16, 2008

Arneba28 said:
Good idea revvy. I was just looking for that post about that.

If I recall from my reading last winter, it is lightly hopped...

I'll try to dig up the info....

I wonder how much it would take to boil it into a reduction? I never tried it, but I fugure if it's like soda pop it might already be pretty watery...

By the way...I don't know if anyone realizes it but the kind of "Malt" in malted milk or ovaltine is not the same as a malted barley.

From How to brew...

Brewer's malt is not Malted Milk Ba...ts, Toasted, Roasted and Chocolate Malts.....

Not that it wouldn't be worth trying ovaltine or malted milk balls, it may be nice as a chololate porter or stout base...

Revvy · Jun 16, 2008

Here's the info right from Goya Foods.

Malta
Malta Goya - A rich, non-alcoholic, nutritious soft drink, brewed from the finest barley and hops. Both regular and light are available in a wide assortment of sizes.
• Malta Regular
• Malta Light

Some info from the wikipedia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malta_(soft_drink)

Arneba28 · Jun 16, 2008

Revvy said:
By the way...I don't know if anyone realizes it but the kind of "Malt" in malted milk or ovaltine is not the same as a malted barley.

Not that it wouldn't be worth trying ovaltine or malted milk balls, it may be nice as a chololate porter or stout base...

Yeah I realized that but I dont know that everyone else has.
I would bet that Goya malta has a gravity like 1.012 maybe a little lighter then that. That would be a hell of a reduction to have to make to get that into a range that would actually produce some alcohol

Revvy · Jun 16, 2008

Arneba28 said:
Yeah I realized that but I dont know that everyone else has.
I would bet that Goya malta has a gravity like 1.012 maybe a little lighter then that. That would be a hell of a reduction to have to make to get that into a range that would actually produce some alcohol

I've seen different specific gravities of Malta Goya on different brewing websites...

THis one says;

The drink is a sanitary malt beverage that holds a gravity of about 1.075. I dillute it with distilled water at the rate of 1 12oz bottle to 1 cup of distilled water. This provides you with a starter wort of a 1.040 gravity.

Now I've read elsewhere that it is 1.040...I think the discrepency in gravities is perhaps becasue people don't decant it and let the bubbles die away before they take a reading...

What I can't find anywhere is what the IBU's are...Goya says it is hopped... Probably like 1 or 2 ibus..

Spames · Jun 16, 2008

Wheaties and whole corn meal mash!!! Sounds like fun-

Arneba28 · Jun 16, 2008

Really? That heavy of a gravity wow! even at 1.040 you could possibly just use that although that would completely defeat the purpose of this little experiment.

Tenchiro · Jun 16, 2008

I am still unsure of the base i want to use but I am thinking Candied Ginger, Lemon Grass and possibly Orange Peel for the spices.

Also I know you can buy Brewers Yeast in pill form in the vitamin aisle, but are there any live cells in those?

Revvy · Jun 16, 2008

Arneba28 said:
Really? That heavy of a gravity wow! even at 1.040 you could possibly just use that although that would completely defeat the purpose of this little experiment.

Yeah...I'm not talking necessarily about using that as the primary wort...But what about doing a sort of bastardized decoction mash of a dark, oat or barley based breakfast cereal?

Instead of water mashing with that?

Arneba28 · Jun 16, 2008

I was thinking along the same lines. Doing a decoction with the goya and whole barley. and water mashing some whole wheat from something.

Freezeblade · Jun 16, 2008

k1v1116 said:
whatever you do dont use wormwood for bittering, I tried that once and it tastes like cough syrup. In some asian stores you can get the mold that converts rice starch into sugar for rice wine, is this cheating?

I used wormwood in my current gruit ale I just bottled, as long as you don't add very much and use other bittering herbs as well it works quite well, it turned out more Yarrow flavored than wormwood, made the beer quite intoxicating from the sample I tried when bottling.

Redweasel · Jun 16, 2008

You could always make Pruno.

All kiding aside I'm thinking a wheat of some sort. I'm pretty sure there is flaked wheat in the health food section of my store. Could harvest some yeast from one of the hefes they sell. I'm going to have to think about this some more. Maybe orange peel with the pith for bittering.

Freezeblade · Jun 16, 2008

Goya sounds kinda like cheating if it's used for the primary barley ingrediant, I don't live in wheat country, so there's no whole barley (at least, not at my local market) Another question on the grocery stores, the closest one to me is this mexican market that's the size of your average supermarket, that has LOTS of strange odds and ends, I think I'll be poking around there quite a bit after finals are over (friday), seeing what whole grains are around that I can malt myself for the enzimes, then probably use malt-o-meal or some other grain cereals in a mash with the malted grains. Due to location I think there's going to be a lot of corn in my finished product.

I think the coolest thing about this project is that if everyone used what's locally grown or available you'd come up with beer that's quite regional, instead of everyone having similar recipe with widely available commercial products, each beer would reflect the geography and culture of each individual's brewing location.

Arneba28 · Jun 16, 2008

Freezeblade said:
I think the coolest thing about this project is that if everyone used what's locally grown or available you'd come up with beer that's quite regional, instead of everyone having similar recipe with widely available commercial products, each beer would reflect the geography and culture of each individual's brewing location.

Yes cool thought. My area has alot of wheat but we also have a large muslim population in the area and I was thinking about using cracked wheat, burghul(sp) however its very expensive so I dont know.

Revvy · Jun 16, 2008

I wonder if the yeast on the surface of the raisins in raisin bran would be enough to ferment a batch of beer? You could mash the cereal then add the raisins at ptiching time.

Freezeblade · Jun 16, 2008

Revvy said:
I wonder if the yeast on the surface of the raisins in raisin bran would be enough to ferment a batch of beer? You could mash the cereal then add the raisins at ptiching time.

That's an interesting though, what about (and this is kinda a long way to go about it) going to the produce section, grab a bunch of fruits, blend 'em up and let them ferment out in different small carboys with the yeasts on the peels. Decide which one's the best, wash the yeast at the bottom, then pitch it into whatever grain-based wort you're using for your final beer, with/without a starter.

Arneba28 · Jun 16, 2008

Freezeblade said:
That's an interesting though, what about (and this is kinda a long way to go about it) going to the produce section, grab a bunch of fruits, blend 'em up and let them ferment out in different small carboys with the yeasts on the peels. Decide which one's the best, wash the yeast at the bottom, then pitch it into whatever grain-based wort you're using for your final beer, with/without a starter.

That would take quite a while. Natural yeast sometimes can start slowly, and will take a while to drop to the bottom and clarify the must.

The GaP (Grocery and Produce) Beer Experiment

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