Please critique my pilsner (Czech-ish)

[Nubiwan]

Something I dug up from either a pilsner urquell recipe or a Grolsch clone. Anyway, would like comments on the IBU threshold I should aim for using all Hallertau or a combination of Hallertau and perhaps Columbus to bitter.

Grain Bill

11 lbs Pilsner
1 lb Munich
1 lb vienna

That's the grain I have. Can alter the percentages easy enough. Usually shoot for 6-6.5 gallons 5% +/- 0.2% ABV. Haven't really run grain bill through the calculators. Brew a fair bit by the seat of my pants.

Hops
Hallertau
or Bittering Hop plus Hallertau late additions.

Suggestions welcomed. What is a decent IBU to aim for for a pilsner? 20-30 range?

 

[BigEd]

You can get by brewing a lot of beers by the seat of your pants, I'm not sure a pilsner is one of them. Czech pils use Czech hops, Saaz in particular, and Urquell has IBUs of 40 or so. Hallertau will do just fine for a German or general Euro pils. Leave the Columbus hops in the freezer, they are just too heavy handed for this type of beer. If I had to guess I'd say Grolsch has IBUs in the 25-30 range. Keep the grain bill simple. Pilsner malt is all you need, a small percentage (3-5%) of Vienna is OK if you want the little something extra or you could use a low color caramel/crystal malt in the 10L range.

 

[Jag75]

I use Vienna in mine as well , no Munich though even though I use Munich a lot . Pils, Vienna & Carapils. As for the hops, you could go traditional route or you could experiment. That's the great thing about home brewing.

I brewed a pilsner with magnum and Rakau hops just to see . My next one will be with Motueka hops .

As far as ibu 20-30 is nice . My Pilsner is at 24.3. I don't really know how accurate it is but I think it's pretty close.

 

[Sammy86]

Suggestions welcomed. What is a decent IBU to aim for for a pilsner? 20-30 range?

Grain bill is good to go. IBU should be between 30-45 if staying within style guidelines. I always like going towards the top end of the hop spectrum for lagers.

 

[Steveruch]

Something I dug up from either a pilsner urquell recipe or a Grolsch clone. Anyway, would like comments on the IBU threshold I should aim for using all Hallertau or a combination of Hallertau and perhaps Columbus to bitter.

Grain Bill

11 lbs Pilsner
1 lb Munich
1 lb vienna

That's the grain I have. Can alter the percentages easy enough. Usually shoot for 6-6.5 gallons 5% +/- 0.2% ABV. Haven't really run grain bill through the calculators. Brew a fair bit by the seat of my pants.

Hops
Hallertau
or Bittering Hop plus Hallertau late additions.

Suggestions welcomed. What is a decent IBU to aim for for a pilsner? 20-30 range?

That's about 14% non pilsner malt and bordering on a festbier. When I make a Czech pilsner I use about 7% light munich and saaz hops, maybe bitter with sterling, close to 40 IBUs.

 

[Nubiwan]

That's about 14% non pilsner malt and bordering on a festbier. When I make a Czech pilsner I use about 7% light munich and saaz hops, maybe bitter with sterling, close to 40 IBUs.

I used saaz in my last effort and I personally think I overdid the bittering.

Perhaps it was my process. I kept notes, but they are sketchy. It is BIAB. I dump most of my trub in the fermenter. Will that contribute to further bittering. I don't use a hop sack, so it all ends up in the bucket.

It was a bit of a lip puckerer for a lager / pils. Don't mind a little help with the flavour, but not sure people overdo the hops at times. Or I got my process wrong.

 

[jdauria]

I like my Czech Pils to be more close to 100% Pils, last one I made which is lagering now was 98% Floor Malted Bohemian Pilsner and 2.0% Acidulated. And as others have mentioned, a Czech Pils should be Saaz, Saaz and more Saaz. Annie Johnson who won the Pilsner Urquell Master Homebrewer award in 2012 for her version uses 100% Pilsner malt and triple decoction.

Czech Pils should be 30-45 IBUs but is not has bitter as a German Pils. First Wort Hopping helps here.

 

[odie]

My current Czech Pils "Urquell" recipe…

6# pils
1# Vienna
0.5# munich
0.5# carafoam/carapils
Saaz hops: 1.3oz @ 80', 0.8os @ 45', 0.75oz @ 25'
34/70

comes in around 4% so I can drink more. The guys really drink this one up so I'm onto something...

 

[JohnDBrewer]

Grain bill I would lower the Vienna and Munich, add 2oz of acidulate and 4oz of carafoam. Go with Saaz and shoot for 35-40 ibu. Also use a bohemian yeast as I have found german lager yeasts dry it out a bit (lower FG). That being said the German yeast will make great beer just not. It's all about the water too, needs to be soft.

 

[Nubiwan]

My current Czech Pils "Urquell" recipe…

6# pils
1# Vienna
0.5# munich
0.5# carafoam/carapils
Saaz hops: 1.3oz @ 80', 0.8os @ 45', 0.75oz @ 25'
34/70

comes in around 4% so I can drink more. The guys really drink this one up so I'm onto something...

Pretty much what I have for grain and hops available - less the carafoam. I found a few packs of saaz lying around. I might flip a coin for Hallertau or saaz.

 

[Nubiwan]

Grain bill I would lower the Vienna and Munich, add 2oz of acidulate and 4oz of carafoam. Go with Saaz and shoot for 35-40 ibu. Also use a bohemian yeast as I have found german lager yeasts dry it out a bit (lower FG). That being said the German yeast will make great beer just not. It's all about the water too, needs to be soft.

My water is pretty much lifeless in terms of mineral content. Treated Pond/Lake water.

 

[Spivey24]

My current Czech Pils "Urquell" recipe…

6# pils
1# Vienna
0.5# munich
0.5# carafoam/carapils
Saaz hops: 1.3oz @ 80', 0.8os @ 45', 0.75oz @ 25'
34/70

comes in around 4% so I can drink more. The guys really drink this one up so I'm onto something...

what yeast are you using specifically? That’s pretty low on ABV. Any issue with body?

 

[odie]

what yeast are you using specifically? That’s pretty low on ABV. Any issue with body?

I prefer 34/70. I've used S-23. No body issues. A pils is not a heavy beer anyway.

Toss another pound of malt in if ya want more ABV.

 

[Beermeister32]

Perhaps it was my process. I kept notes, but they are sketchy. It is BIAB. I dump most of my trub in the fermenter. Will that contribute to further bittering.

With a Pilsner, you should try to separate as much trub from the fermenter as possible. Pilsners are one of the more unforgiving beers to make because of the light flavors. Any off flavors produced by excessive trub has nowhere to hide when making Pilsners.

Best way I have found to do this is to increase the batch size by one gallon. Run off the first 5.25 gallons of cleaner, cleaner wort into your fermenter.

Put the last gallon or so of kettle trub, sludge, grunge and generally gloppy schlop into a jug and ferment it separately for experiments or weird beer drinking! Yes it is a bit more bitter, but keeps your main batch cleaner. Also gives you cheapskates out there that final extra 5 bottles to drink. Prost!

 

[Oleson M.D.]

You can make an awesome Czech Lager with a single malt. We used Weyermann Floor Malted Bohemian Pilsner.
With Saaz hops. And the ever popular Diamond Lager yeast. And of course...very soft water.
This beer rivaled what we drank in Prague.

 

[dmtaylor]

I would ditch the Munich (just really not needed in a Pils!), and aim for 30 IBUs. I agree with recommendation for Diamond yeast, this strain is fantastic and completely fool-proof.

 

[Nubiwan]

You can make an awesome Czech Lager with a single malt. We used Weyermann Floor Malted Bohemian Pilsner.
With Saaz hops. And the ever popular Diamond Lager yeast. And of course...very soft water.
This beer rivaled what we drank in Prague.

Pretty sure the floor malted yeast is not available at my local Home Brew store, nor the diamond yeast. I will
"czech" for next time.

 

[Nubiwan]

With a Pilsner, you should try to separate as much trub from the fermenter as possible. Pilsners are one of the more unforgiving beers to make because of the light flavors. Any off flavors produced by excessive trub has nowhere to hide when making Pilsners.

Best way I have found to do this is to increase the batch size by one gallon. Run off the first 5.25 gallons of cleaner, cleaner wort into your fermenter.

Put the last gallon or so of kettle trub, sludge, grunge and generally gloppy schlop into a jug and ferment it separately for experiments or weird beer drinking! Yes it is a bit more bitter, but keeps your main batch cleaner. Also gives you cheapskates out there that final extra 5 bottles to drink. Prost!

View attachment 747700

This sounds like a good idea. Though I'd need to add more fermentable to accommodate the additional water. Yes? I am not particularly worried about lower ABV beer all the same.

And I wholly appreciate you grouping me among the cheapskates.

 

[Pablo 54]

In my opinion, your recipe looks like a nice variation on the style. Unless you have access to some trade secrets from the maltster, the simpler the recipe the better.

If you have all day, try the version outlined in the Weyermann article: Bohemian Floor Malt- The Origin of Pilsner Brewing. I have the PDF (1 page) and it is very informative. (9th TRENDS in BREWING Symposium, Ghent Ghent, 13 , 13–16 April, 2010) It's a triple decoction.

• Weyermann®Floor Malted Bohemian Pilsner 97%
• Weyermann® Acidulated Malt 2%
• Weyermann® Carabohemian® 1% (hard to source)

I've had great results using the recipe outlined by David Heath on his Homebrew channel (Czech Bohemian Pilsner Brewing Recipe Writing & Style Guide).

• Extra Pale Pilsner (89%)
• Munich 14 EBC (8%)
• Biscuit 50 EBC (3%)

However, I no longer use Biscuit. If I do a double decoction, I adjust the recipe to 95/5 Pilsner to Munich. If I don't do a decoction, just a step mash, I adjust to 89/8/3 Pilsner, Munich, Melanoidin. Depends on how much time I have on my hands.

Oleson, MD mentioned Diamond yeast. I've never used it but will give it a try on my next Pilsner brew day. I had been using Wyeast 2278 but changed to Imperial since my LBS seems to be out of Wyeast most times.

Water - Everyone says to use soft. FWIW, I do as well however I like to make sure my Ca is at 50 and then SO4 and Cl are balanced.

 

[madscientist451]

If you have 20 minutes or so, this podcast about brewing Czech lager is well worth your time:
https://podcasts.apple.com/dk/podca...what-ive-learned/id1548295138?i=1000525793756

 

[Pablo 54]

Just listened. I jotted some notes down in regards to the hops. I think I under bitter my hops almost all the time. I keep them vacuum sealed in my freezer but they still seem to be weak.
100% agree in regards to the ingredients. I would really love to know what the maltsters are doing for the Big Six in Munich and for the CZ breweries.

Thanks for the info. It was well worth the time. I won't be brewing a pilsner until February but I have a Munich Helles scheduled for mid-January. The malt bill is pretty close to a pilsner. I may sub out the Herkules and Mittelfueh and go with CZ Saaz.

 

[Beermeister32]

add more fermentable to accommodate the additional water. Yes? I am not particularly worried about lower ABV beer all the same.

And I wholly appreciate you grouping me among the cheapskates.

Yep, just scale the batch up to 6 gallons. Just joking on the cheapskates thing, I do it myself and is fun to play around with the overage.

 

[Beermeister32]

Is there an equivalent to the Diamond yeast? Is it derived from one of the usual suspects?

 

[dmtaylor]

Is there an equivalent to the Diamond yeast? Is it derived from one of the usual suspects?

I just did a blind tasting on a split batch against S-189.... and I honestly cannot taste the difference. Both had the same fermentation time, same attenuation and FG. So I really have to wonder if these are identical or very very closely related.

 

[ebbelwoi]

Is there an equivalent to the Diamond yeast? Is it derived from one of the usual suspects?

Andreas Krennmair says Diamond is WY2308. The Germans at hobbybrauer.de say Diamond is Doemens 308.