My braggot smells and tastes horrible!

[KorbinWaters94]

Hello everyone! I recently started a braggot. I started the batch on 11/16, and it burned through the fermentation insanely fast. I was degassing and adding nutrients after 48 hours (standard practice with mead) and noticed it felt a little warm. I checked the temp and it had jumped up to 81 degrees! I quickly got it in an ice bath and cooled it down to 68 degrees. Now the fermentation appears to be nearing completion (i don't have a gravity reading yet), but it has developed a horrible smell and flavor that I can only describe as overly bitter skunky hops. It is so unpleasant it nearly made me gag. Without getting into too much detail about my process, the only thing i could think that could have went wrong is some of the hops may have made it through the strainer into the brew bucket. I also chilled my wort with the hops still in it, but the smell didn't develop until day three of the ferment. Other than during the boil, it has not been exposed to light, but my kitchen does have flourescent light. This is my first forray into any type of beer making, and I'm worried that my batch isn't salvageable. Will this flavor dissipate? If not, what can I do to save it?

Below I have listed my recipe:

· 12 gal Spring Water

· 25 g Lavin ICV-K1-V1116 yeast

· 31.25 g GoFerm

· 10.55 g Fermaid O (66% reduction based on percentage of sugars from grain)

· ≈15 lb buckwheat honey (caramelized)

· 13.25 lb (6.01 kg) Belgian Pale Ale Malt

· 1.5 lb (0.68 kg) flaked oats

· 0.75 lb (340 g) roast barley

· 0.75 lb (340 g) chocolate malt

· 0.5 lb (227 g) black malt

· 0.5 lb (227 g) 120°L crystal malt

· 1.0 oz (28 g) Nugget pellet hops, 13% a.a. (60 min)

· 1.25 oz (35 g) Willamette pellet hops, 5% a.a. (25 min)

· 1.5 oz (42 g) unsweetened cocoa nibs (15 min)

· 2.5 oz (71 g) Belgian bittersweet chocolate (15 min)

· 1.75 oz (49 g) Willamette pellet hops, 5% a.a. (10 min)

· 2.0 oz (57 g) ground Sumatran coffee (flameout)

· 2.0 oz (57 g) cold brewed Kona coffee (secondary)

· 2 spirals medium toast American oak soaked in Bourbon (secondary)

 

[kh54s10]

What size batch was this for? How many gallons? That seems like an awful lot of fermentables unless making 10 gallons or more. 81 degrees could have done it, or an infection. I don't know your experience with meads, or how well they translate to beer but that is a pretty ambitious recipe for your first go.

The hops should not have caused any problem, there are often hops added to beers after fermentation has finished.

As I understand it, fluorescent light can skunk a beer. If in a bucket it should not have been an issue.

From the sounds of it, I doubt that it will dissipate, and is probably a goner.

 

[ancientmariner52]

Whether this lives or dies, I suggest you drop back and try something a lot smaller/simpler/cheaper. Learn to brew, then learn to brew fancy. I've been brewing for quite a time, and I cringed at that recipe. Waay to much goin' on there.

 

[KorbinWaters94]

What size batch was this for? How many gallons? That seems like an awful lot of fermentables unless making 10 gallons or more. 81 degrees could have done it, or an infection. I don't know your experience with meads, or how well they translate to beer but that is a pretty ambitious recipe for your first go.

The hops should not have caused any problem, there are often hops added to beers after fermentation has finished.

As I understand it, fluorescent light can skunk a beer. If in a bucket it should not have been an issue.

From the sounds of it, I doubt that it will dissipate, and is probably a goner.

This batch is a bit over 7 gallons. 1.13 is was the SG, and it's finished at 1.042 (higher than I planned), but I think the caramelized honey and high mash temp of the grain introduced more unfermentable sugar than was planned. I'm positive it isn't infected. There's no signs indicating so and I'm very meticulous about sanitation. Other than the temp being high I can't see where anything could have went wrong. I tasted it today and it seems to faded a bit, but is still overpowering.

 

[KorbinWaters94]

Whether this lives or dies, I suggest you drop back and try something a lot smaller/simpler/cheaper. Learn to brew, then learn to brew fancy. I've been brewing for quite a time, and I cringed at that recipe. Waay to much goin' on there.

I've been making mead for long enough to know what I'm doing, so I felt confident enough to pull off a braggot. The recipe is a recipe for an oatmeal stout. The only thing I added was nutrients and honey. So I don't think the recipe is the issue. Perhaps you have some idea as to what caused the overpowering hop aroma and flavor and a way to avoid it next time?

 

[kh54s10]

Another question is how long has it been. For a beer of 1.130, I would bulk age for at least a couple of months. If it is mellowing there may be hope. But I wouldn't expect it to come around for 6 months to a year after brew day.

If it is just hop flavor and aroma that is objectionable, that will likely fade.

 

[ancientmariner52]

Sorry, thought you said you were new to brewing beer. I've never done mead, so there.

The trouble, for me, is that there is so much happening here, it's hard to figure out. 18 ingredients, not counting the water. Could be an unexpected reaction between any two, three, or more. Too much for me.

 

[KorbinWaters94]

Another question is how long has it been. For a beer of 1.130, I would bulk age for at least a couple of months. If it is mellowing there may be hope. But I wouldn't expect it to come around for 6 months to a year after brew day.

If it is just hop flavor and aroma that is objectionable, that will likely fade.

It was started on November 16, so it hasn't been long. I do plan on aging it for sure, I just wanted to get a second opinion on how much the flavor would dissipate. If you can get past the bitter hoppy flavor, it actually tastes wonderful. Has a nice thick malty character. So hopefully it mellows out significantly.

 

[KorbinWaters94]

Sorry, thought you said you were new to brewing beer. I've never done mead, so there.

The trouble, for me, is that there is so much happening here, it's hard to figure out. 18 ingredients, not counting the water. Could be an unexpected reaction between any two, three, or more. Too much for me.

I suppose that's possible. Although since the recipe was only adapted to make it a mead, I would assume that the ingredients would be copisetic on at least the original recipe. Unless hops react negatively to honey or nutrients there must have been something else wrong. Bad hops perhaps?

 

[ancientmariner52]

You could be right. Probably best to just wait and see what happens.

 

[bernardsmith]

Problem could be that your buckwheat honey does not make a good bochet or it could be that the very high temperature could have stressed the yeast resulting in the production of mercaptans, hydrogen sulfide, fusels and other undesirable compounds.

 

[KorbinWaters94]

Problem could be that your buckwheat honey does not make a good bochet or it could be that the very high temperature could have stressed the yeast resulting in the production of mercaptans, hydrogen sulfide, fusels and other undesirable compounds.

Good points. The honey tasted delicious prior to fermentation, so I'm not sure that would be it. The high temp does worry me though. I couldn't really taste any fusels, but it's entirely possible I missed it. I've never heard of the other compounds you listed, do any of them match the flavor/scent profile that I'm getting?

 

[bernardsmith]

Mercaptans are often described as burnt matches and H2S smells like rotten eggs (or sewer gas). To get rid of the latter you might try whipping air into the mead (but given that this is a braggot that may cause problems) . To remove the former is harder. You want to try to get the sulfur to bind with copper so you might try racking through copper scrubbing wool. There is a compound designed for removing mercaptans. I think it's called Redules (sp?).

 

[mr_stout]

The recipe looks way too crazy. It is better to start out simple and make something you like before adding a lot of extra ingredients. If you dump this it you will have wasted a lot of money, right?
I have used buckwheat honey and I got a great braggot that is a pleasure to drink.
Try something like this...

For 5 gallons I use
6.6 lbs light DME extract
4 lbs honey
1 lb caramel 40
8 oz victory malt
1/2 tsp Diamonium Phosphate

And Hops

 

[Transamguy77]

With a gravity that high I wouldn’t even touch it for 6 months. I made some mead about 5 years ago and it had a gravity of just under 1.100 and it was drinkable after a few months but was decent at 6 months and great after a year.

I think you just have to put this one aside and let it sit a while.

 

[madscientist451]

Going out on a limb here because I'm not 100% sure of this, but using a wine yeast in beer is usually not recommended because wine yeast strains do not properly ferment maltose, which is the primary sugar component you get from mashing malted barley. That, combined with the high fermentation temperature, has produced some off flavors. With all the money you have wrapped up in ingredients, I'd try to salvage this brew. First, if you are in a cool climate, put the fermenter out in on the porch or in the garage and after a few days, rack the brew off to another fermenter. Basically you want to get the beer off the 1116 yeast. Then, get some DME and make up a 1/2 gallon of starter wort and put it into a 1 gallon jug.
Just google how to make starter wort and you can figure that part out.
Next, add a pack of US-05 beer yeast and let it sit out and ferment a few days. Give the jug a swirl every now and then when you have time to speed up the process. After 2-3 days, shake it up and pitch the whole thing into your existing brew. Try to keep the temperature about 68F. Hopefully, the beer yeast will take off, reduce your gravity and MAYBE eliminate some of the off flavors.
You can try to directly pitch the dry yeast into your brew, but it already has a large alcohol presence and I think you'll have some issues if you try that.
If you want to be more adventurous, a saison type ale yeast will ferment even lower, I like WL American Saison, because it has a "clean" saison flavor/aroma. There may be a dry saison yeast you can use as well.
Perhaps someone else can recommend a yeast that would be better than those I listed?

Edit: BYO magazine has an article on Braggots and they list many yeast choices that I hadn't thought of:

https://byo.com/hops/item/260-braggot-style-profile

 

[Curtis2010]

Deleted

 

[Curtis2010]

The recipe looks way too crazy. It is better to start out simple and make something you like before adding a lot of extra ingredients. If you dump this it you will have wasted a lot of money, right?
I have used buckwheat honey and I got a great braggot that is a pleasure to drink.
Try something like this...

For 5 gallons I use
6.6 lbs light DME extract
4 lbs honey
1 lb caramel 40
8 oz victory malt
1/2 tsp Diamonium Phosphate

And Hops

That was my first thought too...crazy number of ingredients. All my braggots have been very simple...and some were amazing (after a year or more of aging).

 

[Curtis2010]

Good points. The honey tasted delicious prior to fermentation, so I'm not sure that would be it. The high temp does worry me though. I couldn't really taste any fusels, but it's entirely possible I missed it. I've never heard of the other compounds you listed, do any of them match the flavor/scent profile that I'm getting?

My experiene with buckwheat honey was that it tastes awful post fermentation...sort of like what I imagine creosote would taste like.