How to stop hard cider for a sweeter cider

[NZBrewGuy]

Hey Guys,

Its been a few months and a few brews since my last post. Ive made a few Hard Ciders in the past few months and while they have come out heaps better than all my previous attempts they have been way to dry for my taste. My last batch I started quite high with a og of 1.058 , using apple juice and concentrate. According to my Rapt Pill this went down to 0.997. I am planning a new cider batch in the coming week, but would like some advise on how to stop my cider to get a sweeter taste.

I do not have a keg system/keezer up and running just yet but it is in the cards in the future. Any advise would be greatly appreciated.

Any questions around my setup is welcome.

 

[DBhomebrew]

Carbonated or still? Actually sweet or a perception of off-dry?

 

[NZBrewGuy]

Carbonated or still? Actually sweet or a perception of off-dry?

I carbonate it after fermenting if that is what you mean? andI am looking to hopefully stop it around 1.006-1.008 range, or get the taste of around that range

 

[DBhomebrew]

Yes. Carbonated and sweet is tough because you need the active yeast for carbonation, but don't want all the available sugars to ferment.

Pasteurization when carbed is one avenue. Non-fermentable sugars for backsweetening is another. Both have their risks/drawbacks.

Are you using a cider or wine yeast? If so, some ale yeasts can leave just enough sweetness. If you're just looking for off-dry not fully sweet, this is the path I'd try first.

 

[NZBrewGuy]

Thanks for the advice so far!

I am using ale yeast(coopers ale yeast) but I am happy to buy any yeast that would be better. I also add some yeast nutrition to help keep the fermentation healthy, and have it temp controlled during fermentation. With back sweetening it seemend like a lot of guessing and the other option is boiling the bottles once carbonated if my understanding is correct? Are these the only real options apart from force carbonationg with a keg?

 

[DBhomebrew]

Pretty much.

Backsweetening, and other things like acid adjustment, is more trial and error than guesswork. Work it out on a few ounces, scale up to the full batch kind of thing.

Someone else will come along and add details on pasteurization, it can be dangerous if not done correctly. There is a method or two outlined on the forum that is pretty straightforward. I've not tried it yet, but I can say it most definitely does not involve boiling!

 

[beren]

I've done pasteurization of bottles and a whole keg. It's not terribly hard, esp. if you have a sous vide cooker for perfect temp control. There are good directions here. a 3rd option is to bottle from a keg once you get one. Kill the yeast, backsweeten, overcarb a little then use a counterpressure filler (you can make one with a picnic tap, it works ok)``````````````````

 

[Steveruch]

Yes. Carbonated and sweet is tough because you need the active yeast for carbonation, but don't want all the available sugars to ferment.

Pasteurization when carbed is one avenue. Non-fermentable sugars for backsweetening is another. Both have their risks/drawbacks.

Are you using a cider or wine yeast? If so, some ale yeasts can leave just enough sweetness. If you're just looking for off-dry not fully sweet, this is the path I'd try first.

I just bottled my latest batch of cider. I fermented with Muntons and it finished at 1.000.

 

[DBhomebrew]

I just bottled my latest batch of cider. I fermented with Muntons and it finished at 1.000.

Okay... Munton's wouldn't help much. Tips for OP trying for a little sweeter, 1.006-008?

 

[drjayray]

-You can chill down to slow yeast after 5 days.
—You can pasteurize but need good control and strong bottles/caps, I use flip tops “Grolsh” types.
-Can also just add a little simple syrup to glass before you dispense from keg or pour from bottle leaving yeast at bottom behind. Not everyone likes it sweet. It’s about balance and personal taste right. It’s amazing what some Orange bitters do to cheap beer you would otherwise never drink, or water, or seltzer.

 

[Graham H]

I’ve never pasteurized, but I know there’s some good YouTube videos on the process.

I have done backsweetening and bottle carbing together on some ciders. I use a mixture of table sugar and xylitol. The table sugar measurement should be calculated based on what level carbonation you want. The non-fermentable sweetener measurement will depend on your palate. I followed the same advice @DBhomebrew gave—figure out your ratios on a sample size, then upscale. Worked very well for me, but everyone’s palate is different. Some people have no problem with non-fermentables; to others it may taste like artificial sweetener. I found that I had a narrow range between “not sweet enough” and “too sweet; tastes artificial.” With basic ciders it was a little harder to get it right. Flavored ciders seemed to give me more forgiveness.

I’ve progressed on to kegs and have been stabilizing and then backsweetening with AJ or FAJC. I can’t tell if they taste “cleaner” or if it’s just my imagination.

 

[beren]

-You can chill down to slow yeast after 5 days.
—You can pasteurize but need good control and strong bottles/caps, I use flip tops “Grolsh” types.
-Can also just add a little simple syrup to glass before you dispense from keg or pour from bottle leaving yeast at bottom behind. Not everyone likes it sweet. It’s about balance and personal taste right. It’s amazing what some Orange bitters do to cheap beer you would otherwise never drink, or water, or seltzer.

I've seen people from Europe say if they want it carbonated they add some sprite, and if they want it sweeter they add some apple juice (to the serving glass)

 

[beren]

I’ve progressed on to kegs and have been stabilizing and then backsweetening with AJ or FAJC. I can’t tell if they taste “cleaner” or if it’s just my imagination.

AJ will water it down/lower ABV, concentrate won't so much.

 

[Hoochin'Fool]

Wouldn't a little maltose (from say some dry-malt-extract) in your apple juice remain behind as a bit of sweetness/gravity, as long as you use yeast that can't digest maltose?

 

[DBhomebrew]

Wouldn't a little maltose (from say some dry-malt-extract) in your apple juice remain behind as a bit of sweetness/gravity, as long as you use yeast that can't digest maltose?

That's a great suggestion. It's how I slightly sweeten my low-ABV carbonated mead. 1-2oz/G low-color crystal steeped. Adds maltose, maltotriose, dextrins.

 

[beren]

Maltotriose Utilization by Industrial Saccharomyces Strains: Characterization of a New Member of the α-Glucoside Transporter Family "The great majority of yeast process strains consume both maltose and maltotriose..." so might take some testing to see which won't. Pretty sure all our brewing yeast eat maltose, and some at least eat maltotriose.

 

[Hoochin'Fool]

Pretty sure I've read that Lallemand EC-1118 wine yeast lacks enzymes to digest maltose

 

[DBhomebrew]

It's not just the maltose. Maltose is a rather low fruit. Maltotriose is a bit higher, dextrins higher still. As long as the yeast isn't diastatic the dextrins are untouched. That's also why I use the steeped crystal, not just base malt heavy DME.

 

[Graham H]

AJ will water it down/lower ABV, concentrate won't so much.

True, but OP’s issue was sweetness level. If one is aiming for more alcohol a simple answer is…have another drink.

 

[gaviga]

Treat it like mead. Add ¼ teaspoon potassium metabisulfite per 5 gallons and ½ teaspoon potassium sorbate per gallon to prevent fermentation, let it sit for a day, then back sweeten. I'd use honey dissolved in a small amount boiled water. When I do this in mead, I just add the points in honey like this to get to my target gravity.