Best way to get into All-Grain

Well after 5 or 6 extract batches I am looking into the next step.

So how should someone on a limited budget get into All-grain. I am strongly considering BIAB from Northern Brewer. Would it be better to do it this way or just invest in a $400-600 All-Grain system from the get go? I guess I just have no idea where to start.

I currently have a 9 gallon kettle and a simple Darkstar burner. Would these be sufficient for 5 gallon batches?

Thanks!

that's more than enough to start biab, just buy a decent grain bag and go ahead.

You can always upgrade to bigger stuff later.

BIAB would require almost no additional equipment and is probably the next logical step if you're trying to keep costs down. Basically you could buy a $5 paint strainer bag and you'd be set up to do 5-gallon batches if you're doing no-sparge. If you want to sparge, you will need one more vessel to collect the wort between mashing and sparging. A 5-gallon bucket should be fine for that.

bulletsandbeer said:

Well after 5 or 6 extract batches I am looking into the next step.

So how should someone on a limited budget get into All-grain. I am strongly considering BIAB from Northern Brewer. Would it be better to do it this way or just invest in a $400-600 All-Grain system from the get go? I guess I just have no idea where to start.

I currently have a 9 gallon kettle and a simple Darkstar burner. Would these be sufficient for 5 gallon batches?

Thanks!

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you could do a couple of partial mash brews to get a feeling of how to do a mash

but still add extract which will help to hit your OG

BAIB and all grain are one in the same, I use a bag in my 72 quart cooler to mash

I do a batch sparge, I use cooler because it is easier for me to control my temps

all the best

S_M

You may be a bit limited on the 9gal kettle but only slightly. I currently use a 10 gal (really 9.7) to make 5 gal batches up to about 1.070 with full volume on simple recipes and I'll hold a little water back during the mash then add to volume on my boil.
Of course you can always make 4 gallon or 3 gallon batches just as easy. BIAB is super scalable.
With you2 current setup you could get a 6-7 gallon No-chill cube (~$20), a good bag (~$20) and you'd have nearly everything you would need if you already do extract now.
About as simple as it gets. Remember K.I.S.S.

I'll second BIAB.

Go get yourself a pack of paint strainer bags (I double them up and use 2 for mashing), 9 gallon pot is more than sufficient for mashing. But you may need to sparge to volume.

I do this in a bucket.

It will literally cost you ~$5 dollars to try and see if you like it. You may want to invest in a Corona mill (~$25) but I mill in my blender.

Just make sure you get a nice fine crush and stir like a banshee when you mash in.

These calcs help immensely: http://www.rackers.org/calcs.shtml

This kind of goes through my process:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=519602

I was doing 5.5 gal BIAB batches with a 5.5 gal and 3.5 gal kettle, sparging to volume and doing a double boil to get 5.5 gal into the fermenter.

Now I have a 20 gal kettle.

I have both a three vessel system and a 10 gallon BIAB system. Go with BIAB. But get your bag from @wilserbrewer here on HBT. Awesome bags, way better than a paint strainer for keeping particulates out of the boil.

If i can do a 4,5 gallon westvleteren 12 clone in a 7,5 gallon kettle with a bit of creativity, you can do the same in a 9 gallon one...
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=524570

Thanks for all of the replies.

I was wrong about my kettle size. It is 10 gal not 9.

I'm wondering what kind of vessels I will need to invest in to do 10 gallon batches. I need a Lauder Tun and another Kettle, right? I was thinking a 15 gal (or 20 gal, not sure) kettle with ball valve and built in thermometer. Would I still have use for my 10 gallon kettle?

I feel so dumb with this stuff but it seems like it can get pretty complex.

As others have suggested start with a paint strainer bag or a wilserbrewer bag and do BIAB for a few batches or even several batches and get an idea of what it's like, how much you like it, and where you want to take from there. It's a small investment right now. Don't fret over larger kettles, BK, LTs, etc. just yet. Grab a BIAB bag and dial in your process while you read and research more on the subject.

bulletsandbeer said:

Thanks for all of the replies.


I'm wondering what kind of vessels I will need to invest in to do 10 gallon batches. I need a Lauder Tun and another Kettle, right? I was thinking a 15 gal (or 20 gal, not sure) kettle with ball valve and built in thermometer. Would I still have use for my 10 gallon kettle?

I feel so dumb with this stuff but it seems like it can get pretty complex.

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There's no point in doing 10 gallon batches until you can make really good smaller batches. Its probably better to go the other direction and do 3 gallons and make a lot of batches so you get the experience and figure out what you like and don't like. Pouring out beer you don't like sucks, but it sucks less if its 2-3 gallons and not 10.
Sure it can get complex, but it doesn't have to be. Keeping things simple is the best way for a lot of people.

phyllobeddo said:

As others have suggested start with a paint strainer bag or a wilserbrewer bag and do BIAB for a few batches or even several batches and get an idea of what it's like, how much you like it, and where you want to take from there. It's a small investment right now. Don't fret over larger kettles, BK, LTs, etc. just yet. Grab a BIAB bag and dial in your process while you read and research more on the subject.

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Ok got it. Should I start with a partial mash kit or just go ahead and go all grain right away?

Thanks again!

madscientist451 said:

There's no point in doing 10 gallon batches until you can make really good smaller batches. Its probably better to go the other direction and do 3 gallons and make a lot of batches so you get the experience and figure out what you like and don't like. Pouring out beer you don't like sucks, but it sucks less if its 2-3 gallons and not 10.
Sure it can get complex, but it doesn't have to be. Keeping things simple is the best way for a lot of people.

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Ok I'll stick with 5 gal batches for now. Should I jump right in to the all grain or would a partial mash kit be good to start with?

Thanks!

bulletsandbeer said:

Ok got it. Should I start with a partial mash kit or just go ahead and go all grain right away?

Thanks again!

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You're welcome. I would go straight to AG. I made the move last year and have not looked back since. I brewed batch number 20 last week.

Watch some BIAB videos on you tube, get a bag and some grain and go for it.
Take a good look at the crush of the grain when you are at the store, if there are a bunch of uncrushed grains, run it through again.
Have an old sleeping bag, coats or something like that handy to wrap your pot up in while its mashing. Use online mash temp calculator to figure strike temp. If you direct fire the pot during steeping be careful not to scorch the bag and be watch out for overheating. Most people just wrap up the pot and forget about it.
Take the grill off your BBQ and lay it on the top of your pot and set the bag on there to drain or something similar. Its really pretty easy. If your water volume is low and your gravity is high at the end of boil, add some water, it will be fine. Eventually you'll figure out the volumes so you don't have to add anything.

I would avoid NB's All grain setup package as it is over priced in my view. There are a couple of easy and cheap ways to start doing all-grain brewing.

The first which has already been mentioned is of course BIAB. A few things to get you a great BIAB system from the get go would be

1: A good bag ( @wilserbrew ) has great bags by the sounds of all the many happy customers. I used doubled up BIAB bags I got from NB. The double layer is needed. I think his bags are very well priced.

2: Get your own mill ($100). This will allow you to do a few things

• Mill your grain fine which will greatly increase the efficacy of BIAB
• Buy grain in bulk saving you money

3: A pot twice the volume of the batches you are planning

None of these is a must but will benefit you greatly

The other easy way to get into ALL grain would be to setup the usual cooler mash tun with manifold and spigot. (a simple manifold could be a bag for BIAB allowing a fine milling)

You could plan to do no sparge full volume mashes in the cooler and transfer to your boil kettle.

This, could be called "Mash In A Bag" MIAB
Again, buying a mill and a pot twice your batch size will greatly simplify the process.

I am admittedly biased having only done AG brewing via BIAB. My thread below might be useful to you. It outlines my process which I find hugely enjoyable.

Best of luck going forward with whatever you decide.

A rubbermaid cooler mashtun conversion costs ~$50, which is an easy way to jump from extract to all grain. A 9 gallon pot will handle most grain bills for 5 gallon batches. You might be pushing it if you try to make something like a big Baltic Porter, though xD

I remember when I started all-grain. I was super worried and paranoid for no reason! Get a big pot, get a cooler with a braid and get mashing! It's so much more fun, and my beer quality jumped up a.... tun.

+1 on sticking with 5 gallon batches. I personally actually do 6 gallon batches with the intention of dumping up to 1 gallon. This isn't always the case, but I find spending a couple more dollars on a slightly bigger bill is worth having extra wort to play around with. It's always good to have too much instead of too little!

I second the procurement of both a grain mill and a wort chiller (if you don't already have one) but you can make a great BIAB grain mill for $30 or less depending on the availability of a bucket & lid, and a 5-gallon plastic water bottle. Check out @wilserbrewer 's Corona Grain Mill build, super easy, super efficient.

http://brooklynbrewshop.com/

http://brooklynbrewshop.com/beer-making-kits

[ame]https://vimeo.com/11354805[/ame]

One downside I see to BIAB is hosting the grainbag after mash. You need to come up with a system that will hold it above the pot while it drains and even with 12 pounds of grains that can be heavy when saturated with water. This always seemed like a messy process to me. Also, you have to find a way to keep your temps consistent for an hours while mashing. This can probably be done with a sleeping bag and/or checking the temp and turning your burner back on.

Personally, when I was exploring options of going All-Grain I just went straight to the round cooler option and added the mesh drain and filter myself. It was around $50 dollars. There are instructions on how to convert a round beverage cooler on this site. The only other thing you would need is a way to heat 5 gallons of water for strike and sparge water. This allows me to do my mashing in the kitchen without the mess and once you hit your mash temp you put the lid on it and forget it for an hour.

Your 10 gallon pot is ideal for 5 gallon batches. A 5 gallon paint strainer bag will be a PITA to use in it though. I suggest a custom bag as advised previously. To do a 10 gallon BIAB you are going to need some sort of hoist system to remove the spent grain.

I personally dislike BIAB. I do it in 3 gallon batches inside in the winter. I don't like the hot, heavy, sticky mess.

I started with 4 extract and 4 partial mash in a 5 gallon stock pot while I assembled my 3 tier all gravity system. I did the Speckled Heifer kit from NB then used another kit recipe before making recipes. At first I took established recipes (often from NB) and made very small changes or additions. Then got more experimental.

I started brewing extract with partial grain at a brew-buddy's house almost 2 years ago. He then built out a 3-vessel system with larger pot and 2 coolers - takes a lot of space. He's moving so I built my own system, but my space was limited. I built my system to fit my environment, and that ended up being an indoor electric BIAB with a 60qt Bayou kettle, Wilser bags, and good ventilation.

I have no idea what your available space looks like, but you may want to choose your brewing method to fit your environment. There's many options out there!

mrdauber64 said:

One downside I see to BIAB is hosting the grainbag after mash. You need to come up with a system that will hold it above the pot while it drains and even with 12 pounds of grains that can be heavy when saturated with water. This always seemed like a messy process to me. Also, you have to find a way to keep your temps consistent for an hours while mashing.

Click to expand...

These issues are easily solved and I don't view them as barriers to utilizing BIAB. Mess is not an option for me. SWMBO is very keen to see her kitchen kept clean. She does a lot of baking

Bag draining equipment

Bag Draining

Insulated Mash

Another way to insulate

wysiwyg said:

I started brewing extract with partial grain at a brew-buddy's house almost 2 years ago. He then built out a 3-vessel system with larger pot and 2 coolers - takes a lot of space. He's moving so I built my own system, but my space was limited. I built my system to fit my environment, and that ended up being an indoor electric BIAB with a 60qt Bayou kettle, Wilser bags, and good ventilation.

I have no idea what your available space looks like, but you may want to choose your brewing method to fit your environment. There's many options out there!

Click to expand...

Jealous of your eBIAB setup. Looks great. Nice small footfrint.

I think a three vessel system can be done on a small footprint too. Just needs a little more planning perhaps.

mrdauber64 said:

One downside I see to BIAB is hosting the grainbag after mash. You need to come up with a system that will hold it above the pot while it drains and even with 12 pounds of grains that can be heavy when saturated with water. This always seemed like a messy process to me.

Click to expand...

One easy way to deal with pulling and draining the grain bag is to rig a pulley from a step ladder. @wilserbrewer sells a nice ratchet pulley to go with his awesome bags.

mrdauber64 said:

Also, you have to find a way to keep your temps consistent for an hours while mashing. This can probably be done with a sleeping bag and/or checking the temp and turning your burner back on.

Click to expand...

You don't have to obsess about mash temp too much. A loss of 2-4°F over an hour won't ruin your beer. Towels, blankets, sleeping bags, winter coats, etc. can all be quite effective for insulating the pot during mash.

Brew on

Ok I've decided I want to put together my own MLT before starting this stuff. Going to Lowes today to pick up the hardware to convert one of those big orange 10 gallon coolers.

The insulation thing just seems like a PITA. I would rather make it easy on myself and have a separate vessel for temp control.

Sounds like a fun project. Good way to spend a Saturday. Best of luck with it.

bulletsandbeer said:

Ok I've decided I want to put together my own MLT before starting this stuff. Going to Lowes today to pick up the hardware to convert one of those big orange 10 gallon coolers.



The insulation thing just seems like a PITA. I would rather make it easy on myself and have a separate vessel for temp control.

Click to expand...

Nothing wrong with that, but remember you can always do a hybrid. Instead of a false bottom or bazooka screen in your MLT you can use a bag. I wish I had done that starting out because I quickly out grew my original 5 gal cooler.