Strong Hop Flavor with Low IBU

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onipar

onipar

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I brewed a Nut Brown Ale with 1 oz Northern Brewer Hop Pellets for 1 hour and 1 oz Kent Goldings for 2 minutes. The IBU is about 11, based on a calculator.

After 2 weeks in primary I took a sample (I'm letting it go another week at least), and it tasted *very* strong of hops, which surprised me based on the IBU and small amount of hops used.

I'm just curious if this is normal. I know hop flavor mellows over time, but I wasn't expecting it to be this strong at all, even this early.

I'm not worried, I don't think my beer is ruined, nothing like that. Just curious. :cross::)

Thanks :mug:
 
It's a bit surprising that it would be a strong hop flavor with such a small amount, but not inconceivable. The hop flavor (as opposed to bitterness--IBUs) comes from late additions, in this case the 2 minute ounce. As you say, it'll mellow out.

For future batches, you could move that addition to earlier in the boil, say somewhere around 15 minutes or so. It'll up your bitterness a bit, but it'll be less "hoppy" as a result. I wouldn't expect a remarkably strong hop presence from your recipe as it is already, but my palate has been largely obliterated by IIPAs :).
 
Are you getting a strong bitterness or actual hop flavor/aroma? Check your calculator, mine says 46 ibus for the northern brewer alone. It's hard to determine what you mean by "very" strong but I'd say this is normal and it will mellow with a little time.
 
JonK331 said:
Are you getting a strong bitterness or actual hop flavor/aroma? Check your calculator, mine says 46 ibus for the northern brewer alone. It's hard to determine what you mean by "very" strong but I'd say this is normal and it will mellow with a little time.
Click to expand...

This was an extract brew with a partial boil (1 1/2 gallons), which I think is partly why the IBU was so low.

There was a low bitterness, but it was there. It was much more aroma/taste, which I guess is from the late addition as smagee said. It just surprised me because I was expecting to get a lot more of the nuttiness/caramel/malt flavor (There was a good 1 1/2 pounds of specialty grains in this recipe) than hops, even at this early juncture.

Yeah...I know "very strong" isn't the most detailed description. I don't have the best palette. Hmmm, well, it's not nearly as strong as an IPA. If you've ever had Troggs Hopback Amber Ale, it was something like that in terms of flavor/aroma, but not bitterness.

I wonder if a lot of pellet sediment got into the primary, would that account for an increase in the flavor of hops? I used grain bags for the hop pellets, but I didn't strain the wort going into the bucket.

Hopefully it'll all even out during conditioning.
 
onipar said:
This was an extract brew with a partial boil (1 1/2 gallons), which I think is partly why the IBU was so low.

There was a low bitterness, but it was there. It was much more aroma/taste, which I guess is from the late addition as smagee said. It just surprised me because I was expecting to get a lot more of the nuttiness/caramel/malt flavor (There was a good 1 1/2 pounds of specialty grains in this recipe) than hops, even at this early juncture.

Yeah...I know "very strong" isn't the most detailed description. I don't have the best palette. Hmmm, well, it's not nearly as strong as an IPA. If you've ever had Troggs Hopback Amber Ale, it was something like that in terms of flavor/aroma, but not bitterness.

I wonder if a lot of pellet sediment got into the primary, would that account for an increase in the flavor of hops? I used grain bags for the hop pellets, but I didn't strain the wort going into the bucket.

Hopefully it'll all even out during conditioning.
Click to expand...

An ounce of hops at 2 minutes is quite a bit- that's why you got the hoppy flavor. Having the hops in the fermenter doesn't impact the flavor at all- it's adding them in the boil that causes that flavor. For less hoppy aroma, some brown ales don't have any hops added late in the boil like that, or at least quite a bit less.
 
Yooper said:
An ounce of hops at 2 minutes is quite a bit- that's why you got the hoppy flavor. Having the hops in the fermenter doesn't impact the flavor at all- it's adding them in the boil that causes that flavor. For less hoppy aroma, some brown ales don't have any hops added late in the boil like that, or at least quite a bit less.
Click to expand...

Ah ha. Thank you, Yooper. This was a kit from my LHBS, so I basically just put in what it called for. This is only my second batch (and the first with hop and specialty grain additions), so I really didn't consider the bitter vs flavor factor. I saw low IBU's and assumed that was all that mattered. :(

And here I thought an ounce was very little. Well, now I know at least.

So is this amount of late additions hops unusual for a Nut Brown Ale? The description of the beer that came with the kit didn't indicate it would be a hoppy beer.

Thanks again! :mug:
 
onipar said:
Ah ha. Thank you, Yooper. This was a kit from my LHBS, so I basically just put in what it called for. This is only my second batch (and the first with hop and specialty grain additions), so I really didn't consider the bitter vs flavor factor. I saw low IBU's and assumed that was all that mattered. :(

And here I thought an ounce was very little. Well, now I know at least.

So is this amount of late additions hops unusual for a Nut Brown Ale? The description of the beer that came with the kit didn't indicate it would be a hoppy beer.

Thanks again! :mug:
Click to expand...


I think there is something wrong with the estimated IBU's as well. An hour boil of an ounce of NB (7-8%AA typically) in a 5 gallon batch is going to be quite a bit higher than 11 IBUs. Partial boils will decrease hop utilization a little but not 3-4 fold. I haven't really noticed a big difference in bitterness in my partial boils vs full boils so don't even adjust the hops for this usually. Then with an ounce at the end of the boil, your brew sounds like it is going to be more of a pale ale or amber than a nut brown, but it should be tasty:tank:
 
brewit2it said:
I think there is something wrong with the estimated IBU's as well. An hour boil of an ounce of NB (7-8%AA typically) in a 5 gallon batch is going to be quite a bit higher than 11 IBUs. Partial boils will decrease hop utilization a little but not 3-4 fold. I haven't really noticed a big difference in bitterness in my partial boils vs full boils so don't even adjust the hops for this usually. Then with an ounce at the end of the boil, your brew sounds like it is going to be more of a pale ale or amber than a nut brown, but it should be tasty:tank:
Click to expand...

I dunno...Everyone keeps saying my IBU's are off, so maybe I'm doing something wrong. Here's what I did, using this calculator: http://www.brewersfriend.com/ibu-calculator/

Boil Size (Gallons): 1.5
Batch Size (Gallons): 5
Target Original Gravity (OG): 1.052
Ounces: 1 Alpha Acids*: 8.5 Boil Time: 60 Type: pellet
Ounces: 1 Alpha Acids*: 4.5 Boil Time: 2 Type: pellet

This gives me Total IBU: 11.14

Am I doing something wrong?

The color is that of a Nut Brown, but the taste definitely had more hop than I expected. Sort of a disappointment, but I'll wait till after bottle conditioning before making a final verdict.
 
onipar said:
I dunno...Everyone keeps saying my IBU's are off, so maybe I'm doing something wrong. Here's what I did, using this calculator: http://www.brewersfriend.com/ibu-calculator/

Boil Size (Gallons): 1.5
Batch Size (Gallons): 5
Target Original Gravity (OG): 1.052
Ounces: 1 Alpha Acids*: 8.5 Boil Time: 60 Type: pellet
Ounces: 1 Alpha Acids*: 4.5 Boil Time: 2 Type: pellet

This gives me Total IBU: 11.14

Am I doing something wrong?

The color is that of a Nut Brown, but the taste definitely had more hop than I expected. Sort of a disappointment, but I'll wait till after bottle conditioning before making a final verdict.
Click to expand...


Who knows, the IBU's could be right. I've never done a boil that small but my personal impression is that the calculators way over estimate the difference in bitterness extracted based on boil size. I don't adjust my hop additions at all, or very little based on boil size.
 
According to Beersmith, the IBU calcs aren't off (or at least not significantly); I think the 1.5 gallon boil is what is skewing everyone's expectations. That's a much smaller boil size than is typical, so it would explain why the IBUs are way lower than most would expect.

I've seen browns with late additions, but rarely a full ounce and almost never as late as 2 minutes. But again, the hops will fade with some time.
 
Cool, cool. :D

Yeah, you know, I actually started a thread back before I did this batch to ask about adjusting the boil size for the IBU's. Everyone pretty much said it wouldn't make a big enough difference to matter. I also thought the boil size was fairly small, but again, having done only two brews now, I didn't know enough to necessarily question it, much like the late hop addition.

Personally, I don't much mind, but my brother is highly averse to hop taste *and* bitterness. Me, I don't like a very bitter beer, but the flavor/aroma is okay.

It does bother me though that the hop flavor may overpower the more traditional Nut Brown flavors that I was looking forward to.

Maybe an extended bottle conditioning of 4-5 weeks is in order.
 
Well, the nice thing is that the flavors you want will stick around for way longer than the hop ones :). I would imagine that the responses from your previous thread expected something like a 3-4 gallon boil, as that's a bit more typical for a partial boil recipe. That said, it sounds like smaller boils will work perfectly for you, since you will generally want less extraction from the hops as it is!

4-5 weeks should definitely make a difference; I find that hop flavor tends to recede quickly once the first month or so has passed.
 
Great! Thanks for the advice, Smagee.

Yeah, I'm not likely going to buy another kit from my LHBS without first comparing it to other similar kits, just to be sure.
 

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