Cloudy/opaque color with home malted grains

Hi guys
I have been experimenting with malting my own barley for a couple of months and made 3 batches with it so far.
The first 2 beers(a summer ale and a brown ale) turn out to have a very cloudy/opaque yellowish color and both had a grainy/wort like taste.
I was wondering if the cloudiness in the beer was due to proteins and if i used a protein rest in mashing if the issue was going to resolve.
Also can proteins impart a specific taste to the finished beer, if there is a high level of them in the malted barley and again is a protein rest going to help?
Thanks

Very interested to hear the answers to this. I don't use home malted grains, but I got that midway through my second batch, but I'm hoping that just needs time to settle out and have the flavors mellow.

If the grains aren't modified enough you probably ended up with a lot of excess starch that didn't convert. That would add to the grainy flavor. You probably also have a lot of proteins in there as well and those would cause protein haze. The protein issue can be addressed with a protein rest but it won't fix undermodified grain.

Before modern malting techniques, they used protein rests, long conversion times, and long boils. Those all help to cover up inconsistencies in the malt. You probably want to plan on incorporating all of those as you fine tune your malting process.

Thanks for your replies guys.
I suppose i could also try using half of my malt along with store bought malt, so i could get those unconverted starches to convert and avoid this grainy taste?

geobotsar said:

Thanks for your replies guys.
I suppose i could also try using half of my malt along with store bought malt, so i could get those unconverted starches to convert and avoid this grainy taste?

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That should work for the conversion issue. You might try some 6-row since it packs more enzymes per pound than 2-row.

Do you do iodine tests to check for conversion?

Sir Humpsalot: No, haven't done so far. Don't have any homebrew stores around, what i would need for that?

helibrewer: I only have access to belgian Brewferm pale malt. Is it safe to assume that it has a diastatic power of 60 °L, based on the beersmith chart below?


American 2 Row Pale Malt: 140 °L
American 6 Row Pale Malt: 160 °L
British Pale Malts: 40-70 °L
Maris Otter Pale Malt: 120 °L
Belgian Pale Malt (2 row): 60 °L
German Pilsner Malt: 110 °L
Munich Malt (10 SRM): 70 °L
Munich Malt (20 SRM): 25 °L
Vienna Malt: 50 °L
Wheat Malt, German: 60-90 °L
Wheat, Unmalted (flaked, Torrified): 0 °L
Crystal Malt (all): 0 °L
Chocolate Malt: 0°L
Black Patent Malts: 0 °L

Take some iodine or iodophor... it's used as a sanitizer in brewing, also available at a drug store.

Take a few teaspoons of wort, spread it around a light-colored plate. Dip a toothpick in iodine and streak it through the wort. If the iodine turns black in the wort, you have unconverted starches. If it stays brownish, you have full conversion.

Easy peasy.

Maybe for the first time, pull a couple drops of wort out of your MLT at about 5 minutes... you know it won't be converted yet. Try again and 30.. and at 60. And if you're having a hard time seeing the difference, maybe make a mini mash from a pound or two of store-bought 2row just to compare. Once you see the difference, it's a pretty simple and reliable test.

Thanks Sir Humpsalot, is that going to help while mashing home malted barley? Lets say after an hour i do the test and i dont have a full conversion, does this mean that i will have to mash for more time, or does it mean that i dont have the potential for more conversion?

geobotsar said:

Thanks Sir Humpsalot, is that going to help while mashing home malted barley? Lets say after an hour i do the test and i dont have a full conversion, does this mean that i will have to mash for more time, or does it mean that i dont have the potential for more conversion?

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It just simply tells you that your mash hasn't converted, that's all... It could mean you need more time... it could also mean that you need more diastatic power for conversion. Basically, it's telling you that you have starches that still need to get broken down. Maybe longer mashing will solve it, maybe you will need some 6row will solve it. Either way, some 6row will solve it. Maybe pull a small decoction, add a couple pounds of 6row (so the heat added by a small decoction can more or less cancel the cool grains), give it another 15-30 minutes and then... if you're like me... give up and just brew with what you've got anyway. LOL Hey, it'll still be beer.

Thanks man, i will try the suggestions and hope to end up with something that is drinkable, had to pour 2 batches down the drain so far, the good thing i learned something

I do home malting a lot and have done quite a few 100% home malt batches with no problems. I have noticed however that my malt tends to be real high in protein. I have alwaysfigured that this was just from differences in the grains between those being grown for food versus those grown for brewing. That said, I now incorporate a protein rest into my beer when I use home malted grains. This has been to very good effect.

Thanks November. What is your yield(ppg) regarding your home malted barley, and do you have any pointers in order to achieve fully modified malt?

My ppg is the same as commercial malts, I use Beer tools to build my recipe and build them using commercial 2row to get an idea of numbers and that works, I don't have my notes with me, but if I recall right that's like 32 or 34 ppg.

The best advice I can give on the malting side is the ensure that your grain in the malting couch is as even as possible. Try to get the grain as thin as you can by spreading it out, this will make the heat and moisture more even across the grain. When it is in a deep bed the moisture and heat stratify and you get grain coming to full conversion at different times. If you have to have it as a thick bed, stir, and mist frequently.

Depending on ambient conditions you might have to watch your temps, I have best results with soaks between 60F-70F and germination between 55F-65F. It will germinate when its warmer but the warmer it gets the harder it is to keep the sprouting even.

You can add hydrogen peroxide to your soaking and misting water to keep it from going bad, but I find that by the time it comes to this it is usually because your grain is starting to die. This is usually because the soaks are too long.

On the brewing side, I have best results with step mashes. I like three step, 122F-140F-158F, or two step, 122F-152F, depending on style.


If none of that works, develop a liking for wheat beer. Wheat is a lot more forgiving to malt than barley!
Good luck.

And Then he Said,"Come back from the dead, google still points to you!" lol

Anyway, i'm going to try it. But now that i can get my oven as low as 95f. What would the effect of doing a protein rest in the kernel, like a sugar rest for making crystal malt?

Thinking, put still wet malt in the oven at 120f, let it sit before drying for kilning

Going to try it next batch. I'll update with the results.

I'm tasting a cold, but still flat batch now. it came out a lot better, with both a wet roast on the green malt at 120f, and a protein rest in the mash.

This doesn't have the mouthfeel of plant milk.

I'm brewing tomorrow, going to try it with just a protein rest in the mash, getting that much malt up to 120f wet took forever, and i can bring the temp of a mash up to 150f from 125f in about 10min....I brew 10 gal batches and do 20-21 pound batches of malt....

protein rest seems to do the trick worked for 3 batches in a row, so far....

geobotsar said:

Thanks for your replies guys.
I suppose i could also try using half of my malt along with store bought malt, so i could get those unconverted starches to convert and avoid this grainy taste?

Click to expand...

Instead of adding extra grain another option would be adding amylase enzyme powder to your mash immediately after doughing in. If you plan on doing a ferulic acid rest (110F) or protein rest prior to mashing, pre-gelatinization will hydrolyze the starch and prep the enzyme to work faster when added.
It will increase your efficiency by helping with starch conversion and boost sugar extraction to the wort.

This works really well when doing an extended mash. Fermentability increases and given the right method and style, adding some enzyme can help yield a drier beer.