Combating Tartness and Lack of Body

First question before I begin, does tart=acidic?

Ok so my first two brews were store bought juice based. One was store bought apple juice, which also contained sugar, brown sugar, and honey. The second was with a mixed berry juice, which had a bit of sugar and nothing else. My first drink was far from tart, but the second was overwhelmingly tart. I have been trying to figure out a way to amend this postfermentation, but have come up flat. I tried simply back sweetening with sugar and then honey, nothing. I tried adding some raisins, nothing. So does anybody have any suggestions to kill the tart postfermentation and what was the difference between the two drinks?

Now onto body. I have been reading about different ways to add body to a cider, which mostly has come from Brandon O'Graff's Cider, but is there any way to add some body when fermentation has completed? If not, I can deal with it, but the tartness has to go to be drinkable.

You might try using Lalvin's 71-B (narbonne) yeast on your next batch, it will metabolize about 15-20% of the malic acid. You could also use a malolactic fermentation which will metabolize malic acid as well, but I have no data as to what percentage. As long as your ABV isn't too high you could use a MLF on your existing batch. Many wine & cider makers use a malolactic fermentation (MLF) to "soften" their product. You can usually find both the 71-B & the malolactic cultures either at your LHBS or via an online HBS. Regards, GF.

Strange, my first thought was that you have too many tannins. Tannins can also make you pucker, like sucking on a wet tea bag. However, complaining about how little body there is would be cured by tannins. Basically, think about how red wine is, which has lots of tannins. One way to add them is using raisins. Wikipedia has a list of tannin high foods.

Actually, how much sugar did you add pre-fermentation and what was your ABV?

how old are these ciders? I think that most people on their first few batches of cider confuse the taste of green cider as "tart"

As for combating lack of body, you could start by not adding any additional sugar. Adding sugar will make your brew thinner.

I'd bet malolactic fermentation will help, as GF suggested.

I'm beginning my foray into ciders, but your real problem (and everyone who is trying to make good cider) is the juice. Store bought juice is typically made from cheap desert apples. You can make a good cider with them if you properly control it. You get body and balance from the apple itslef, just like wine. Store juice has a lot of sugar, and thats really about it. That translates to a rather dry, tart cider. Adding sugars only makes matters worse.

If you want to add body, maltodextrin is your best bet. Its a white powder that any LHBS should sell. I think its usually used at a ratio of 8oz per 5 gallons.

I found that my ciders with sugar added really need at least a year until they start coming into their own. A batch I bottled 2 years ago is completely different from when I bottled it after 3 months in the carboy.

Well I added about 1.5-2lbs or sugar and I believe my ABV was about 7-8%. (too lazy to go look at my log, but those numbers should be pretty close). The drink is pretty young yet. It's only about 3 months old. The only thing about that it my two drinks were put together pretty close to the same time, but one lacks this tart kick. Could it maybe have been the brown sugar or the honey? Or maybe the juice?

Which one is really tart, the apple juice, or mixed berry juice (or both)?

Just the mixed berry juice. The apple brew is far from tart and has some body. I am wondering if it's the juice that did it, but unsure if honey or the brown sugar may have helped a bit too.

I'm betting its the juice then. What are the ingredients? Some of the mixed juices contain HFC and other added sugars. If it doesnt, its probably the juice itself that just doesn't taste very good when fermented. It may just need more time also.

Edcculus said:

I'm betting its the juice then... its probably the juice itself that just doesn't taste very good when fermented. It may just need more time also.

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There is a cider house near me that tried fermenting fresh cherries last year and said they were awful, so they fermented apple juice, stabilized it, and then added cherry juice when it was done. So, Edcculus could be very right about your juice being horrible when fermented.

Failed experiment is failed I guess.

Might also consider Glycerine. It says, "To mellow and smooth out wines and liqueurs." You could try adding some to a small glass of your brew to see if it'll work. I paid $2.95 for 5 oz bottle (Crosby & Baker) from LHBS.

I tried a few drops in a glass of young raspberry pomegranate honey applewine that was bitter/tart, and it mellowed that out and added some body. For this case the Glycerine was my preference when compared to Lactose and Maltodextrin.

Carbonating it might help it's body too. Good luck!

You could also backsweeten with a non fermentable like store bought sugar substitutes (sucralose, saccharin) or lactose.

Bush_84 said:

Failed experiment is failed I guess.

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Not a failure ...just a lesson learned...I made the same mistake on my batch.. but its not really tart..just more of a diluted flavor as stated previously...keep at it ..you will make something you like soon enough.....When in doubt..LET IT AGE!