rockdemon
Well-Known Member
Thanks! Ill try that. But since im scared of exploding bottles ill siphon the beer to a new bucket and keep it there to ser if the bacteria comes back...
Belgian Dark Strong Ale The Pious - Westvleteren 12 style quad - multiple
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Thanks! Ill try that. But since im scared of exploding bottles ill siphon the beer to a new bucket and keep it there to ser if the bacteria comes back...
Even if you siphon from under the pellicle, there will still be bacteria if that is what it is. I would leave it in the same bucket and see what happens. If it is an infection and you transfer to a new bucket, then you have infected 2 buckets.
thatjonguy
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+1
You are in a race against time for that beer. At some point it will become noticeable.
Bottoms_Up
Well-Known Member
What kind of wild yeast can withstand that level of alcohol, and be able to use such a low residual sugar content?
SavoryChef
Well-Known Member
I would add some Brett and wait 6+ months and see what happens
thatjonguy
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Brett L and Brett B from Wyeast both are tolerant up to 12%.
If there is any sugar left, Brett will find it.
Not sure what level we are talking about in his particular case but there is a lot of sugar left fot brett at a TG of 1.010.
FredTheNuke
Well-Known Member
I added a smack pack of Roeselare to a Cuvee Van de Keizer clone (recipe courtesy of CSI). That is a 12% beer. It is doing just fine - the pics are recently in the Pellicle Pictures thread. Let your Infected Westy sit for a year or 2 - it may come out amazing!
CSI - CandiSyrup
Well-Known Member
If it is an infection, (and on close-up it does look like one), my guess would be Brett or ABV tolerant Saccharomyces that slipped in. Both bacteria's can mutate quickly. If it doesn't taste medicinal then it may not be a wild yeast infection.
Rockdemon, does the ale taste ok but a tiny bit sour on finish?
CSI - CandiSyrup
Well-Known Member
It could end up being a great beer!
rockdemon
Well-Known Member
rockdemon
Well-Known Member
Sit in the bucket or in bottles? If im supposed to leave it in the bucket, should i siphon it to a new bucket to get rid of the trub in the bottom, its not much but some...
SavoryChef
Well-Known Member
Brett likes Sacc by products, so you could leave it. This bucket will be a sour bucket from now on, do keep it marked.
rockdemon
Well-Known Member
Do you mean the bucket is "ruined" that i wont be able to get the sanitize it?
FredTheNuke
Well-Known Member
You can leave it in the bucket on it's trub (bacteria LOVE to eat it) - you do need to flush the headspace with CO2 to minimize the oxygen and make sure the airlock doesn't go dry. The best thing to do is move it to a glass carboy - the plastic buckets do let in some oxygen by diffusion over time - even the HDPE ones. Buy Oldsock's book called American Sours for more info on this whole process and why you do each step.
Brewing this right now. Last time I brewed this I changed the recipe a bit and used the Rochefort yeast strain and changed the Candi Syrups up a bit. Was kinda limited based on my LHBS's in the area. The beer came out super malty at first (which I've had happen on several Trappist style ales that I've brewed in the past) however after I let it age for about a year and a half (deployment helped the aging) it was incredible! This time I'm doing the recipe as is and so far so good. I'm hoping it will be ready in about 7 months. Should be fine by then right?
SavoryChef
Well-Known Member
Plastic is porous and bugs can hide in there. $15 for a new bucket is better than $40 in an infected batch. Sure you can bleach bomb it. Bring this topic over to the lambic thread and there are a ton of people that can discuss this extensively so we don't get too off topic here.
Others her are more experienced than me, but I had a RIS and an Imperial Porter than looked similar during points of fermentation and they both ended up excellent, no infections.
Definitely don't dump it, whether you go Brett or not your call.
Definitely don't dump it, whether you go Brett or not your call.
rockdemon
Well-Known Member
Aaaha! This could be the same bucket as i used when i got my seriously infected beer. I will definitely mark it! thanks!
user 197168
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I'm pretty excited about giving this recipe a go in a couple of weeks. The problem is, it's hot here in Sydney Australia - about 30C degrees (86F) during the day, getting down to about 21C (70F) during the night.
My dilemma is, do I heat the fermenter by immersing it in a tub with an aquarium heater, or do I cool it in my chest freezer with a thermostat? If I pitch at 18C (64F) and let it free rise, it is going to happen fairly quick. Should I emulate this with the freezer?
Any help much appreciated. I'd hate to brew something as good as this only to stuff it up with my fermentation temps.
My dilemma is, do I heat the fermenter by immersing it in a tub with an aquarium heater, or do I cool it in my chest freezer with a thermostat? If I pitch at 18C (64F) and let it free rise, it is going to happen fairly quick. Should I emulate this with the freezer?
Any help much appreciated. I'd hate to brew something as good as this only to stuff it up with my fermentation temps.
CSI - CandiSyrup
Well-Known Member
This thread has been consolidated and moved to:
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f73/westvleteren-12-clone-multiple-award-winner-500037/
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f73/westvleteren-12-clone-multiple-award-winner-500037/
Trying a variation of this with the following recipe. Thoughts?:
16 lbs 2 row
0.5 lbs biscuit
0.25 lbs special B
0.2 lbs chocolate
0.3 lbs victory
Total Grain: 17.25 lbs
1.0 oz American Golding 4-6% (90 min?)
1.0 oz German Hallertau 3.5-5.5% (60 min)
1.0 oz German Hallertau 3.5-5.5 % (30 min)
1.0 oz UK East Kent Golding 4-6%% (15 min)
1.0 oz German Hallertau 3.5-5.5% (1 min)
Total Hops: 5 oz
6g Coriander
3g peppercorn
6g orange peel
5g Allspice
3.0 lbs dark Belgian candi (5 min)
Whitelabs Belgian Strong Yeast
Est OG: 1.090
7.55 gal boil
16 lbs 2 row
0.5 lbs biscuit
0.25 lbs special B
0.2 lbs chocolate
0.3 lbs victory
Total Grain: 17.25 lbs
1.0 oz American Golding 4-6% (90 min?)
1.0 oz German Hallertau 3.5-5.5% (60 min)
1.0 oz German Hallertau 3.5-5.5 % (30 min)
1.0 oz UK East Kent Golding 4-6%% (15 min)
1.0 oz German Hallertau 3.5-5.5% (1 min)
Total Hops: 5 oz
6g Coriander
3g peppercorn
6g orange peel
5g Allspice
3.0 lbs dark Belgian candi (5 min)
Whitelabs Belgian Strong Yeast
Est OG: 1.090
7.55 gal boil
CSI - CandiSyrup
Well-Known Member
This thread has been consolidated and moved to:
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f73/west...winner-500037/
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f73/west...winner-500037/
Hey guys, I brewed the New World and got an OG of 1.094. She's now at 1.020 after 7 days. Now sitting at 67 degrees, do I rack and hope that promotes the yeast to finish in the teens or wait it out another couple days without racking?
thatjonguy
Now with 57.93% more awesome!
See the new thread link one post above yours. All the activity was moved there.
solbes
Well-Known Member
A little off topic. But I was searching for a peach sour beer that I had bottle conditioning in the cellar. Found a whole 12 pack of Dark Strongs made to this recipe that I thought was gone. I was worried they might be oxidized (brewed May '13, bottled July '13). Chilled one down and it was delicious. I can't tell you how happy I was (even took a tad of the sting off the Vikings last second gaff).
CSI - CandiSyrup
Well-Known Member
This thread is no longer active. It has been has been consolidated and moved to:
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f73/west...winner-500037/
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f73/west...winner-500037/
First off I love your syrup.
With that being said you keep posting that in this thread.... I went to your link and then went back 2 or 3 pages of the current dialogue and see nothing refrencing this recipe/ thread. It's all about the recipe you formulated. Is there something I am missing.... were you originally saq and then changed your name to CSI.
I have not brewed your recipe however I have brewed saq's (slight tweaks) and it's damn good. I have a batch sitting in a conical now at 11.4%. Next week step feeding begins.
CSI - CandiSyrup
Well-Known Member
The majority of contributors all agreed 2 years ago that this current thread had grown sidetracked and was a Belgian Dark Strong more than a Westvleteren 12 clone. We agreed. Aaron, (you know him as 'saq'), also stopped contributing back in 2013. This venerable Ale needed to be approached in a Belgian minimalist manner in keeping with BLAM and the hundreds of brewing efforts we've been involved with from around the world. The minimalist approach does require greater brewing skill but is required if brewing closer to BLAM and the actual import. We wanted everyone to benefit from the improvement in method and grist and the general leap forward. I hope this helps understand the context of the move.
WyldStalyn
New Member
I tapped the Pious Traditional a few weeks ago and it is awesome. Thank you for sharing this recipe.
We just did a side by side of this version and the CSI version both brewed in January, bulked aged for about 6 months and then bottled. Followed recipes exactly as written except did a single infusion, and kept them in exact conditions. Both brew days went well, and hit my numbers and temps almost spot on.
We did blind tastings and I had a hard time telling the two apart. They are very similar (at least to me) at this point in aging.
I didn't have an original to compare, but it was pretty close from what I recall and noted when I was lucky to have an original last winter (which spurred me brewing both versions).
I intend to brew both versions each year to continue a long term taste test. I am curious how different they will age over a 12-24 month period.
Thanks for the recipe!
We did blind tastings and I had a hard time telling the two apart. They are very similar (at least to me) at this point in aging.
I didn't have an original to compare, but it was pretty close from what I recall and noted when I was lucky to have an original last winter (which spurred me brewing both versions).
I intend to brew both versions each year to continue a long term taste test. I am curious how different they will age over a 12-24 month period.
Thanks for the recipe!
Frikkieman
Active Member
I have been wanting to make this recipe for over 2 years now and finally got around to finding the right ingredients and the time. So I made this bad boy yesterday (new world version). I took great care to get everything just right. I ended up with the correct final volume and an OG = 1.092. Even the fermentation temps are looking spot-on and it's bubbling away happily, self rising to the 83F mark.
HOWEVER...somehow, some way, through all of this, I forgot to add the 0.5lb biscuit malt
I could kick myself in the head for this. Any ideas. Should I just call it a day and see how it ends up or steep the biscuit and add the "tea" after fermentation?
Any help is appreciated.
HOWEVER...somehow, some way, through all of this, I forgot to add the 0.5lb biscuit malt
I could kick myself in the head for this. Any ideas. Should I just call it a day and see how it ends up or steep the biscuit and add the "tea" after fermentation? Any help is appreciated.
I have been wanting to make this recipe for over 2 years now and finally got around to finding the right ingredients and the time. So I made this bad boy yesterday (new world version). I took great care to get everything just right. I ended up with the correct final volume and an OG = 1.092. Even the fermentation temps are looking spot-on and it's bubbling away happily, self rising to the 83F mark.
HOWEVER...somehow, some way, through all of this, I forgot to add the 0.5lb biscuit malt
Any help is appreciated.
Biscuit malt is optional. The version I have brewed the most is CSI's 100% pilsner recipe. I wouldn't worry about it at all.
Frikkieman
Active Member
redraider77
Active Member
I brewed this a couple of months ago and it is currently about to finish the 60 day chill at 50 degrees. I took a gravity reading last night and it was 1.005 which is well below the expected FG of 1.012. I missed the OG number as well. It ended up being 1.082. I'm wondering what to expect with the low final gravity number (1.005). I tasted it when I took the sample and tasted pretty good but there was a definite alcohol presence. I know time is probably your friend for a high ABV like this but I'm concerned about the lower FG number. Thanks.
I've had some batches finish a few points low, not that low. But they did smooth out after a few months. The thing I like about this clone is that you can miss the numbers a little and still have a quality product, even if it is not exactly what you were shooting for.
boland
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Thank you for sharing this recipe I've made it yesterday, but pitched a slightly different yeast by accident (M41 Mangrove Jacks). This is a dry yeast, mainly for saisons, and higher attenuation by the looks of it.
Temp range is 64- 82. Keeping it at 78 now, and it's already bubbling away.
Should I change the fermentation schedule? Any other considerations?
I've made it yesterday, but pitched a slightly different yeast by accident (M41 Mangrove Jacks). This is a dry yeast, mainly for saisons, and higher attenuation by the looks of it.Temp range is 64- 82. Keeping it at 78 now, and it's already bubbling away.
Should I change the fermentation schedule? Any other considerations?
Thank you for sharing this recipe
Temp range is 64- 82. Keeping it at 78 now, and it's already bubbling away.
Should I change the fermentation schedule? Any other considerations?
I've never used that yeast, although I have used dried saison yeast in a Belgian dark strong when that was all that was available. The final gravity was lower than ideal and there were esters I'd rather have not had there. The yeast does make a difference. Still a very good beer.
Usually you would want to start the fermentation at the lower end of the temperature range (for this recipe you are not looking for the esters you may get at the higher end), but since it's already at 78 I would leave it there. If it finishes on the dry side and tastes a little hot, extra time in the bottle can help smooth it out.
Here is a report (not mine) of using M41 in, among other beers, a quad. Seems to have worked well.
http://www.indianbrewer.com/2016/02/mangrove-jack-belgian-ale-yeast-review.html?m=1
http://www.indianbrewer.com/2016/02/mangrove-jack-belgian-ale-yeast-review.html?m=1
ihavenonickname
Well-Known Member
My Westy 12 has been aging in a keg for 6 months.
What’s the best way to bottle?
Adding yeast and sugar to a bottling bucket will expose to so much oxygen.
Adding yeast and sugar to the keg, mixing and bottling from the keg sounds cool but I don’t know the exact volume in the keg.
Bottling from keg and then pipetting in small amounts of sugar and yeast seem like a hassle.
Any better methods?
What’s the best way to bottle?
Adding yeast and sugar to a bottling bucket will expose to so much oxygen.
Adding yeast and sugar to the keg, mixing and bottling from the keg sounds cool but I don’t know the exact volume in the keg.
Bottling from keg and then pipetting in small amounts of sugar and yeast seem like a hassle.
Any better methods?
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