LHBS grain mill is awful!

I just got into AG brewing (BIAB - love it!) a few months ago. On my first two batches I got pretty lousy efficiency, but chalked that up to inexperience. On my third batch I got even worse efficiency! In preparing for my next batch I went to the LHBS and bought my grain, ran it through their mill, and came home. After doing a little research I took a look at the grain that I sent through their mill twice - I'd say 90% of the grain isn't even cracked open! No wonder I'm getting lousy efficiency! Being the newbie, I just assumed that the LHBS mill was set up the way it should and my grain was good to go. Boy was I wrong.

Needless to say, I ordered a Corona mill so I can crush my own grain on the cheap. I have a feeling my efficiency will go through the roof compared to what it was before! Just a warning to the new guys in AG - don't assume the store's crush is what it should be.

Good to know, getting ready to all grain.

Sometimes, you get people in the store that mess with the gap on the rollers, and they don't put it back when they're done. I would run a few ounces through the mill and take a look at the crush. It it's got a lot of tan powder, it means the rollers don't have enough gap and it's actually grinding the husks (bad). If it doesn't have enough cracked husks, it's not set tight enough. You can always ask someone working there to adjust the mill for you. (assuming it's an adjustable mill)

Most times, though, the rollers are put through so much use that they just wear away. A Corona Mill won't get you the best crush either, but it's better than nothing. I'd definately start thinking about investing in a higher quality mill in the future.

Suthrncomfrt1884 said:

I'd definately start thinking about investing in a higher quality mill in the future.

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Can you recommend one?

You're experiencing what many of us have experienced when using grain from the LHBS.

Personally, I hit a serious low spot when I brewed a recent batch with grain milled by the LHBS (it was a sponsored event, so the grain was free). I found out, later, that most of the people who had them mill the grain had it run through at least twice. I hit almost the worst efficiency since I went all grain (64%). The only time I had a lower rate was when I tried to do BIAB in a cooler mash tun (rectangular) and I didn't get the dough balls out (not even close)... As a test, on Sunday, I brewed another batch (different recipe, more grain this time)... Hit 76% using pretty much the same mash method (mash in, mash out, sparge)... That was when running the grain through MY Barley Crusher mill (set at the default .039" gap)... Next brew, I plan to work on the water temps a bit more, keeping everything else the same, to see what I get. After that, I'll consider altering the mill gap setting. Still, if I can get ~75% efficiency for most of my batches, I'll be happy.

this is a popular one. i love it, i almost always hit exactly 80% efficiency with batch sparging. set at factory default setting:

http://www.barleycrusher.com/

I have a barley crusher and love it. You can't go wrong in getting one. Adjustable rollers and you can take the handle off and attach a drill.

Suthrncomfrt1884 said:

A Corona Mill won't get you the best crush either, but it's better than nothing. I'd definately start thinking about investing in a higher quality mill in the future.

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Probably true, but I know a lot of guys who get great efficiency with them, and their beer tastes the same as the beer made with the fancy mills. Saving the money and getting essentially the same quality final product is worth it to me. Probably not the best, but good enough for the money.

You'll see people posting about having one of just a few makes... Barley Crusher, Crand N Stein, Monster Mill, and a couple of others. A search on the boards should yield more than a few threads discussing the differences between the makes/models.

For me, selection was more about cost of the mill and what I got with it. The Barley Crusher was also in stock with the vendor I used, which was nice. If it's not in stock, who knows how long it could take before it arrives at your place.

Whatever you do end up getting, I would make sure it's adjustable, from both ends, and has enough people posting positive comments about it. Personally, I figure that if I can get several years of use out of mine (planning to hit my 100 gallon limit every year) then I will have gotten my money out of it. By that time, I'll probably already be looking to get something else to do the job. Something with a larger hopper, that can crush more at a time (longer rollers) and such.

BTW, I did, briefly, consider getting the corona style mill... But after reading about what I would want/need to do with it before using it, I decided to pass. Simply put, I have very few tools on hand where I live. In order to get it setup, I'd need to get to my sister/mother's place, find the tools (you don't want to know) build the setup, then transport it back home. More trouble than it's worth. Besides, the extra costs of fuel, time, energy, and mental anguish made the BC a much better idea.

NWAleDad said:

Can you recommend one?

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I've got a monster mill MM-3 and I love it. I hit 80-85% efficiency every time and I've never messed with the factory gap.

Suthrncomfrt1884 said:

I've got a monster mill MM-3 and I love it. I hit 80-85% efficiency every time and I've never messed with the factory gap.

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How fast do you send your grain through the mill? I've started running my drill at about 250rpm when connected to the mill. Thought that 500rpm might be a bit too fast, so we started running at 1/2 speed (or as close as we could estimate). Seems to be doing a better job on the crush. I do plan to try conditioning my malt soon for a batch to see what that does for me.

Its all about getting reliable results IMO. If I know that I can get ~75% efficiency time and again (some a bit higher some a bit lower) then at least I know. I can then properly build the recipe to hit my goal for the brew.

Golddiggie said:

I do plan to try conditioning my malt soon for a batch to see what that does for me.

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I started doing this a few batches ago and it is working great for me. A lot more intact hulls, hardly takes any moisture to do a good job.

Definitely get your own mill! They're affordable and save you money in the long run by hitting your numbers with less malt. I roll with the Barley Crusher, too, so +1 to that.

I got my own mill, but for other reasons. My LHBS lets you run everything on your own, and is not that busy, so I run the grain through at least twice, sometimes 3 times, so the crush wasn't a problem. But the ability to buy bulk grain and save off that will have even a fairly expensive mill paid off in no time. I am not an every week brewer, but I have 3 bags of base malts sitting around, and plan to add a few more. Probably only takes around 10 bags to pay for the mill.

Golddiggie said:

How fast do you send your grain through the mill? I've started running my drill at about 250rpm when connected to the mill. Thought that 500rpm might be a bit too fast, so we started running at 1/2 speed (or as close as we could estimate). Seems to be doing a better job on the crush. I do plan to try conditioning my malt soon for a batch to see what that does for me.

Its all about getting reliable results IMO. If I know that I can get ~75% efficiency time and again (some a bit higher some a bit lower) then at least I know. I can then properly build the recipe to hit my goal for the brew.

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I agree with reliable results. Anything around 75% is great in my opinion.

If you're not getting any astringency in your beers, then conditioning your malt isn't going to do much for you. It's good in breweries because of the amount of grain used and the need for a nice grainbed. It also cuts down on tannin extraction from the husks. With a cheaper mill, this might be necessary, but I've not needed it with my MM. I get a great crush and no tannins. The crush on the MM-3 is why I went with it. It double crushes the grain, unlike dual roller mills.

As for my speed...I'm not sure. I have a cordless dewalt that I hook up to it and I set it on high speed. I can run 15lbs of grain in about 2 minutes. It might not even be that long...I'm just guessing.

I was looking at getting my own mill, and with what I learned on this thread, I decided to go with a monster mill MM-3. Thanks for the advice guys!

i started with the corona mill a friend gave me when he upgraded. now i have a jsp maltmill (non-adjustable), and i hit around 80%. i bought this 1 because it was what i could buy locally, and it works great

Shaneoco1981 said:

I was looking at getting my own mill, and with what I learned on this thread, I decided to go with a monster mill MM-3. Thanks for the advice guys!

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+1.got an MM-3 for christmas with the stainless rollers. Used to have problems with the crush from my LHBS, now i'm hitting 80%, had to cut back on the grain in my recipes as i was overshooting my FG

Toecutter said:

+1.got an MM-3 for christmas with the stainless rollers. Used to have problems with the crush from my LHBS, now i'm hitting 80%, had to cut back on the grain in my recipes as i was overshooting my FG

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That's awesome to hear, because I have yet to hit 70% with 4 all grain batches. I have come close, but I think a different crush will help me.

Crush makes all the difference in the world, especially if you are doing BIAB (where you can get by crushing the bejeesus out of the grain). My LHBS has the rollers set pretty average, and I got decent efficiency (mid 70's). Ordered a barley crusher but it hasn't arrived yet. However, used my brother's monster mill on a Hefeweizen this weekend. Originally calculated efficiency at 87.5%, which I was thrilled at. Then, the next day I opened the trunk of my car, and lo and behold, sitting there was the leftover grain that didn't fit into my buckets (9 oz worth). I had totally forgotten about it, and still hit a bit above my target OG. Recalculated at 93%!!! :rockin:

I totally credit the crush from my brother's mill! Loving the mill and BIAB - an incredible combination!!!

I just went out and bought a Corona mill tonight and brewed a 5 gallon batch of Centennial Blonde. I used the same process as all my other BIAB batches that had grain milled at the LHBS. Those batches were usually in the high 50% to low 60% efficiency range. Not exactly stellar! But tonight I crushed my own in the Corona, and let me tell you, even though it's not a fancy roller mill, it delivers a great crush! It took all of 2 minutes of tweaking to get it to crush the grain perfectly. I crushed it a little finer than some people might just because I'm doing BIAB, but it was easily adjusted either way.

So the results - I just took my measurement 5 minutes ago, and my efficiency skyrocketed to 80%. I was just a hair over my numbers since I was assuming a 75% efficiency for this batch. For a $30 mill, I was pretty stoked! :rockin:

I use a Corona mill as well, and I have never gotten below 75% efficiency. As a general rule I get 80%. I've got a drill hooked up to my crusher as well.

Considering my costs for everything on my setup, including the drill was ~$60, I'd call it a good investment.

finley said:

I use a Corona mill as well, and I have never gotten below 75% efficiency. As a general rule I get 80%. I've got a drill hooked up to my crusher as well.

Considering my costs for everything on my setup, including the drill was ~$60, I'd call it a good investment.

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skelrad said:

I just went out and bought a Corona mill tonight and brewed a 5 gallon batch of Centennial Blonde. I used the same process as all my other BIAB batches that had grain milled at the LHBS. Those batches were usually in the high 50% to low 60% efficiency range. Not exactly stellar! But tonight I crushed my own in the Corona, and let me tell you, even though it's not a fancy roller mill, it delivers a great crush! It took all of 2 minutes of tweaking to get it to crush the grain perfectly. I crushed it a little finer than some people might just because I'm doing BIAB, but it was easily adjusted either way.

So the results - I just took my measurement 5 minutes ago, and my efficiency skyrocketed to 80%. I was just a hair over my numbers since I was assuming a 75% efficiency for this batch. For a $30 mill, I was pretty stoked! :rockin:

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Just keep in mind that it's not so much about efficiency as it is a good crush. Yes, a good crush boosts your efficiency, but it can do so much more harm if it's a bad crush. You can pulverize your grain as much as you'd like, and get high efficiency. But, you're hurting yourself in the long run if it's not pulvarized with quality. Those corona mills tend to just shred everything from what I've seen. If you're not noticing problems with tannins/chill haze, then I wouldn't worry about it. But...it's something to think about.

Suthrncomfrt1884 said:

Just keep in mind that it's not so much about efficiency as it is a good crush. Yes, a good crush boosts your efficiency, but it can do so much more harm if it's a bad crush. You can pulverize your grain as much as you'd like, and get high efficiency. But, you're hurting yourself in the long run if it's not pulvarized with quality. Those corona mills tend to just shred everything from what I've seen. If you're not noticing problems with tannins/chill haze, then I wouldn't worry about it. But...it's something to think about.

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Good point. I should have taken a picture of the crush. My initial setting was too fine and it did rip everything to shreds, but after opening it up a little, it was pretty easy to get hulls that were pretty much left intact while the inside was broken up.