Graff (Malty, slightly hopped cider)

Here's how it looked last Thursday, 1 week into fermenting.

One helluva heads up Cider, thank you kindly. I would have had that **** all over the inside of my keggerator. LMAO /salute

Made a batch following recipe. it cleared up nicely in the bottle and has a nice head on it. Taste is pretty good - a little bitter for SWMBO. I happened to think, the recipe calls for 1/2 ounce of hops. I used pellets. Is this what we want or are we supposed to use leaf hops? thanks for input.

What kind of hops did you use? What were the AA%'s?

The wort wasn't bitter in mine at all, of course, I used a low AA% Fuggle too.
The goal of the recipe for me is a hard cider, not a beer.

I used Cascade pellet hops. 7.5 AA. I don't know anything at all about beer brewing, so I was just wondering if the quanitity was intended to be for leaf or pellet hops, or if there was any difference. Don't get me wrong, I like the graff, but it definitely does taste very "beery".

The recipe calls for something around the 6% AA range. Cascades have a definitive taste and nose to them, that's for sure. LOL

It shouldn't matter at all, I use pellets.

Ciderbarrel said:

Here's how it looked last Thursday, 1 week into fermenting.

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Wow!! My batch was made with similar headspace ( ~3.6 gal/5 gal carboy). I fittted a blowoff, but it turned out not to be necessary. The foam I had wasn't NEARLY as high as yours. It also finished a little high gravity (1.011) so maybe the Nottingham packet I had wasn't all that healthy. Still, it made a nice bass drumbeat as the blowoff tube bubbled into the jug of sanitizer!

wscott823 said:

I guess I kinda made Graff lite too. My DME was on target, but I made the mistake of picking up 3 quart containers of AJ, not gallons. My OG was around 1.042, I ended up back sweetening it with 2 cans concentrate to give it back some apple character. FG when I bottled on saturday ended up giving me abv of 4.5%. Not too shabby.

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I'm going to back sweeten it too. After 15 days of ferment at 65-67 degrees in my temp controlled spare fridge, I got a reading of 1.0035 on my FG hydrometer. I'll chuck in some campden tabs, back sweeten and keg it tomorrow. My OG was 1.066 and I reckon it's 8.4% ABV and I can feel it after that swig I took from my test tube.

It is DRY. I should have checked it about a week ago to stop it around the mid to low 20s. I'm not a beer guy by any means because I'm not a fan of bitter/hoppyness, and this isn't that bad. It's better than I expected. Next go around I'll use slightly less hops (I used 3.something Saaz) and stay on top of the SG. Oh, and I'll use the fresh unpasteurized/no preservative stuff from my local farmer instead of the Simply Apple I got from the store.

Tried a bottle of Graff a few days ago. It was good but had some citrusy undertones. Tasted kinda like grapefruit. I'm sure it was because I used Cascade hops. It was not really the flavor I was looking for.

Does anyone have a type of hops they prefer that has worked well for them? I'm pretty new to brewing and I am not familiar with the flavor character of the different types of hops.

LSDracula said:

Tried a bottle of Graff a few days ago. It was good but had some citrusy undertones. Tasted kinda like grapefruit. I'm sure it was because I used Cascade hops. It was not really the flavor I was looking for.

Does anyone have a type of hops they prefer that has worked well for them? I'm pretty new to brewing and I am not familiar with the flavor character of the different types of hops.

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Cascades imparts a citrus flavor for sure.

Check here in the future to pick the kind of flavor you're looking for.
http://www.angelfire.com/pa/beerandweather/hops.html

Anyone have recommendations on how to end up with a somewhat sweet graff (I've heard of backsweetening but don't know much about it) that I can also bottle and have carbonated? From what I've read, this is difficult, but I figured I'd ask!

Graff is supposed to be sweeter than Apfelwein, which is why Brandon made it was it not?

I wouldn't worry about it being not sweet enough.

I get that it's sweeter than apfelwein, but tasting some as I move it from primary to secondary, it wasn't sweet enough for me. Suggestions?

Hmmm.. bottled my Graff a week and a few days ago. I was afraid of bottle bombs based on the fizzing in the bottling bucket and the rock hard PET bottle less that 24 h after bottling, but I cracked a week old crown capped bottle (I know, "Patience, grasshopper") and it was barely carbed. Can I expect that in 2 more weeks it will be OK or did I screw up somewhere??

I used 3.5 oz (by weight) Corn sugar in 3.6 gallons of Graff.

The young Graff was still quite drinkable, but it would have been so much better really sparkling!

bytemyfoot said:

I get that it's sweeter than apfelwein, but tasting some as I move it from primary to secondary, it wasn't sweet enough for me. Suggestions?

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Are you gonna be bottle conditioning or kegging. If you will be force carbonating, you can add potassium sorbate to stop fermentation, add a can or two of apple juice concentrate to sweeten to your liking. Worked pretty well for me. Just wait a couple days before adding the concentrate, otherwise you'll get some off flavors from the K-sorbate.

If you're bottle conditioning you could use Splenda to sweeten, it's a non-fermentable sugar, so no worries about it turning right back into alcohol.

Hope this helps.

I don't think anyone responded but I'm curious as well to adding fall spices (either pumpkin or apple pie spices) to the Graff. Anyone tried this or have ideas? I'm thinking the perfect cider for a hayride. Let me know what you think

Try back sweetening with lactose sugar (milk sugar), it is not fermentable by yeast. That way adding it with a priming sugar you get both carbonation and sweetened cider.

Vic

brokenanchor said:

I don't think anyone responded but I'm curious as well to adding fall spices (either pumpkin or apple pie spices) to the Graff. Anyone tried this or have ideas? I'm thinking the perfect cider for a hayride. Let me know what you think

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My newest desired adaptation to this recipe is to include mulling spices (all spice, cloves, cinnamon, etc.) for the fall. I also intend on making it like a cyser/braggot hybrid with tupelo honey. We'll see how it turns out.

I plan on spicing mine when I move it to the keg, using the Thunderstruck Pumpkin Ale spicing technique which uses this recipe posted here:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f12/pampered-chef-cinnamon-plus-recipe-139396/

Does anyone know where I should cold crash my graff to get a Hornsby level of sweetness? (I started at 1.061 if that makes a difference)

Check the grav of a hornsby?

quixand said:

Check the grav of a hornsby?

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Were u trying to be helpful? I mean seriously

Where is cville Kevin when you need him!

Brewed this last night. I'm so excited for it.

bass-a-roo said:

Were u trying to be helpful? I mean seriously

Where is cville Kevin when you need him!

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Uhmmmm...Yes. Check the FG of the Hornsby. That way you'll know what sweetness you like in your cider. Crash cool your Graff once you hit this FG.

It's going to be an experiment...but.

Recluse said:

Hmmm.. bottled my Graff a week and a few days ago. I was afraid of bottle bombs based on the fizzing in the bottling bucket and the rock hard PET bottle less that 24 h after bottling, but I cracked a week old crown capped bottle (I know, "Patience, grasshopper") and it was barely carbed. Can I expect that in 2 more weeks it will be OK or did I screw up somewhere??

I used 3.5 oz (by weight) Corn sugar in 3.6 gallons of Graff.

The young Graff was still quite drinkable, but it would have been so much better really sparkling!

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you should be good even if you bottled a little to early all you have to do is stick the bottles in the fridge when they get to the carb level you want.

Barely carbed after one week is normal. Week 3 should have great carb levels.

LSDracula said:

Tried a bottle of Graff a few days ago. It was good but had some citrusy undertones. Tasted kinda like grapefruit. I'm sure it was because I used Cascade hops. It was not really the flavor I was looking for.

Does anyone have a type of hops they prefer that has worked well for them? I'm pretty new to brewing and I am not familiar with the flavor character of the different types of hops.

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fuggles work well for not adding to the flavor profle. get them in a 3% AA or lower.

ChshreCat said:

Am I crazy, a genius or a crazy genius...

I got to thinking about graff and graff-like beverages and thought a great way to make it would be to make a batch of beer, and when you rack out of the primary, just leave a gallon or so behind with the yeast cake, and then top the fermenter up with apple juice or cider!

You could make a APA based graff and a stout based graff or whatever, depending on what type of beer you used as the base.

Waddya think?

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I'm doing this, that is a great idea. Amarillo pale ale with a gallon left behind then top off with AJ. Genius.

imprez25 said:

So, my first batch has been in bottles now for 20 days and all I can say is WOW! Nicely carbed up. Nice cidery taste, which is smoothed out with the malt and crystal. Slight bitter thanks to the Amarillo hops, which add a very slight citrus taste. Color is a clear, slightly hazy golden color that is full of CO2 bubbles. Overall this sits in my top spot now for favorite brew. (I am brewing the All Amarillo IPA this week so it may not be there for long )

Photo of graff:

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beautiful pic.

The brewing bug was itching me tonight. This recipe fit the bill perfectly since all I had to do was go get some juice. Subbed flaked barley. I'm steeping the grains now.

What does the FG usually reach on this? How is the body? I was thinking of adding a little Malto Dextrin to give it some body.

I am definately making this soon. I haven't used extract for a couple years ( except for bottle priming ) , but I think I will follow the recipe exactly. ( imagine that! )

I am thinking a half ounce of Saaz hops which is 3 something IBU's. I can always use the other half in a future beer.

I don't have a grain bag anymore. I might steep the grains on my stove top and pour it through my mash cooler with SS braid. I will MgGiver something. There will be Graff!

Just brewed up a batch tonight. Taste pretty good. Now I must let the yeasties do their work. Anyone use the musselman's apple cider wally world had on sale this week?

Just pitched the yeast in my first batch of graff. I used 4 gallons of fresh pressed apple juice from a local cider mill and about a half cup of fresh pressed quince juice. Other than the quince, I followed the recipe to a T. I can't wait to see how this turns out. Thanks Brandon!

i just found this and i am only replying so i can find it later when i am ready to try this recipe.

it seems like just what i am looking for

Checked the gravity on this last night after 7 days at 66 degrees.

Gravity read 1.010 on the nose. Not very much activity in the airlock anymore.
So that should be my FG.

SWMBO loved it. I gave her the honor of first sip.
For me, it is still a bit green, but carbonated, it would be drinkable.
Another week on the cake should refine it I would think. Then into the keg with the tea of spices to age till Halloween....and this should turn out to be a winner.

Will post follow ups as they occur.

I just put some of this in primary today. It smells great already. This is gonna be the longest 5 weeks of my life.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChshreCat
Am I crazy, a genius or a crazy genius...

I got to thinking about graff and graff-like beverages and thought a great way to make it would be to make a batch of beer, and when you rack out of the primary, just leave a gallon or so behind with the yeast cake, and then top the fermenter up with apple juice or cider!

You could make a APA based graff and a stout based graff or whatever, depending on what type of beer you used as the base.


Could You do this, with Apple juice being the only thing added to the fermentor?

Dave.

beeton said:

Could You do this, with Apple juice being the only thing added to the fermentor?

Dave.

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you could, but you'd want some DME (boiled and cooled) in there to boost it up a bit and give it some body.

drevilz4l said:

I just put some of this in primary today. It smells great already. This is gonna be the longest 5 weeks of my life.

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Good news! You can do it in 3, if you don't have to wait for it to bottle carb.

mrk305 said:

I am thinking a half ounce of Saaz hops which is 3 something IBU's. I can always use the other half in a future beer.

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I did 1/2 oz of Saaz in 6 gallons and i think it was perfect for my taste.

Finished my first batch yesterday. Used WLP041, 1/4oz Mt. Hood & 1/4oz cascade it smells AWSOME. I do have a question I used fresh pressed cider instead of AJ, and did not use K-meta am I going to have a problem bottling?
Also do I use a secondary ? Or just rack it out of the primary into the bottling bucket with the boiled corn sugar and bottle? Is there a certin FG that I'm shooting for, or just keep checking to taste? Do you cold crash it? I just don't want to screw anything up. Thanks Kris