Troubleshooting super low efficiency (50%)

I have several AG brews under my belt now but I've yet to come anywhere close to 70% efficiency. All brews sofar have been in the low 60's and today's clocked in at an even 50%. That is unacceptable as such a low efficiency will limit my beer style choices.

My gear:
I'm using 10 Gallon Igloo coolers with a false bottom in the MLT. I fly sparge, slowly. I have built rafts to eliminate headspace. I've absoultely nailed all my temps on every brew sofar and they've held extremely steady. I've also never had a stuck sparge, I typically get the right amount of liquid out and don't need to top-up.

I initially got a bad crush at my LHBS so I bought my own mill and started grinding my own at about .40. Ordered grains from different places, now I have bulk grain. Still no real improvement.

Today I conditioned my grain for the first time which produced a really amazing and perfect crush. I have typically been doing mashouts and a very minimal sparge but today I went no-mash out with a generous amount of sparge water. Worst efficiency yet, 50%

I'm starting to run out of ideas. The only idea i have left is maybe my pH is way off. Going to the homebrew store tomorrow to grab some ph testing supplies and buffer.

Here was today's recipe:

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size: 6.00 gal
Boil Size: 7.23 gal
Boil Time: 90 Minutes

Ingredients:
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Amount Item Type % or IBU
15.25 lb Pale Malt, Maris Otter (3.0 SRM) Grain 85.92 %
0.50 lb Caramel/Crystal Malt - 40L (40.0 SRM) Grain 2.82 %
0.50 lb Wheat Malt, Ger (2.0 SRM) Grain 2.82 %
1.75 oz Simcoe [13.00 %] (Dry Hop 7 days) Hops -
1.75 oz Centennial [10.00 %] (Dry Hop 7 days) Hops -
3.25 oz Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] (Dry Hop 7 Hops -
2.00 oz Warrior [15.00 %] (90 min) Hops 90.4 IBU
2.00 oz Chinook [13.00 %] (90 min) Hops 78.3 IBU
1.00 oz Simcoe [13.00 %] (45 min) Hops 33.6 IBU
1.00 oz Columbus (Tomahawk) [14.00 %] (30 min) Hops 30.3 IBU
1.00 oz Simcoe [13.00 %] (0 min) (Aroma Hop-SteepHops -
2.25 oz Centennial [10.00 %] (0 min) (Aroma Hop-SHops -
1.50 lb Sugar, Table (Sucrose) (1.0 SRM) Sugar 8.45 %
1 Pkgs California Ale (White Labs #WLP001) Yeast-Ale


Mash Schedule: Single Infusion, Light Body, No Mash Out
Total Grain Weight: 16.25 lb
----------------------------
Single Infusion, Light Body, No Mash Out
Step Time Name Description Step Temp
75 min Mash In Add 20.31 qt of water at 162.2 F 150.0 F

Fly Sparged with 4.1 Gallons of 170 degree water, 45 minutes

Hmmmmmm..... Did you check your mill gap with a feeler gauge? I've never used a raft to eliminate headspace. I also generally mill a bit finer than most and make up for it using rice hulls to avoid stuck sparges. Are you mixing your grain/water thoroughly? Have you tried using bottled water? What are your expected sg and actual sg? Which efficiency are you referring to? It looks like you are using beersmith, correct?

Aside from the usual suspects of how are you measuring volume and gravity; and are you sure your thermometer is accurate....

Maybe try a batch sparge? Is it possible you're getting some channeling with the fly sparge so you're not getting an adequate "rinse"?

Also, check out Kai's work: http://braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php/Troubleshooting_Brewhouse_Efficiency

The first step is to figure out what your conversion efficiency is....

You have similar equipment and processes to mine (10g cooler, false bottom, fly sparge).
The differences are that I usually mash a bit thicker (1qt per #), do a mash out, and sparge slower with hotter water, and get an efficiency > 80%
I used to not do a mash out, but when I started mashing out, my efficiency increased by 10%. I initially thought this was because the sparge temperature increased from the lower 150's to the upper 160's, but I now think it was because I gave the mash a thorough stirring when adding the mash out water. I believe that this stirring extracted a considerable amount of sugars from the grain before starting the sparge, thus making the sparge easier.
I also sparge for much longer than 45 minutes with that amount of grain. (O.K. I have never used more than 14# grain, but that takes me about 75 - 90 minutes to sparge), and my efficiency drops if I go much faster. A typical brew for me has about 10# grain, and I can sparge that in 30 - 45 minutes, and I stop the sparge before collecting the pre-boil volume and top off with water.
I also heat my sparge water to 185F. Some of this temperature is lost when dumping it in the HLT (another cooler), and more is lost in the delivery mechanism (sparge arm). The temperature of the sparge is usually about 165F.
You may want to try batch sparging a few times to see if it is your sparge technique that is causing the problem, but in my limited experience with batch sparging, the efficiency drops as the gravity increases.
Another possibility is to try a smaller grain bill (making up the difference with DME if necessary). I find it is much easier and faster to sparge a smaller bill than a larger one.

Hope this helps,

-a.

djsethall said:

Hmmmmmm..... Did you check your mill gap with a feeler gauge? I've never used a raft to eliminate headspace. I also generally mill a bit finer than most and make up for it using rice hulls to avoid stuck sparges. Are you mixing your grain/water thoroughly? Have you tried using bottled water? What are your expected sg and actual sg? Which efficiency are you referring to? It looks like you are using beersmith, correct?

Click to expand...

Don't have a feeler gauge, haven't seen that sold anywhere. I am mixing the grain after adding water thoroughly. Haven't used bottled water, I might try that tomorrow. beersmith predicted an OG of 1.088 at 75% effic. and I ended up with 1.062. I'm referring to the brewhouse efficiency.

That's a lot of hops. If your taking your volume from the fermenter their absorbsion of the wort is going to give a big hit on BHE. You can calculate mash efficiency when you have your boil volume before loses to hops, protein break and equipment. It will make it more consistant for beers of different hop levels.

Malticulous said:

That's a lot of hops. If your taking your volume from the fermenter their absorbsion of the wort is going to give a big hit on BHE. You can calculate mash efficiency when you have your boil volume before loses to hops, protein break and equipment. It will make it more consistant for beers of different hop levels.

Click to expand...

i took gravity pre-boil (volume 7.23 gal) as well and it was 1.049, consistent with the very low efficiency.

I get about 62%. I suspect your MO has a very low extract potential and the numbers are off because you don't have the correct laboratory numbers in your software.
http://hopville.com/recipe/667475/home-brew/name

Malticulous said:

I get about 62%. I suspect your MO has a very low extract potential and the numbers are off because you don't have the laboratory numbers in your software.

Click to expand...

it really shouldn't. I've used several different suppliers as well as using regular us 2-row in my last batch for just 60%. I would be fine with low efficiency if I was using an easier process or no-sparging or something.

I'd look at your crush, it sounds like you haven't seen/had a good one, so you really don't know what you are looking for. The easy way to troubleshoot this is to double crush and see if that improves the situation.

Good luck!

Use a tablespoon of pH 5.2. You can get it from your lhbs.

Another vote to try batch sparge, it eliminates some of the issues that can appear in fly sparge

Mash, drain, fill, stir, drain, fill, stir, drain. If that helps its not your water...

broadbill said:

I'd look at your crush, it sounds like you haven't seen/had a good one, so you really don't know what you are looking for. The easy way to troubleshoot this is to double crush and see if that improves the situation.

Good luck!

Click to expand...

+1

A feeler gauge is a set of steel "fingers" calibrated to certain thickness. If you don't have one, you really won't know. Don't trust factory settings, EVER!!! Things get jostled around during shipping etc. Not testing numbers is just taking shots in the dark. Much like using a yeast calculator without doing a proper cell count. Try a finer crush coupled with rice hulls after the crush and check your numbers then. What kind of thermometer are you using? Dial therms are useless if not calibrated. Pick up a decent lab thermometer. They are around $10 at a LHBS. Basically in order to troubleshoot, you must know ALL of your variables.

You can get a set of feeler gauges at an autoparts store or a sears. Really any where that sells auto parts or tooling. Its pretty common.