Mash ph calculators

I am about to brew my first all-grain and I am learning about water chemistry. I started looking for popular calculators and I have found three: Bru'n Water, EZ Water Calculator, and Brewer's Friend Mash Chem and Brewing Water Calc.

I put in the same information in all three and I get different ph calculations. Bru'n Water says 5.2, EZ Water says 5.7, and Brewer's says 5.5 (all three at room temp).

From all that I've read, mash ph needs to be within a strict bound but I find that the outputs of all three calculators seem to be too different for a calculation that need to be as precise as possible.

Anyone else experience this? Or am I doing something wrong?

urg8rb8 said:

I am about to brew my first all-grain and I am learning about water chemistry. I started looking for popular calculators and I have found three: Bru'n Water, EZ Water Calculator, and Brewer's Friend Mash Chem and Brewing Water Calc.

I put in the same information in all three and I get different ph calculations. Bru'n Water says 5.2, EZ Water says 5.7, and Brewer's says 5.5 (all three at room temp).

From all that I've read, mash ph needs to be within a strict bound but I find that the outputs of all three calculators seem to be too different for a calculation that need to be as precise as possible.

Anyone else experience this? Or am I doing something wrong?

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I've never worked with any of the sheets you list except Bru'n Water. It has always been very close to the outcome and I trust it to predict what my mash PH will be. I've used it enough that if I were having problems with my PH meter I would trust it to be accurate without verification.

Yep, I've notice that too. The calculators are meant to get you in the ballpark. You just have to go for it and make adjustments on the fly after measurement.

In the alternative, you can do a test mash. Mix your malt thoroughly and measure out some small amount and mash it on the stove, then test its pH. I've done that before and it really works well.

In my experience EZ Water is always .15-20 higher than the actual mash. I'm used to this so I just allow for it now.

I've found Bru'N Water to be the most accurate for me.

However, as indicated above your best course is to simply measure.

Your other option is to start with a consistent (or near consistent) base, such as ALWAYS brewing from 100% RO water, and using more standardized adjustments, as suggested in the water chemistry "primer" sticky. Ease at the cost of customization.

If you want to start from non-RO water, or custom build water profiles, you're going to need to invest in a good pH meter.

I always use EZ Watercalculator because it is still the easiest of the 3 mentioned for me to use and understand. Take yesterday for example. The estimated room temperature pH, for the Brown Ale that I brewed, was 5.42 in EZ and the actual mash pH was 5.43, well within my acceptable tolerances.

Thanks for all the replies. I'm trying to understand the process before I use it the first time. My next batch will be a lot of firsts.... will also be my first all-grain!

For your first all-grain, I would use 100% RO water and use the process in the water chemistry primer. That way you know you've got your water chemistry right without having to worry about it. I'd continue to do that until you've got your all-grain processes and recipes nailed down enough that you're ready to start tweaking the water.

Qhrumphf said:

For your first all-grain, I would use 100% RO water and use the process in the water chemistry primer. That way you know you've got your water chemistry right without having to worry about it. I'd continue to do that until you've got your all-grain processes and recipes nailed down enough that you're ready to start tweaking the water.

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Yes, good idea, that was going to be my game plan. I already bought gypsum, lactic acid, and calcium chloride. I might do the brewing next weekend so I'll get the water then.

Qhrumphf said:

For your first all-grain, I would use 100% RO water and use the process in the water chemistry primer. That way you know you've got your water chemistry right without having to worry about it. I'd continue to do that until you've got your all-grain processes and recipes nailed down enough that you're ready to start tweaking the water.

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I disagree... know what your water is (test it at ward labs) and adjust as necessary.
I mean, eventually you'll want to know what your local water supply is anyway, right? Good chance you won't need to run to the store everytime you want to brew, or buy an expensive water purifier.

acidrain said:

I disagree... know what your water is (test it at ward labs) and adjust as necessary.
I mean, eventually you'll want to know what your local water supply is anyway, right? Good chance you won't need to run to the store everytime you want to brew, or buy an expensive water purifier.

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I don't disagree that that is the eventual goal. But when you're starting out with all-grain brewing, water is still important, but there are other factors that are much less complicated and easier to work with. Even if you know the water composition at the time of measuring from Ward Labs, if you're on a municipal supply it changes constantly anyway. And then knowing what to do with that information is complicated. Using the primer at least at first guarantees at least workable if not good results. End goal is obviously being able to alter your water as necessary (I use my own tap water, treated for chlorine/chloramine, and then adjusted with salts, acid, or alkalinity as necessary based upon my own changing tap water and water compositions that I know to work well for the results I want), but that's too many variables for a new all-grain brewer to deal with. Primer process of all-RO plus predetermined salts based upon broad style groupings very much simplifies that part of the process, with a known procedure designed by someone definitely much smarter and more knowledgeable than I (and probably you as well).