Impact of pitching S-05 at 90F

quick version:
i pitched my S-05 when the wort was still 90*F, but fermentation probably didn't take off until the temp fell to 70 or less. what impact, if any, should i expect? any off-flavors?

long version:
this past sunday i brewed an IPA (1.065 OG, recipe on Hopville), and because i was rushed i ended up adding the yeast to the carboy when the wort was still 90*F. dumb move, i know, but it was a high-pressure situation. i rehydrated the S-05 with 85*F water and a little bit of wort (maybe 10% of the rehydration volume). two hours after pitching, i returned home and the temp-strip on the outside of the carboy showed 73*F with no signs of fermentation. 12 hours after pitching the temp-strip was down to 63*F and signs of a non-vigorous fermentation were visible: a quarter-inch layer of krausen and some movement in the liquid (churning) but nothing crazy. the picture below was taken 48 hours after pitching, and as you can see fermentation is happening quite fine and (external) temp holding at 63*F. based on that timeline, i believe that fermentation didn't take off until the temp was below 70*F.

so: what impact, if any, should i expect? any off-flavors?

Most likely it will be pretty fruity and full of fusel alcohols.

AmandaK said:

Most likely it will be pretty fruity and full of fusel alcohols.

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isn't that a risk when the entire fermentation is done at high temp? in my case, the temps were initially high but within a few hours they were back down to normal range, and by the time fermentation kicked into high gear the brew was down in the mid-60's.

my hope is that since the higher temp occurred during the lag time, fusels were not created. time will tell... i'm certainly hoping this doesn't turn into a hot fruity IPA.

The yeast produce esters as they ferment, if you pitched at 90 and it cooled down relatively quickly, you probably didn't have hardly any if any fermentation take place during this high temperature time. It may have stressed or killed some yeast, but I wouldn't think too bad anyways. Now that it is fermenting at a more correct temperature, I don't think you will see tons of off flavors or anything. Had it been fermenting for hours at 85+ degrees, then the esters would have been kickin like a 2 dolla ho with a hundred dollar tip.

I did the same thing with one of mine, and the flavors weren't thrown off too much. My fermentation lag was greater than normal, but that ended up being about it (but I got it cooled down fairly quick)

I'd recommend leaving the beer on the yeast cake for 2 weeks. That will give the yeast a chance to clean up any off flavors.

If fermentation was hot, it will probably taste like fruit and rubbing alcohol.

sweetcell said:

isn't that a risk when the entire fermentation is done at high temp?

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I hear ya. I'll have to go back and read Yeast again before I answer that with more authority.

My concern would be that just because you didn't see activity, doesn't mean there wasn't any. In my own personal experiences, if the beginning of the fermenation is hot, the resulting beer will be hot (read: fusels). I do think you should report back when this beer is finished and let us know how it all turned out.

In the future, remember that you can pitch later when the wort is cool. (I do this all the time in the summer, I put it in the ferm chamber to knock it down to temp before I pitch.)

Hope it all turns out okay!

TimTrone said:

I'd recommend leaving the beer on the yeast cake for 2 weeks. That will give the yeast a chance to clean up any off flavors.

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always solid advice to leave it on the cake for at least two weeks but unfortunately fusels aren't something that yeast will clean up. based on everything that i've read, there is no getting rid of fusels. once they're there, they're there. only "solutions" i've come across is to dilute them (with another batch of non-fusel beer) or to dry to cover them up with dry-hopping, back-sweetening, etc.

AmandaK said:

I hear ya. I'll have to go back and read Yeast again before I answer that with more authority.

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wow, i'd appreciate it if you could look that up. i don't have Yeast. also, people who research answers before giving advice are awesome

AmandaK said:

My concern would be that just because you didn't see activity, doesn't mean there wasn't any. In my own personal experiences, if the beginning of the fermenation is hot, the resulting beer will be hot (read: fusels). I do think you should report back when this beer is finished and let us know how it all turned out.

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i'm hoping your experience was a one-off, but we'll see. i'll definitely report back in a month or so once this batch is drinkable.

AmandaK said:

In the future, remember that you can pitch later when the wort is cool. (I do this all the time in the summer, I put it in the ferm chamber to knock it down to temp before I pitch.)

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yeah, my bad. i panicked, there was pressure to get out the door, people were running in every direction, the yeast was rehydrated and waiting... i just didn't have a cool enough head to realize that i should just leave the wort alone and deal with it upon my return. lesson learned.

I have done this many times. I find S-05 and Notty to be somewhat "tough" when it comes to pitching at too hot a temp.

Provided you maintain a suitable fermentation temperature (which you're doing), I think your beer will be fine, and you won't be able to detect any flaws. If it were liquid yeast then I'd be concerned.

Next time, just leave the wort in the bucket/carboy and pitch the next day or when you get home at night. Nothing will happen if its been sanitized - I do this a lot too when I have to leave and can't get those last 20 or so degrees out of the wort.

I think you will be fine as long as your temps got into range in 2 hours.

I wouldn't worry about it unless the beer had started foaming up while it was still above 70F. Most likely it is fine. I find that people tend to worry more than necessary when it comes to their beer when in reality beer is very forgiving. I've accidentally stuck my hand in a fermentation bucket before it had started fermenting and the beer was fine. Its always a good idea to make sure you keep things sanitary and wait until the temp is less than 80 before pitching to reduce the chance of ruining a batch but beer is more forgiving than us homebrewers give it credit for.

I just had a similar experience. I may have pitched at a higher temperature but am not sure because my digital thermometer stopped reading when I was ready to pitch. I had run out of ice for the ice bath but mixed in 2 gallons of cold water to top off. It couldn't have been warmer than 80 when I pitched and went straight into the temp. control at 67. In less than 10 hours fermentation was very strong. Foam was flowing through the blow off tube and creating almost constant bubbling. I was excited and figured fermentation was going strong. Now less than 48 hours after pitching active fermentation seems to have completely subsided. This is only my second attempt but the first bubbled for several days before subsiding. I'll try not worry but am still wondering how typical this fermentation is. I rehydrated my dry yeast for the first time and am wondering if this was the cause of the fast and furious fermentation.

i used to pitch fairly hot (80s, 90s) with s-05 and i never had any bad results as long as it got down to mid 60s or so. i used to pitch hot a lot because i was too impatient. i would say dont fret it at all

thanks for sharing your insights, folks - much appreciated.

quick update: 4 days after pitching, krausen had fallen and there were very few visible signs of fermentation. i took a gravity reading: 1.020, which is definitely higher than expected, so there was more fermentation required. to ensure that things continue to move along i put a brew belt on it to raise the temp. the carboy is now at 70-72*F, and there are small clumps of yeast that are floating to the surface of the beer then falling back down, leaving trails of haziness behind them. quite pretty. once this activity subsides i'll take another gravity reading. nice to know fermentation is still happening.

so looks like this batch will be fine after all.

Did the exact same thing. Came out tasting like a Belgian. Called it a Belgian ipa and gave most away to friends. You will definitely have off flavors, no way around it.

HokieBrewer said:

Did the exact same thing. Came out tasting like a Belgian. Called it a Belgian ipa and gave most away to friends. You will definitely have off flavors, no way around it.

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to be clear, you pitched at something like 90*F and got it to cool to ~70*F within 2 hours (i.e. before fermentation really took off) and despite the vast majority of fermentation taking place at 65*F you still had off-flavors?

if so, we now have one experience that says there might be a problem. in my case, i'm still several weeks away from being able to share my story... i need another week in primary at a minimum, then 2 or 3 weeks of carbing time.

Yes. Krausen isn't the only sign of fermentation. Yeast actually prefer it that warm. Your taste buds might not though...