New Glarus Moon Man Clone Help

Anymore updates on this? I'm looking to brew a moon man clone myself and thought I would check the progress and see how these beers were coming along.

My second batch (recipe on page 12 of this thread) is in secondary now. The only difference is that my yeast was 1056 on the first batch and 1764 on the second and it probably won't make much difference. Flibe's recipe looks very good and when he says that the taste is very, very, very similar to Moon Man, I'm not surprised. I mentioned it before but the Amarillo and Citra are probably used in Moon Man and they are very assertive hops. You could surround them with any number of other less-assertive hops and it might not make much difference because the Amarillo and Citra are going to come through anyway. I don't see Motueka & Willamette standing up to either of those hops. Cascade maybe and I'm sure they're all adding their own little something to the overall flavor. I used Mt. Hood too but that could have been Liberty, Magnum, Santiam and a handful of other hops that wouldn't impact the beer very much. I see that Flibe's last post was 10/11 so he's probably going to have that beer ready shortly. Cheers & good luck to all trying to make this beer.

My beer is ready and i've been sipping on it for two weeks (one week was early).
My recipe was slightly different from what I posted. I added Cascade at 10 min instead of 7.5. I also did not add cascade to the dry hops. Everything else was identical.

I'll have a detailed reply soon but here is what I think so far:

• CONS:
• Cascade is definitely not in this beer. Next time I'll be brewing with Chinook or something more piney.
• Unsure about Willamette.
• Yeast will absorb bittering, so when you get some in the pour, the bittering goes up dramatically.
• Bittering level is just about right. Maybe a bit more bitter than what I had ~27 IBU
• PROS
• Smell is identical. I would definitely not change Citra or Motueka.
• Taste is very delicious. Amarillo, which I know to be in "Gumball Head", is prominently there, and I'm not sure if its in Moon Man.
• Color is identical
• Malt flavor perfect. I will use the exact malt bill and boil next time.
• Very nice thick, foamy head. Better than Moon Man in this extent.

If you use my recipe you're going to get a great beer, no matter what. It will be close to Moon Man, but still not there. Needs less spicy in the taste ,more piney, hence the Chinook. Amarillo might go for something else slightly piney as well.

Simcoe is piney as well. Just a thought.

Simcoe sucks as well.

I jest. But only kinda.

Hmm, I kinda feel that way about Chinook. I haven't used it in years but the few times I tried it I got a very coarse bitterness from it. I'm not even sure that I detect "piney" in Moon Man but it's possible, I suppose, that Simcoe or Chinook are in there. I will just ramble on this for a second... It's doubtful that any of us will perfectly duplicate Moon Man. All you can really try to do is get as close as you feel you can and ask yourself if you're happy with the result. That's where I am at the moment with this beer. I tried once and made a decent beer and then I tried again and got much closer, I think. There have been other beers I have tried to clone and tweaked various times and never really got where I wanted to get. But I feel like I got close enough with this one.

Here's a picture comparison. MM on the right, delicate pour of mine on the left. Mine appears darker due to chill haze.

Overarching thought: Get the Cascade out of here!! I'm not too sure of the Willamette, but if that's like Cascade as well, see ya! No cascade in the moon man.

Moon Man is weirdly dank/resinous? out of the bottle. Was piney on draft when I made that last post. I'm going towards the dank side of things. I think before I can really start making moves with this clone, I need some more hop experience. This is definitely unique.

Anyone know a good list of dank hops? I would sub a good dank bitterer for both Cascade and Willamette.

Keep IBU's and malt bill the same. I wouldn't mess with the last three hops until this dank thing gets nailed down.

Some dank hop talk HERE.

I've had too many Moon Man to count, and consider this one of my favorite summer session ales.
If you had to classify hops as predominantly one of the four high level descriptions (piney/resinous, floral, citrus/fruit, dank/earthy), then dank would be the one category I would expect to not find any of the Moon Man hops in. I get lots of citrus, a little pine, maybe even a little floral, but I get not a hint of dank hops flavor or aroma.
Motueka does not surprise me as the single NZ hop. Cascade seems reasonable for the high grapefruit aroma, as does citra and Amarillo for the other citrus notes. Chinook seems right for the resinous variety, although probably flame out only, not for bittering. I would not go out seeking English or Noble varieties for dankness or floral notes, including American derivatives like Willamette. IMO it would be out of place for a moon man clone.

Remember too that MM is a very perishable beer in terms of drinking it young. It says right on the label that you shouldn't let it sit around too long and I assume that's because you would lose that nice hop aroma. If you had some very fresh, draft Moon Man at a tavern in Wisconsin and then compared it to a bottle that had been sitting around awhile, you might get some very different impressions. Over the summer I was up in the Northwoods fishing and drinking Two Women, Leinie Oktoberfest and some other malty beers. I went and grabbed a Moon Man and WOW, what a difference compared to what I was drinking. The hop flavor and aroma is very bright & fresh and seemed even moreso after something like Two Women (which I also like and have a clone recipe for). I probably need to fast-track my latest batch of "Man In The Moon" before my wife mentions that she wants some. Cheers.

I started this thread a long time ago, and kind of lost track of it as I moved and haven't been brewing much in the last year and a half. Anyways, glad to see a long of interest in it. I can tell you have I for certain 4 of the 5 hops, unfortunately, I don't want to tell them in fear of getting someone in trouble =( However, Hanso's post and flibe's from a page back is very interesting....hint hint!

While 3 of the hops I know about are easy to tell (and have been mentioned), 1 of them I have never used before and never really thought of. However one whiff of the bag of hops, and it was a major light bulb.

OK, since we have come this far Ill give the 3 that are pretty easy to spot anyways. Chinook, Amarillo, and Citra/Riwaka (I guess they sub Citra when Riwaka is unavailable).

I think the more important thing is figuring out the hop schedule for the flavor. As much as I was looking for a clone, I have come to realize its impossible without major insider info. So I do plan on brewing this in a few weeks, but it will just be an IPA/APA, not a clone.

BrewNinja1 said:

I started this thread a long time ago, and kind of lost track of it as I moved and haven't been brewing much in the last year and a half. Anyways, glad to see a long of interest in it. I can tell you have I for certain 4 of the 5 hops, unfortunately, I don't want to tell them in fear of getting someone in trouble =( However, Hanso's post and flibe's from a page back is very interesting....hint hint!

While 3 of the hops I know about are easy to tell (and have been mentioned), 1 of them I have never used before and never really thought of. However one whiff of the bag of hops, and it was a major light bulb.

OK, since we have come this far Ill give the 3 that are pretty easy to spot anyways. Chinook, Amarillo, and Citra/Riwaka (I guess they sub Citra when Riwaka is unavailable).

I think the more important thing is figuring out the hop schedule for the flavor. As much as I was looking for a clone, I have come to realize its impossible without major insider info. So I do plan on brewing this in a few weeks, but it will just be an IPA/APA, not a clone.

Click to expand...

So Amarillo, Citra, Chinook and Motueka are 4 of the 5? Come on, tell us. You know you're going to tell us eventually anyway so come on... tell us what you know!

Like you, I have concluded that the best way to 'clone' a beer is to get close enough to it so that you're happy with it and it satisfies your need to have one. Living in Illinois, I could get New Glarus beer and I have driven over the border and gone to the brewery too. But to be able to make a beer that's enough like Moon Man to feel like I have Moon Man on tap in my house? That's gold.

Im fairly certain that motueka isn't in it. My source said that Riwaka was the NZ hop, but they sub in Citra for it when not available (so pretty much always...haha). No idea what the 5th is. However the person said that the 4 I know would give you a pretty close version, so Im assuming it doesn't add a ton of profile whatever it is.

I'm going to be remaking this brew with nearly the same schedule except Chinook only in there for Willamette and Cascade. I've come to the realization that flavoring hops are in that 15-10 minute spot and that the Willamette and Cascade are dominating my flavor.

There's something piney in the keg, and funky/dank in the bottle that gives Moon Man its character. I'm drinking a bottle as we speak: this funky-dank flavor is tart. If anyone else has a suggestion for the funky, dank, tart flavor in Moon Man, let me know.

I'm starting to taste the Cascade more and more as mine ages and its really bugging me. Do yourself a favor and stick away from Cascade.

At kenlenard: I definitely think this can be cloned. Its difficult because New Glarus is just really tasteful with all their brews, especially this one. You cant just hop bomb and over saturate.

At BrewNinja1: Thanks for the hints.

So I've been a long time lurker on HBT and I recently went on the hard hat tour with this thread in mind. Decided it was time to finally take the leap, sign up, and post what I was told.

The tour guide was an assistant brewer at NG and I asked him about the hops in MM. He repeated the 4/1 line but refused to give the New Zealand hops.

What he did say however was that Amarillo, Simcoe, and Citra were definitely in MM. I hope this helps someone.

Interesting.

If that's the case, the simcoe is the 5th hop. I do plan on brewing a "similar" moon man beer soon. Cant wait to see how it tastes.

I agree BrewNinja. Let us know how it turns out...I'm interested to see what's in your recipe makeup looks like.

Plan on doing a hop schedule as follows in the next few weeks...What do you guys think?

.75 oz. Simcoe 15 mins
.75 oz. Chinook 10 mins
.75 oz. Amarillo 7.5 mins
.75 oz. Citra 2 mins
.75 oz. Motueka 0 mins

Dry hop with 1.25 oz. of each

mo_homebrew said:

Plan on doing a hop schedule as follows in the next few weeks...What do you guys think?

.75 oz. Simcoe 15 mins
.75 oz. Chinook 10 mins
.75 oz. Amarillo 7.5 mins
.75 oz. Citra 2 mins
.75 oz. Motueka 0 mins

Dry hop with 1.25 oz. of each

Click to expand...

Turn the dry hops down to 1 Oz each or less. Maybe .75 oz. I did 4 Oz last time and it just sucked up beer instead of adding extra flavor.

I had a Moon Man yesterday, and I would put in the Citra where the Chinook is. Timing schedule looks fine.

Let us know how it turns out.

I pulleys hydro sample today and it hit 1.010 in 5 days. Smell is dead on. I cracked a moon man and smelled them side by side. Actually straight out of the fermenter my sample had a bit more aroma. I'm going to give some more time to clean up in primary then dry hop and cold crash. Can't waitron get this one in the bottle. I brewed this for my sons first birthday party on jan 18 and think it will be a big hit.

mo_homebrew said:

I pulleys hydro sample today and it hit 1.010 in 5 days. Smell is dead on. I cracked a moon man and smelled them side by side. Actually straight out of the fermenter my sample had a bit more aroma. I'm going to give some more time to clean up in primary then dry hop and cold crash. Can't waitron get this one in the bottle. I brewed this for my sons first birthday party on jan 18 and think it will be a big hit.

Click to expand...

This was my experience with mine. Did you taste the sample? Mine smelt exact, but the "funky tangy" moon man taste was not there--was replaced with cascades taste.

Excited to hear your results so we can post this up in the recipe forums.

Ive drank two but haven't done a side by side taste test. I do have some moon man in the fridge that I've been saving so I think me and my wife will do some taste testing. It's close for sure so we'll see what they taste like side by side. I know mine is a bit darker so my grain bill may need tweaking but it's not enough to affect flavor.

Edit: I does have the funky tangy taste as you describe it. I do not think there is cascade in this beer.

We'll here they are side by side. Mine is a bit darker because I used C30 in place of C20. LHBS doesn't carry C20 may go with C15 next time.


Smell similar but I have a bit of a sweeter smell mixing in from the malt. Not sure if that's the C30 or not. Definitely the same hop mix as moon man but moon man does not have the sweet smell mixing in.

Taste is also similar in that they have same overall hop profile but mine has that same sweetness at the end. Wish I had enough experience to know where it was coming from. Moon man has a cleaner, dryer and slightly more bitter finish. I may need to look at mashing a bit lower and changing crystal to drop this slight sweetness I can detect.

Wife just got home and echoed my feelings.

I think next time I will knock the crystal down, mash a little lower but keep my hop schedule the same.

Here was my grain bill:
8 lb pale 2 row
8oz C30
8oz Carapils
.75 lb Pilsen DME

This was my first time going almost all grain and mash in 5 gallon cooler. Could have fit all my grain for this batch but was taking it easy since it was my first run. Also working on dialing in strike water temp so this could have also played a part if mash temps were too high.

It's very tasty beer as a stand alone beer but side by side moon man wins out.

Update:

After a week in the fridge, sweetness is gone, a bit of bite is in their to leave a nice crisp finish.

Very very tasty and very close in my opinion to the real thing.

I don't think you will be disappointed with those hope in the order.

Please put in a full recipe for the record. I don't think I'm going to get to brewing it until late spring early summer (I have way too much beer). I'm excited to try.

I'm visiting this thread again because I happen to have mine on tap (again) and had a few glasses of it tonight while watching the Blackhawks game. Damn, what a nice beer. I know I'm off in left field compared to you guys because I am only using three hops in mine (Mt. Hood, Amarillo, Citra) but I have to say... I love this beer and it's my wife's favorite beer of mine. I stopped at my LHBS this week and picked up more Amarillo & Citra and another 50lb sack of Rahr Pale Ale malt and I'm going to make this beer again soon. Do we think we know the hops now? Amarillo, Citra (or Riwaka), Chinook, Simcoe and... what was the last one? Anyway, I am officially satisfied with mine whether it be Moon Man or not. Mine was inspired by MM and when my wife first tasted the commercial MM, she said something to the effect of, "I love that citrusy-grapefruit flavor!" so she is probably referring to the Amarillo and when you mix Citra with the Amarillo... I think you have a great pale ale combination. Cheers Brewing Brothers!

Ken, congratulations on your pale ale! To a certain extent I'm beginning to think that "hop blends" of 5+ varieties are really just "insurance" against supply and integrity of taste/aroma or just a means to fluff your feathers. I could definitely be wrong and I'm surely not a super taster. Isn't that the idea of blends like Falconer's Flight, Zythos, etc? Maybe simpler is better or just as good?

14thstreet said:

Ken, congratulations on your pale ale! To a certain extent I'm beginning to think that "hop blends" of 5+ varieties are really just "insurance" against supply and integrity of taste/aroma or just a means to fluff your feathers. I could definitely be wrong and I'm surely not a super taster. Isn't that the idea of blends like Falconer's Flight, Zythos, etc? Maybe simpler is better or just as good?

Click to expand...

Possibly. I see where you're going with that and I admit that I don't know everything that goes into hop combinations, I just know that I have blended some hops in the past that came out nicely together. For those buds of mine that like Moon Man, they come over and taste my "Man In The Moon" pale ale and say, "Yum, it's like Moon Man!". My wife actually calls it Moon Man. Some people who do not care for Moon Man (my sister-in-law for one) tastes it and says, "Ugh, it tastes like Moon Man...". So this is my version of Moon Man and I have been able to make it consistently 4 or 5 times now and I really like it. I tend not to drink much of it because I know my wife likes it. Luckily my LHBS still has plenty of Amarillo because I tried to order it online from a few places who were sold out. For those who need to make Moon Man exactly as it comes from New Glarus, I wish them luck. I know that there are so many variables that it would be a tough assignment. I am happy getting close and having a beer in the spirit of the original and one that reminds me of the commercial version. I think that's as good as I can do. Cheers!

14thstreet said:

Ken, congratulations on your pale ale! To a certain extent I'm beginning to think that "hop blends" of 5+ varieties are really just "insurance" against supply and integrity of taste/aroma or just a means to fluff your feathers. I could definitely be wrong and I'm surely not a super taster. Isn't that the idea of blends like Falconer's Flight, Zythos, etc? Maybe simpler is better or just as good?

Click to expand...

I would agree with the insurance policy idea.

If I had to brew this again today I would place in

Simcoe, chinook, citra, amarillo, motueka, in order, within the last thirty minutes or so. I have a hard time deciding between citra and chinook in their positions.

Falconers flight 7C is definitely not in this, as I just made a smash with it.

Stick to those five and you're gonna come out pretty good.

Falconers flight 7C is definitely not in this, as I just made a smash with it.

Click to expand...

Sorry I'm going off topic, but you are correct in that statement. I made an all late addition /dry hop smash of 7c beer, the same additions as an all citra one I love. The 7c one is barely drinkable, an odd tart citrus/raspberry thing going on. Still struggling through the last of 10 gallons. It can be tolerated if mixed with some IPA, but not alone. Scared to use the rest of the pound, in moderation I'm guessing.

Will post up full recipe later tonight.


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Moon Man Clone
American Pale Ale
5 gallons
All Grain
1.050~OG → 1.011~FG → 5.2%ABV33 IBU5.9°L SRM
Yeast
Fermentis - Safale US-05
US-05 - Safale US-05
Fermentis (Ale)0.18 ounces


Fermentables
9.62 pounds
Pale Ale
37ppg, 3°L8 pounds 83.1%
Malt - Extra light
42ppg, 2°L12 ounces 7.8%
CaraPils
32ppg, 2°L8 ounces 5.2%
Crystal 30L
34ppg, 30°L6 ounces


Miscellaneous
2 tablespoons
Whirlfloc
Fining2 tablespoons


Batch/Fly
1 hour, 7.24 gallons
Strike. Target 150°F 3.33 gallons at 161°F
1 hour
Sparge3.91 gallons at 170°F

Boil
1 hour

Simcoe hops
11.8%, Pellet0.75 ounces
15 minutes (+45)
Chinook hops
13%, Pellet0.75 ounces
10 minutes (+50)
Whirlfloc
Fining2 tablespoons
10 minutes (+50)
Amarillo hops
8.2%, Pellet0.75 ounces
7 minutes (+53)
Citra hops
12.4%, Pellet0.75 ounces
2 minutes (+58)
moteuka hops
7.2%, Pellet0.75 ounces
0 minutes (+60)

Ferment
14 days, single stage
Start fermentation
63°F
14 days (+0 days)

Dry Hops
Amarillo hops
7.9%, Pellet0.5 ounces
6 days (+8 days)
Chinook hops
13%, Pellet0.5 ounces
6 days (+8 days)
Citra hops
11%, Pellet0.5 ounces
6 days (+8 days)
moteuka hops
7.3%, Pellet0.5 ounces
6 days (+8 days)
Simcoe hops
13%, Pellet0.5 ounces
6 days (+8 days)


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flibe said:

I would agree with the insurance policy idea.



If I had to brew this again today I would place in



Simcoe, chinook, citra, amarillo, motueka, in order, within the last thirty minutes or so. I have a hard time deciding between citra and chinook in their positions.



Falconers flight 7C is definitely not in this, as I just made a smash with it.



Stick to those five and you're gonna come out pretty good.

Click to expand...

Flibe as you can see I used the same 5 hops but I had Amarillo and citra switched. Probably doesn't make any difference though. With .75 oz on each addition I started at 15 mins left in boil and bitterness slightly more prevalent than real moon man so I think moving chinook towards the end may help that. I'm going to brew again (my dad loves this stuff) and I may tweak the hops schedule a bit but will stick with those 5 hops.


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This is good news---So do you think we have it figured out?

Ok, good thread so far! I think this beer needs all late hops, and a massive dry hop. Also, I think it's pretty pale, so I'm keeping the SRM low. I used the 4 hops that seemed to be confirmed in this thread, but went with the idea that amarillo and citra should be leading the way. I would plan on adding half of the whirlpool hops at flameout and the other half after 15-20 mins (or when the temp gets around 180). The dryhop would be two stages as well for 3-4 days each. Shooting to try something in a few weeks. Here is what I have so far. I'm a little worried there isn't enough grain here for the hop bill, but I just have start somewhere. Let me know what you think!

Estimated OG: 1.052 SG
Estimated Color: 5.0 SRM

Ingredients:
------------
Amt Name Type # %/IBU
7 lbs Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 1 62.2 %
3 lbs 8.0 oz Pale Malt, Maris Otter (3.0 SRM) Grain 2 31.1 %
12.0 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt - 20L (20.0 SRM) Grain 3 6.7 %

0.50 oz Amarillo [9.20 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 4 7.3 IBUs
0.50 oz Citra [12.00 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 5 9.5 IBUs
0.25 oz Chinook [13.00 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 6 5.1 IBUs
0.25 oz Simcoe [13.00 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 7 5.1 IBUs

0.50 oz Amarillo [9.20 %] - Boil 5.0 min Hop 8 2.9 IBUs
0.50 oz Citra [12.00 %] - Boil 5.0 min Hop 9 3.8 IBUs
0.25 oz Chinook [13.00 %] - Boil 5.0 min Hop 10 2.1 IBUs
0.25 oz Simcoe [13.00 %] - Boil 5.0 min Hop 11 2.1 IBUs

1.00 oz Amarillo [9.20 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 0.0 Hop 12 0.0 IBUs
1.00 oz Citra [12.00 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 0.0 m Hop 13 0.0 IBUs
0.50 oz Chinook [13.00 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 0.0 Hop 14 0.0 IBUs
0.50 oz Simcoe [13.00 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 0.0 Hop 15 0.0 IBUs

1.00 oz Amarillo [9.20 %] - Dry Hop 3.0 Days Hop 17 0.0 IBUs
1.00 oz Citra [12.00 %] - Dry Hop 3.0 Days Hop 18 0.0 IBUs
0.50 oz Chinook [13.00 %] - Dry Hop 3.0 Days Hop 19 0.0 IBUs
0.50 oz Simcoe [13.00 %] - Dry Hop 3.0 Days Hop 20 0.0 IBUs

You seem very close. I've done a lot of research, even more drinking of it, but have absolutely no experience trying to clone it.

That said, my feedback is to drop the Maris otter and go with more 2 row. Also the ibu is mayyyyybe slightly high, like less than 5 ibus too high, but I would probably just try what you have on the hops schedule and learn from there. Post back, please, with your results.

Thanks for the feedback! I honestly don't remember where I came up with this grain bill. I started the recipe a while ago, and decided now was the time to get back to it. I agree that the IBU could be a little high. However, I have found that with recipes that depend on getting IBU's all from late hops, it's hard to predict exactly how it will turn out with software. So, I'll just give it a shot as a first guess and move from there. If it's too bitter we can move the 5 min addition to 2 mins, or reduce the hops somewhere. I want to pull this off during 4th of July week, so hopefully I can make that happen.

I agree, it is hard to know sometimes with late addition hops. Glad you are going for it. Don't forget to post back results and impressions.

I recently made another try on moon man with all later additions of: simcoe, citra, amarillo, and galaxy. Hops tasted 75% there. There's still something missing.

There is almost a lactic acid tangy flavor in moon man which is not bitter. I'm really not sure of it. I might add in lactic acid in the mash next time around. I wouldn't be surprised about lactic acid with the water profile in Wisconsin...

My grain bill was

8 lbs Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 1 66.7 %
2 lbs White Wheat Malt (2.4 SRM) Grain 2 16.7 %
1 lbs Munich Malt (9.0 SRM) Grain 3 8.3 %
1 lbs Vienna Malt (3.5 SRM)


And my IBU's were at ~31-34. There was a bit too much bitterness.

Good to know about the ibu. I would imagine 30 is the highest end of the range. The key to MM is the hops, not the grain bill, which is as simple as can be.

I can post my current recipe, never made it yet, and frankly with my brewing line-up I doubt I will be getting around to it for at least a year. It's simply too low priority for my when I can just pick it up at the grocery store for $15 a 12 pack and.have a guaranteed great product. If anyone wants to try mine I'm fairly confident it will be close.

My recipe is for 1.050, 26 IBU Tinseth, 5-6 SRM, clean yeast. Grist is 95% 2 row, 5% 20L crystal, on a 75 minute mash at 152. Hops are a blend of Citra, Chinook, Amarillo, Columbus. On a 5 gal recipe I have currently 0.5 oz at 20 min, 1 oz at 10 min, 3 oz at 0, 5 oz dry/keg hops.