IPA Hop Schedule Feedback

I aim to brew my first IPA next weekend. Just looking for some feedback on my hops & hop schedule. Thanks in advance!

1.00 oz Simcoe @ 60 min (37.5 IBUs)
0.25 oz Amarillo @ 60 (5.6 IBUs)
0.25 oz Amarillo @ 45 (5.1 IBUs)
0.50 oz Amarillo @ 30 (8.6 IBUs)
0.50 oz Amarillo @ 15 (5.5 IBUs)
0.25 oz Amarillo @ 1 (0.2 IBUs)
1.00 oz Simcoe dry hop 1 week before bottling
0.25 oz Amarillo dry hop 1 week before bottling

I believe you'll find that the additions at 45 and 30 won't do much for the bittering or aroma. You may be better to round the 45 up and the 30 down.

Not a bad start, but IPAs are usually all about hops flavor and aroma. Since there aren't many flavor hops (just .5 oz at 15) or aroma hops (just .25 oz at 1 min), then it'll be more bitter with less hops flavor and aroma.

I'd do this (if you can get more hops):

1.00 oz Simcoe @ 60 min (37.5 IBUs)
1 oz Amarillo @ 15
.5 oz simcoe @ 10
1 oz amarillo @ 5
.5 oz simcoe @ 0
.5 oz amarillo @ 0
dryhop with .5 oz simcoe and 1 oz amarillo 5-7 days.

If you can't get more simcoe or amarillo, I'd use something like magnum to bitter at 60 minutes, and then use whatever simcoe and amarillo you can scrounge up for 15-0 minutes.

Trying to stay similar IBU, I'd probably go something like.

0.75 oz Amarillo Gold [8.50 %] - First Wort 60.0 Hop 21.4 IBUs
0.50 oz Simcoe [13.00 %] - First Wort 60.0 min Hop 21.8 IBUs
0.50 oz Amarillo Gold [8.50 %] - Boil 20.0 min Hop 7.9 IBUs
0.25 oz Simcoe [13.00 %] - Boil 20.0 min Hop 6.0 IBUs
0.50 oz Amarillo Gold [8.50 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 6.4 IBUs
0.25 oz Simcoe [13.00 %] - Boil 5.0 min Hop 2.0 IBUs
0.25 oz Amarillo Gold [8.50 %] - Boil 1.0 min Hop 0.3 IBUs
1.00 oz Simcoe [13.00 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days Hop 0.0 IBUs

If you don't want to first wort, get most of your IBU's at 60 minutes, then slam the rest of your hops under 20 minutes.

Many feel Simcoe/Amarillo for bittering is a waste since it's so awesome in flavor and hard to find.

If you can find something else for bittering, I would go that route. Use the extra Simcoe/Amarillo in your dry hop. I like lots of dry hop. Moar dry hop!

I think a great starting point for most american IPA recipes is :

1 oz high AA hop @ 60 min
2-4 oz aroma hops from 15-0 min
3 oz dry hop

You get the bulk of your bittering from the 60 min addition and then just load up the late hops for flavor and aroma.

I agree with what most are saying here. I like my bittering hop at 60, flavor hop at 20, and aroma at 5. Then dry hop the bejesus out of it!

Awesome. Thank you everyone for the great responses. I'm no hop aficionado, so I definately need the help! I just made some equiptment adjustments in BeerSmith2 due to the results of my first AG (yesterday), and now it looks like the IBU numbers I posted above would be lower. I want 60 IBUs. I had originally planned to use 1 oz Apollo hops for the bittering, but unfortunately neither of my LHBS had any Apollo. Here's the going plan that should hit 60 IBUs even and only requires buying 2 more oz of Amarillo and 1 oz something like Magnum or Columbus or whatever's in stock.

1.00 oz (??) @ 60 min
0.25 oz Simcoe @ 60
1.00 oz Amarillo @ 15
0.50 oz Simcoe @ 10
1.00 oz Amarillo @ 5
0.50 oz Simcoe @ 1
0.25 oz Amarillo @ 1
0.75 oz Simcoe dry hop
1.75 oz Amarillo dry hop

I'd take out the simcoe at 60 minutes- you won't get any flavor out of them, and so they would be wasted. I'd stick them in at 15 minutes the the .5 oz you already have there. I love adding a ton of hops at 5 minutes and 0 minutes, so I might suggest taking .75 ounces out of the amarillo dryhop and use it there.

An ounce of warrior (or even less, depending on AAUs), magnum, or galena should be fine for bittering hops.

Fair enough! That makes a lot of sense. Thank you Yooper!

Just remember that early is for bitterness, middle is for flavor, and at the end you get some flavor, and aroma, which will help translate to flavor as well, since smell goes hand in hand.

Dry hop it to death, and have the load of additions at 15 till flame out.

http://hopville.com/recipe/1325958/american-ipa-recipes/hr

That is the best IPA I have ever had. It is a clone from a brew pub up in Green Bay. Brewing it at home, I did a 30 minute ht stand before I started cooling. AWESOME hop flavor and aroma from it. I use that sort of hop schedule for all my hoppy beers now.

TyTanium said:

Many feel Simcoe/Amarillo for bittering is a waste since it's so awesome in flavor and hard to find.

If you can find something else for bittering, I would go that route. Use the extra Simcoe/Amarillo in your dry hop. I like lots of dry hop. Moar dry hop!

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I'm one of those many. I think it's a complete waste of amazing aroma/flavor hops to use simcoe and/or amarillo for bittering.

I agree on using them for bittering, but hops are cheap. $2 for an oz isn't a whole helluva lot, so if you can afford it and want to use it, why not.

I did an IPA with nothing but Simcoe the whole way through, and it's great.

Warrior has become my bittering hop of choice. Nice, clean bittering and it is super high alpha. Perfect for what it is, and it is usually cheaper than all the "choice" hops such as Simcoe, Amarillo and even Centennial at my LHBS

FATC1TY said:

I agree on using them for bittering, but hops are cheap. $2 for an oz isn't a whole helluva lot, so if you can afford it and want to use it, why not.

I did an IPA with nothing but Simcoe the whole way through, and it's great.

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It's not that they're not 'good' bittering hops, they are. It's that they're very popular flavor/aroma hops with both home and pro brewers, so they tend to go in short supply before the following year's harvest. Thus the 'complete waste' statement. Bittering hops are bittering hops, best to go wit something high alpha, and high availability.

BuddyWeiser said:

1.00 oz (??) @ 60 min

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I would absolutely use Magnums here. Great, clean bittering hops. If you do them as a FWH, it'll give a lot of bitterness, but even less harshness than normal. Columbus or Chinook will also work, or even Summit. But IMO, Magnums are the best med-high alpha for pure bittering. The way I look at it is if you get a really good, clean bitter then your flavor and aroma late additions will shine all that much more. Use your bittering addition to bitter the beer, then get them out of the way of the main act of an IPA.

0.25 oz Simcoe @ 60

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I'd move this one to 20 or 15 with the Amarillo. Simcoes have a wonderful flavor and aroma that will be gone if you drop them at 60.

1.00 oz Amarillo @ 15
0.50 oz Simcoe @ 10
1.00 oz Amarillo @ 5
0.50 oz Simcoe @ 1
0.25 oz Amarillo @ 1

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These look great

0.75 oz Simcoe dry hop
1.75 oz Amarillo dry hop

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I'd think about increasing both of these. With the hop sched you have, I'd probably do an oz of Simcoe and 2 oz of Amarillo. Maybe more.

Drink it young. Those volatiles will hit their peak in a matter of a few weeks.

Other's opinions will differ, however.

I have realized that it would be a mistake not to go all out. I want 5 gallons of GOOD IPA. I have modified my plan from 4 oz of hops to 10!
1.00 oz Magnum @ 60 (32.4 IBUs)
1.50 oz Amarillo @ 15 (14.7 IBUs)
0.50 oz Amarillo @ 10 (3.6 IBUs)
0.50 oz Simcoe @ 10 (5.5 IBUs)
1.00 oz Amarillo @ 5 (3.9 IBUs)
0.50 oz Simcoe @ 5 (3.0 IBUs)
1.00 oz Amarillo @ 0
1.00 oz Simcoe @ 0
2.00 oz Amarillo dry hop
1.00 oz Simcoe dry hop

I really don't understand the whole "save the good hops" line of thinking. If you are brewing thousands of a barrels, sure. If you are kicking out 5 gallon batches, what is the point? The price difference between an "expensive" hop and a "cheap" hop is $1-2 per ounce. Just find a nice, clean bittering hop that you enjoy and go with it.

It's not price, it's availability.

And with multiple batches of 6-10+ oz each, $1-$2 difference adds up quickly.

I can understand and relate to both sides of that discussion. The $$ saved and availability all weigh in, but the bottom line IMO is that efficiency, even on a small scale, is at least some what beneficial. Maybe after I've made more bitter/hoppy beers, I will get a better feel for the difference between using one hop vs. another for my 60 min additions and could then make a personal choice on what to use. Right now, my taste buds just tell me bitter is bitter. :cross:

billl said:

I really don't understand the whole "save the good hops" line of thinking. If you are brewing thousands of a barrels, sure. If you are kicking out 5 gallon batches, what is the point? The price difference between an "expensive" hop and a "cheap" hop is $1-2 per ounce. Just find a nice, clean bittering hop that you enjoy and go with it.

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Simple..... you save the good aroma/flavor hops for..... aroma and flavor. It's not a cost issue, it's a 'why waste a good aroma hops on bittering a beer' issue. It's that you'd be wasting the aroma/flavor properties of a hop like Simcoe if you used it to bitter. Also, hops like Simcoe, Amarillo, Citra and other popular IPA hops go in short supply later in the season, like now, which is why people shouldn't be wasting them on bittering adds. Understand now?

NordeastBrewer77 said:

It's not that they're not 'good' bittering hops, they are. It's that they're very popular flavor/aroma hops with both home and pro brewers, so they tend to go in short supply before the following year's harvest. Thus the 'complete waste' statement. Bittering hops are bittering hops, best to go wit something high alpha, and high availability.

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Understandable. I've heard of people here complaining their store or online store is out of "X" hops.

I don't buy ingredients online, and my LHBS hasn't been short, or mentioned being short on anything. Lucky I guess.

In the internet age, you never have to be "out" of a hop.

If you like it, use it. It isn't a "waste" if you like it better. Not all hops provide a nice, smooth bitterness at high IBU levels, so I wouldn't put just any "cheep" hop in to save a buck. On of the best IPA's in the world is Bells 2 hearted and they use "pricey" centennial hops to bitter.

And no, we aren't talking about 6oz of hops for bittering. We are talking about 1oz - maybe 1.5oz depending on AA.

billl said:

In the internet age, you never have to be "out" of a hop.

If you like it, use it. It isn't a "waste" if you like it better. Not all hops provide a nice, smooth bitterness at high IBU levels, so I wouldn't put just any "cheep" hop in to save a buck. On of the best IPA's in the world is Bells 2 hearted and they use "pricey" centennial hops to bitter.

And no, we aren't talking about 6oz of hops for bittering. We are talking about 1oz - maybe 1.5oz depending on AA.

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Horizon and magnum hops both lend a nice, smooth bitterness. Actually, more so than thinks like columbus and Simcoe, IME. Again, no one's saying anything about saving money, Billl, it's about having the good flavor/aroma hops to use late in the boil, or in another beer altogether.

Anyone in the US can have any hop they want for any part of the boil - or after. You can buy all you want of virtually any variety - on a homebrewing scale. If you like horizon or magnum for bittering, more power to you. That doesn't mean that a recipe that uses simcoe is wrong or wasteful or whatever. There is absolutely no reason to suggest "saving" the simcoe for some more noble purpose. Some of the best IPA's on the planet use "flavor/aroma" hops for bittering. There is absolutely nothing wrong with that. In fact, I'm drinking a fantastic IPA as I type this that had simcoe as the bittering and I don't feel the least bit bad about it.

Ultimately, if you like it - brew it. No need to apologize for personal preference.

billl said:

Anyone in the US can have any hop they want for any part of the boil - or after. You can buy all you want of virtually any variety - on a homebrewing scale. If you like horizon or magnum for bittering, more power to you. That doesn't mean that a recipe that uses simcoe is wrong or wasteful or whatever. There is absolutely no reason to suggest "saving" the simcoe for some more noble purpose. Some of the best IPA's on the planet use "flavor/aroma" hops for bittering. There is absolutely nothing wrong with that. In fact, I'm drinking a fantastic IPA as I type this that had simcoe as the bittering and I don't feel the least bit bad about it.

Ultimately, if you like it - brew it. No need to apologize for personal preference.

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No one said anything about the recipe being 'wrong' or the hops being needed for a 'more noble' cause. Nor did anyone suggest anyone should 'feel the least bit bad' for using whatever hop they wanted for bittering. I'm well aware that many IPAs use a single hop for bittering and aroma, in fact, one of my favorites is all centennial (and not Two Hearted), I was merely making a suggestion based on the OP's question. I'm terribly sorry if that offends you, Billl, but I'm beginning to see a pattern of you being offended by folks here giving answers that aren't exactly the ones you'd give.

billl said:

You can buy all you want of virtually any [hop] variety - on a homebrewing scale.

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Many have found this to be untrue.

"Nor did anyone suggest anyone should 'feel the least bit bad' for using whatever hop they wanted for bittering. "

Actually, you did. "Also, hops like Simcoe, Amarillo, Citra and other popular IPA hops go in short supply later in the season, like now, which is why people shouldn't be wasting them on bittering adds. "

No need to scold a new brewer for using the hops they want. I'm not offended by you liking a different hop for bittering, but I do think it is wrong to tell someone they shouldn't be using flavor hops to bitter.


TyTanium - If you can't find a hop, just post it here and I bet someone will respond with a source within a couple hours. If you want Simcoe, norther brewer has it for $1.99/oz and will sell you up to 8oz per order. http://www.northernbrewer.com/shop/simcoe-pellets-1-oz.html.

billl said:

"Nor did anyone suggest anyone should 'feel the least bit bad' for using whatever hop they wanted for bittering. "

Actually, you did. "Also, hops like Simcoe, Amarillo, Citra and other popular IPA hops go in short supply later in the season, like now, which is why people shouldn't be wasting them on bittering adds. "

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Sorry if that made you feel bad, but it wasn't intended to. My opinion is still the same, I think it's a waste of good flavor/aroma hops to use them for bittering. It's my opinion and if you don't like it,

This is an argument over nothing. Brew how you want, we're just presenting opinions here.

TyTanium said:

This is an argument over nothing. Brew how you want, we're just presenting opinions here.

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Thank you. That's all I'm trying to get across, what I'd personally do, which is really all that I can speak for.

Quality in does not always equal quality out. You can use highly flavorful/highly aromatic, uber-prized hops in your American IPA, and they may not provide the ooompf you had hoped for if you happened to use too little/too much, placed them in the wrong spot, hindered their potential with the wrong recipe, or masked their character with the malt/yeast. Who knows, you may get lucky for using a blend of Citra, Simcoe, and Amarillo as a 60 minute addition, but I would put my money on the beer not being great solely because you chose to use those hops early.

I happen to agree that bittering with a hard to get hop, at $3.25 an ounce, in a faulty recipe, is a waste. There are a lot of naive brewers who stock up on the most talked about hops, are so proud of their purchase, and then are offended when someone says that they are not being the best choice for bittering with. Try not to be so defensive. It is simply a recommendation based on experience and knowledge of the brewer who gave you the advice. Take it or leave it. You can use hops like these for bittering if that is your prerogative, but you're essentially throwing your money, and the flavor and aroma potential of those hops down the drain IMO. In my experience, I happen to think that boiling hops like these for extended periods does not help the flavor/aroma character of the IPA.

You can choose not to agree if you wish That is your right as a human being with your own mind capable of intelligent thinking.