1st all grain meltdown

F___'IT!

10 lbs of grain down the toilet.

I'm ready to throw the MLT out the back door.

First, I heated 3.5 gallons of water to start to mash and when I poured it into the MLT the valve started pouring water out the seal.

The idiot that put together the unit forgot to tighten the valve threads around the O ring.

Had to toss the water, fix it and start boiling all over again.

Since it was my first time, I preheated MLT and when the 2nd boil was ready, I filled up the MLT with the water, calculated to the right temp to reach a strike of 152.

Added my grain and took a temp reading - It was over 162!

Quickly added 2 qts of cold water to adjust it and the temp dropped to 138!

I grabbed more strike water at 168 and added it but it didn't raise the temp.

I'm stuck with 10 lbs of grain sitting at 145 degrees in way more strike water than I wanted.

I'm tossing it.

Crap!

Do you have a big enough pot to hold the whole mash? You can dump it in a big pot, heat it over low heat while constantly stirring, and get it to the proper temperature. Then you can just dump it into the MLT to hold for an hour.

Don't dump!

Will that work? It's got about a gallon more water than recommended for the mash?

When you mix your grain and water you have to give it time to stabilize. Stir lots to get good saturation. Same goes for when you decide to add more water to adjust the temp. Add, stir, wait, measure.

I wouldn't toss it if you have room to ferment it out. If it's stable at 145 put some boiling water in there to bring it up and call it a step mash. As long as you can get it a couple of degree higher and keep it there, you'll have beer.

Champurrado said:

Will that work? It's got about a gallon more water than recommended for the mash?

Click to expand...

Continue as normal but boil longer to get rid of the extra water. 30 mins or so but depends on your heat source.

OK, I transferred the whole shebang into a kettle and its heating up. How high do I take it before transferring back into the MLT?

By the way, thanks for helping me save this

#1. Never use any equipment for a brew session without first checking it for leaks, even if you built it yourself. Easier to fix a leak with water only, than during a brew session.

#2. Did you calculate your strike water temp and quantity correctly for the mash? How did you calculate it? You have to be very careful when taking temps in a mash. It must be stirred VERY well, and allowed to sit for a bit to correctly measure the temp. Generally you want your strike water to be 10-13F higher than your mash temp target if your MLT is already preheated.

#3. This is what happened... your strike water for 10 lbs of grain, with a strike infusion of 3.5 gallons (1.4qts/lb) should have been 163F... so obviously you overshot that temp by a lot. In order for it to rest at 162F after adding the grain that is.

EDIT: You stated that you calculated the correct water strike temp to reach a 152F mash. Your strike temp should have been 163F, and since that is what it was AFTER you mashed in, your calculation was way off. Correctly calulate this next time and you will have a breeze of a brew day.

What temp were you shooting for? Recipe?
Shoot for your mash temperature or a few (5 or less) degrees over, and preheat your mashtun by rinsing it with the hottest tap water you have.

After adding the mash, stir well, cover, and ignore it for five minutes before checking temperature.

Always check your equipment before brewing. And always give new equipment a test run with water to check for leaks, etc.

As fingers noted, it takes time for the temp to stabilize. I wait until all the grain and water are in the mash tun - stir for 5 minutes - then take a reading.

Don't be concerned about the grain/water ratio. You can go all the way to 4 qts. per pound of grain and still make beer. Just add boiling water to get to the desired temps.

OK, I'm back up to around 152. Now I just dump back into MLT?

Sizz said:

Continue as normal but boil longer to get rid of the extra water. 30 mins or so but depends on your heat source.

Click to expand...

Boiling wont be an issue... if he is a gallon over in the mash alone, he will only have to reduce his sparge water volume by the same ammount. Generally the sparge takes 5-6 gallons anyway, so the increased ammount in the mash is really inconsequential. It will just be a VERY thin mash.

Champurrado said:

OK, I'm back up to around 152. Now I just dump back into MLT?

Click to expand...

Preheat the MLT. If it's too much below your strike temp, you'll lose a few degrees. Don't worry too much, just give it a good rinsing with real hot water (even boiling, if you have any that hot) before adding the mash back in.

Then, dump, stir, and ignore it for five minutes.

Bravo! It's back in the MLT and sitting at 153. I was going to toss it, thanks guys.

Now, instead of 3.5 gallons of strike water I have about 5. Not sure how to compensate.

I'm making Edwort's Hause Ale.

Recipe says to add 5 qts to mash out. Now what?

Let's talk equipment. Are you planning to batch or fly sparge?

As for the difference in volume, just subtract the extra amount you mashed-in with from your sparge.

Champurrado said:

Bravo! It's back in the MLT and sitting at 153. I was going to toss it, thanks guys.

Now, instead of 3.5 gallons of strike water I have about 5. Not sure how to compensate.

I'm making Edwort's Hause Ale.

Recipe says to add 5 qts to mash out. Now what?

Click to expand...

Okay, if you boil for 60 mins, you will lose approx. 1.4 gallons. With grain absorption etc... you will need 7.8 gallons total to reach a post boil volume of 5 gallons. MEANING you need to add 2.4 gallons of BOILING water to mash out at 168F and then an additional .4 gallons to sparge with.

5.0 gallons in mash
2.4 gallons at 205F to mash out
.4 gallons to sparge
6.4 gallons pre-boil volume

This will be a batch sparge hopefully. I'll subtract two gallons or so from the recipe when I sparge, right?

Champurrado said:

This will be a batch sparge hopefully. I'll subtract two gallons or so from the recipe when I sparge, right?

Click to expand...

Read my post... above there are your temps and quantities to reach your pre and post boil volume.

Mr. Pol:

Many thanks.

I'll try to keep from screaming too much.

No problem, you should get about 6.4 gallons as the grain bed runs dry, that will get you to about 5 gallons after a 60 min. boil. Relax, and start drinking now.

Mr. Pol:

On top of everything else, I'm on my last round of antibiotics for my annual sick days and I can't drink!

Champurrado said:

Mr. Pol:

On top of everything else, I'm on my last round of antibiotics for my annual sick days and I can't drink!

Click to expand...

Only thing that can help now is boobies...

OK, Gave mash a stir and rechecked temp. It's holding at 151.5. I'm heating up sparge water to 175 per Edwort's recipe.

Almost there.....

Mr. Pol:

If I understand you: I mash out with 2.4 gallons of boiling water. Recipe says 175 degree water.

Boiling, right? 212 degrees?

Thanks.

If you use BOILINg water, your grain bed will come up to about 168F. 175 is the typical sparge water temp, but it will not significantly raise the grain bed temp. If you want to heat up the grain bed to 168F, use BOILING. Then when you sparge the runoff will be close to 168F and the sugars will flow more easily.

EDIT: So yes, I mean boiling water, then give it a nice thorough mix.

roger, thanks.

Funny you say roger... I have to go pilot a plane to Ohare then to Laguardia, I will be in there at like 11pm, leave me details here and let me know how the rest of the brew went man. You are almost done!

OK, vorlauf and first sparge and I have 6.5 gallons in the pot. Do I sparge again or am I ready to boil?

Dude you are lucky I checked here at the crew room... you are ready to boil down to 5 gallons, had you not added so much water in the mash, you could have done 2 consecutive batch sparges. Do that next time.

So Mr. POL:

I'm sticking to just one sparge here. It's boiloing like crazy. First hops addition.

By the way, what can I do with the extra 1/2 gallon of wort from the second sparge?

I collected it anyway. Can I add it to the pot if I have rom? Or should I just drink it. It's nice and sweet

Chilled the wort, filling up my carboy and I'm going to pitch the yeast and say a novena or two. Thanks everybody for the guiding hands.

I'll post later when I see some bubbles.

Excellent. Glad you didn't give up.
The first couple of brews always feel like a clusterfcuk. It gets smoother.

Now, while you're ignoring the fermenter for a couple of weeks, go read this thread:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f36/attention-new-all-grain-brewers-30466/

Mr. JDS:

Nothing beats experience I guess. I've read everything I could get my hands on for about a month here before attempting this enterprise. I certainly read through the "Attention new all grain brewers". I also read Palmer, Sue/Bob and lots of the Wiki.

It's it's not for trying as they say. So now I'm smarter for having stumbled through my first AG Brewday. I know to check all the plumbing and equipment before starting, I know to wait a while and stir the mash after the strike water goes in before panicking and flooding the MLT with ice water because the temp seems too high. I know that I have to plan for 8 hours or so to brew and clean up. I know I need a better burner because boiling 6 1/2 gallons of wort on my stove is not easy or fast.

I also learned it takes a lot longer to chill 6 gallons of wort than the three or so you get with an extract brew. Emersion chiller and three bags of ice in a sink full of cold water seemed to work nonetheless.

I'm tired but I have 5 1/2 gallons of Edwort's hopefully fermenting in the basement. If it turns out, then that will be great, if it doesn't, then I'll mark it up to my education and keep going.

Forgive the long post but brewing is harder than it appears for a newbie. I appreciate the fact that there is a lot of brewing talent hanging around this site and that maybe I'll soon be breezing through the brew day without the stumbling. Thanks.

If you got 5.5 gallons in the fermentor, your OG may be a little low (did you check it?) but you have made beer my friend. Glad it all worked out in the end. Before you know it you will be knocking out AG brew in 4-5 hours! Congrats!

In some ways, I think brewing is a lot like dancing. Sure, you can read about it, and have a great plan in place, but there's just no substitute for doing it. For the record, my first AG brewday went about the same -- overreaction when adjusting temperatures, had to re-heat the entire mash in a big kettle, and finished a LOT later than I'd planned o. Now, it's five hours or less from start to finish, and I think I can knock it down to four with some equipment tweaks.

I'll venture that in a few weeks, you will enjoy the best beer you've made yet. Keep us posted, Champurrado.

He he!

This sounds like one of my first AG brews. Freeking out, all worried. I got talked through it and made some dang fine beer, if I do say so myself.

Now let the yeaties do their work for at least 2 weeks while you join the debate of secondary or no secondary.

Cheers & congrats

Zac

Mr. Pol:

Checked the gravity after the boil/chill and it came out to about 1.048. I was shooting for 1.051 so I don't think it's that far off. Just peeked at the fermenter and it's burbling away. Can't say until I taste it after it's done but, like they say, it's beer.

Thanks.

this thread was a great read. glad your beer worked out Champurrado, and much respect to Pol and jds for the damage control help. this is really a great place.

now when this happens to me i'll know exactly what to do.

You will save yourself a lot of stress by simply buying brewing software. It will eliminate all guesswork for temps and volumes.
And btw which part of the south are you from?