Pitching temp vs fermentation temp

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PavlovsCat

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Normally, after a run thru the CFC my wort - this being Florida- is around 80 degrees. I take the carboy inside for a while to let the A/C do it's stuff, and I'm usually pitching around 75 degrees. I then use the bathtub as a swamp cooler to achieve a lower fermentation temp.

My question is: if my recipe calls for ferm temps around 60-64 degrees, should I still pitch as usual or wait until the temp drops into the range and then pitch? But then my yeast temps (around room temp) will be way above the wort temp. Would this be detrimental? Should I have the yeast ready to pitch at around the 60-64 range. I guess the big question is should you condition the yeast first for the appropriate temp and the second would be: what's the best way to accomplish this.
 
I always pith around 75 degrees. By the time fermentation actually begins, my swamp cooler has the temps well within range. Pitching at 75 will not hurt your yeast. Just pitch it!!!!
 
I go ahead and pitch if it's below 80* - sure, lower is better, but if you wait too long, you're increasing the chances of infection
 
Waiting to pitch until it is at or below fermentation temperature is worth the risk of waiting for the beer to drop there. The growth phase is the period where the yeast produce most of their flavor compounds. This is more important for lagers and beers that are supposed to be pretty darn clean, but still useful for all beers.
 
I dunno, I'm pretty sure they produce more flavor compounds after the growth phase, when fermentation is the most vigorous. Correct me if I'm wrong.
 
I always pitch at fermentation temperature. I guess my thought is that yeast do love warm temperatures, but if fermentation starts at 70 or so, then the temperature will take even longer to come down to my desired fermentation temperatures. If fermentation only lasts 24-36 hours, it might take most of that time to get to the correct temperatuer an by then I'll have the esters already in the beer.

It's easy for me, though- my ground water is always cold, so it's not hard to get my wort to 62 degrees. If I get it a little cooler, that's ok, I can pitch cooler and let it warm up a little.
 
I take mine and get it to about 76 (as cold as I can really get with a CFC and the San Diego ground water) and then I put it into the freezer. Once it hits fermentation temps, I pitch yeast. A few hours won't hurt a thing.
 
I dunno, I'm pretty sure they produce more flavor compounds after the growth phase, when fermentation is the most vigorous. Correct me if I'm wrong.


As far as I can tell from trying to decipher Fix in "Principles of Brewing Science", much of the yeast by-products are influenced by the formation of acetyl coenzyme-A, which forms from pyruvic acid, which is formed prior to any real fermentation. Thus, this is happening during the growth phase. While the esters cannot be formed without the presence of alcohol and a catalyst, thus later in fermentation, their building blocks were formed prior to this, and it is when the building blocks are formed that temperature can play its biggest role, particularly during the growth phase.

So the diacetyl, esters, and fusels are technically formed later in fermentation, but the damage is done earlier in fermentation, while the pyruvic acid and acetyl coenzyme A are forming. I think, hah, somebody please correct ME if I am wrong.
 
So the diacetyl, esters, and fusels are technically formed later in fermentation, but the damage is done earlier in fermentation, while the pyruvic acid and acetyl coenzyme A are forming. I think, hah, somebody please correct ME if I am wrong.

Just wanted to bump this so as not to start a new thread on an old topic.

Can anybody else confirm/deny this? I typically pitch at 75F since my yeast is sitting at room temperature and well, our ground water is really hot this time of year.

I do ferment in a converted freezer w/ a temp probe, so it should get down to temps pretty quickly, but I had some pretty bad apple flavors in a batch of blonde ale (w/ Notty) a few months ago and want to figure out if high pitching temps might have been the culprit.
 
Just wanted to bump this so as not to start a new thread on an old topic.

Can anybody else confirm/deny this? I typically pitch at 75F since my yeast is sitting at room temperature and well, our ground water is really hot this time of year.

I do ferment in a converted freezer w/ a temp probe, so it should get down to temps pretty quickly, but I had some pretty bad apple flavors in a batch of blonde ale (w/ Notty) a few months ago and want to figure out if high pitching temps might have been the culprit.

Very well could have been. If the yeast took off right away, they started doing their job at a temperature higher than ideal, and they are more vigorous in a higher temp environment, so that's likely.

If you have the converted freezer, you'll be better off cooling it down and then pitching for sure.
 
I prefer to pitch ales at fermentation temperature, or at least below 70. Been quite happy with the results and it doesn't seem to increase lag time by much.
 
I had the same issue with an AG pale ale that I brewed using notty. Gave a buddy a glass and he said, "hmmm, kinda like apple juice with a bite". This did not make me happy, but he was right, it tasted kinda fruity. It's hard for me to maintain a temp below 70 degrees here in L.A. Guess I need to convert a cooler or something. Currently put my primary in a drum case loaded with water and drop ice blocks in once a day.
 
I had the same issue with an AG pale ale that I brewed using notty. Gave a buddy a glass and he said, "hmmm, kinda like apple juice with a bite". This did not make me happy, but he was right, it tasted kinda fruity. It's hard for me to maintain a temp below 70 degrees here in L.A. Guess I need to convert a cooler or something. Currently put my primary in a drum case loaded with water and drop ice blocks in once a day.

Yeah what's weird is my blonde was a split batch: 1/2 US-05 and 1/2 Notty. I pitched both at the same time, and the US-05 batch ended up fantastic. This was my first experience w/ Notty, and I definitely wasn't expecting all the apple/pear flavors because of how good the other batch was.
 
...but I had some pretty bad apple flavors in a batch of blonde ale (w/ Notty) a few months ago and want to figure out if high pitching temps might have been the culprit.

Do you do a secondary? (Many homebrewers move the beer to soon)
I ask because Acetaldehyde is often times the culprit of "green apples".

132px-Acetaldehyde-2D-flat.png


1) You may be moving the beer too soon. It may need more time to condition. Some yeast produce more of this compound than others.

To fix it:
1) Use a lower pitching rate.
2) Don't underaerate.
3) Use a cooler fermentation temperature.

To clean it up:
1) Use a warmer lagering or conditioning temperature.
2) Keep the beer on the yeast. (i.e. Don't rack too soon)
3) Rouse the yeast to keep it suspended.
4) Use a less flocculant yeast strain.

Dog
 
No, I don't use a secondary. I left this particular batch (1.048ish) in primary for 3 weeks, cold-crashed for 3 days, and kegged.

I also fermented @ ~60F, so temps weren't an issue unless the high pitch temps were the cause. I'm starting to think it was the combination of high pitch temps and the Notty because the US-05 batch was fine.
 
Yeah what's weird is my blonde was a split batch: 1/2 US-05 and 1/2 Notty. I pitched both at the same time, and the US-05 batch ended up fantastic. This was my first experience w/ Notty, and I definitely wasn't expecting all the apple/pear flavors because of how good the other batch was.

I had the same situation as you guys with a batch of EW's Haus Pale w/ Notty. Also my first time using notty.

Left it in primary for 3 weeks, in a water bath w/ a tshirt. Maybe the water bath wasn't cold enough, but the thing tasted more like apfelwein than ale. It has gotten a little bit better now though.
 
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