Starter without extract?

So I'm going to be making a starter tonight that will be pitched on Saturday for my first all-grain stout. Only problem is that I think I'm out of all the extract I had left over from a previous brew, as it made my last starter. Are there any alternative ingredients that can be substituted for the extract, or should I just suck it up and make a trip back to the brew hut? Plenty of priming sugar still around the house, but wasn't sure if that would start things up like the extract does.

Just do a small mash and use that if you have any extra 2 row.

I haven't done it, but there are people who have used Malta Goya from the grocery store instead of regular extract: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f163/yeast-starter-malta-228891/

I've seen it in a few different grocery stores in the ethnic foods aisles.

Sugar is generally not a good idea. I'd probably bite the bullet and buy some DME or follow OhioSteve's suggestion and make a mini-mash, even if you use some of the grains from your recipe, you can always pitch that starter wort back in with the recipe.

You want to grow your yeast in a starter that is similar to what it will be digesting during fermentation, this gives it the best chance of performing as it should for the style. Why would you want to spend all that money on liquid yeast only to alter it's character by feeding it the wrong food?

Thanks for all the responses!

My wife seems to think there is some LME hidden in the fridge, so that may fix the problem, but I appreciate all the feed back on alternatives, and especially the what-not-to-do's.

unionrdr said:

That's what I thought as well. But some authors & what not were saying that maybe wort would be too heavy for the dry yeast's cell walls,& that a little dextrose in the water would be lighter & therefore better. I've done both,& both work fine. The use a lot more sugar in baker's yeast than the amount of dextrose I use with brewer's yeast. Works quite well in either case.

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I'm confused. Are you making starters with dry yeast or even baker's yeast? Maybe you've been reading Vance's bizarre brews book?

Oh yea, if you're using dry yeast don't use a starter. You should rehydrate your yeast in ONLY WATER. NO SUGAR. Water should be ~80-100F, and have no sugar in it.

The reason you don't want sugar or anything else in your water for rehydrating dry yeast is because the yeast are going to be sucking up all the water they can get their hands on and their cell walls will be super porous to facilitate that. That means anything that is in solution will get directly into the cells. You don't want sugar being sucked up inside the cells without it being properly handled by the yeast- it screws up their osmotic equilibrium and puts them into stress mode right away.

Dry yeast doesn't need a starter because there are plenty of cells in one package when properly rehydrated and making a starter would only deplete the energy reserves the manufacturers helped the yeast create.

unionrdr said:

The nutrients they put on the yeast is to keep them more viable during transport & storage.

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Sorry Unionrdr, I don't believe that's true. I'm no expert on dry yeast, but to my knowledge, they are dormant until rehydrated, so no need for nutrients while they are in storage. What Daksin stated has also always been my understanding. I wouldn't compare what chefs do for bread to beer making; what works for one doesn't necessarily translate to the other.

The fact that you've done it this way, perhaps successfully, doesn't mean that should be a recommended method. Do it this way repeatedly, and win a competition with a beer made this way, then it would be more appropriate. If you started a thread with that experiment, I'd definately follow it.

Otherwise, IMHO, it is important to advise beginners to follow the generally accepted principles and guidelines, so that they have the best possible chance of a successful brewing experience, and making a beer that tastes as it should.

JMHO, YMMV.

I don't want to drag out the OP's thread, so I'll end my comments on this here.

Unionrdr, it was/is not my intent to put you down in any way. And I think experimentation is great. What I am saying is that talk of an experimental method belongs in another thread. By current conventions both methods you're advising on are wrong. 1. we don't make starters with refined sugars, and 2. we don't make starters for dry yeast. Yes we change these conventions by experimentation, and some things have changed since I started making beer 21 years ago. But, by your own admission,you have only been brewing beer for a short time, therefore you haven't done this enough for real scientific experimentation and to change the convention.

The OP asked if he could use dextrose instead of malt for a yeast starter. The correct answer is that he could, but he is risking getting off flavors by doing so. He was also given good suggestions on how to still make it happen without having to go buy extra malt. Telling him about adding dextrose to dry yeast is just confusing the issue.