100% Brett WLP648 - Starter Questions

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jsvarney5

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Hi All,

I'm brewing a 100% Brett Pale Ale in about 9 days. From what I've read on Milk the Funk, it looks like theres about 17.5 billion cells in the White Labs vials for Brett. Am I going to have enough time to get enough cells for a 1.050 beer? My first 100% Brett beer and I've read that starters will take longer (about a week). At these starting cell levels I'll need a two step starter to get there. Any thoughts or suggestions to be ready for brew day? Thanks.
 
Assuming the vial is fresh and you are brewing 5 gallons of 1.050 wort, a single 2 liter starter could be sufficient (according to Milk the Funk, brett cell density is about 3-6x higher than sach - so to be conservative you can multiply your yeast calculator result by 3 to estimate your ending cell count). A 2 liter starter (no stir plate) will result in about 250 billion cells, which is a hybrid pitching rate (which is what Chad at Crooked Stave recommends for 100% brett beers). You'll be even better off if you use a stir plate (2 liter on a stir plate gives you about 350 billion cells, which is a lager pitching rate for 5 gal of 1.050).

Granted, Milk the Funk concedes that (due to using yeast calculators designed for sach cell densities) people have been pitching 4-5 times the pitching rate for sach lagers when pitching brett into 100% brett beers - and that people have been getting good results with such a high pitching rate.

Considering you are brewing in 9 days, and brett starters take that long to finish, it seems like your best bet is to make the biggest starter possible and use a stir plate (or intermittent shaking method) if you can. You just don't have time to properly step it up if you are brewing in 9 days.

Please let us know what you end up doing and how fermentation goes! Primary might take 3-6 weeks considering the pitching rate you're looking at.
 
jfolks said:
Assuming the vial is fresh and you are brewing 5 gallons of 1.050 wort, a single 2 liter starter could be sufficient (according to Milk the Funk, brett cell density is about 3-6x higher than sach - so to be conservative you can multiply your yeast calculator result by 3 to estimate your ending cell count). A 2 liter starter (no stir plate) will result in about 250 billion cells, which is a hybrid pitching rate (which is what Chad at Crooked Stave recommends for 100% brett beers). You'll be even better off if you use a stir plate (2 liter on a stir plate gives you about 350 billion cells, which is a lager pitching rate for 5 gal of 1.050).

Granted, Milk the Funk concedes that (due to using yeast calculators designed for sach cell densities) people have been pitching 4-5 times the pitching rate for sach lagers when pitching brett into 100% brett beers - and that people have been getting good results with such a high pitching rate.

Considering you are brewing in 9 days, and brett starters take that long to finish, it seems like your best bet is to make the biggest starter possible and use a stir plate (or intermittent shaking method) if you can. You just don't have time to properly step it up if you are brewing in 9 days.

Please let us know what you end up doing and how fermentation goes! Primary might take 3-6 weeks considering the pitching rate you're looking at.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the feedback. The vial is fresh (ordered directly from WhiteLabs). Before seeing this post I made a 1L starter on a stir plate last night, thinking I'd try to let this go a few days and then step up into a 2 or 3L starter. I know I'm not going to get the growth I need in just 3 days but i should at least get something and then have about 6-7 days on the stir plate for that 3L starter. After seeing this, maybe I'll even cut this starter down to 2 days so I can get it in the larger starter with more time before brew day.
 
UPDATE: Well after about 2 weeks in this 100% Brett primary, it is sitting at around 1.016 with it clearing and settling out with each day that passes. I did notice that it looked like my starter went through a couple periods of krausen on the stir plate. It looks like this fermentation is done and that maybe underpitching is the culprit since I didnt have enough time to truly build up a significant starter. Couple questions as a result:

1. Could I expect some more gravity points to drop out of this or is it most likely done at this point? (Ill be taking another gravity reading soon and let it go at least another week or so).

2. If it is done, what suggestions would you have for finishing out? I ultimately want to bottle condition this but certainly do not want to when the gravity is this high with brett. Also, should I be concerned about this? Will the Brett continue to chew on the residual sugars like an aged sour where Brett is in secondary after the sacch fermentation?

Thanks!
 
1.016 seems waaaay too high for an all-brett beer to finish. Especially if it started around 1.050. Every one I've done has gotten below 1.010 in 3 weeks time. I would let it go for longer.

100% brett beers are different than mixed brett fermentations. They will be done fermenting in under a month and you can safely bottle them without worry of it continuing fermentation
 
m00ps said:
1.016 seems waaaay too high for an all-brett beer to finish. Especially if it started around 1.050. Every one I've done has gotten below 1.010 in 3 weeks time. I would let it go for longer.

100% brett beers are different than mixed brett fermentations. They will be done fermenting in under a month and you can safely bottle them without worry of it continuing fermentation
Click to expand...

I agree. And that falls in line with everything I've read too but with this being my first 100% Brett beer I dont have any experience to back it up. Like I said, I most likely underpitched by quite a bit but dont know for sure since I didnt count cells. I aerated it well with oxygen and mashed this beer at 151 so I'm sure it's got to be pitching rate. I'm going to leave it in primary for another 1-2 weeks to see what happens. Maybe I'll get some last minute points but I dont see it dropping below 1.010 with the activity (or lack thereof) in the last few days.

Good to know about the bottling. Thanks. I wonder why that is? Does it just behave differently as a primary strain and just stop like Sacch?
 

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