Beware oversize pots on the stovetop!

So I decided I would try out my third brew yesterday, and maybe test out my shiny new 15g aluminum pot on the stove, since I'm still waiting on a propane burner. I woke up early and tossed a few gallons in to boil to "treat" the aluminum. Around 45 mins later it was still not at a boil, and there was this funky smell eminating from the pot. Once my smoke alarms started blaring, I decided I'd check a bit closer... sure enough, the heat was trapped under the overhanging sides of the pot and scorched the bejesus out of my stove. I also had a little bit of countertop meltage where the edge of my stove meets it. Needless to say, I felt like a complete idiot.. so be wary when using those wide pots on the stovetop!

You're doing the boil on the stove? Crazy stuff. IMO you won't really get a rolling boil on the stove- you need to invest in a turkey burner or three ring

peas_and_corn said:

You're doing the boil on the stove? Crazy stuff. IMO you won't really get a rolling boil on the stove- you need to invest in a turkey burner or three ring

Click to expand...

You really don't want a roiling boil...just a gentle boil. I have no problem doing 3-4 gallon boils on the stove. For my 5.25 gallon brews, I just split them into two 3 gallon mini-batches, then recombine. Outdoors is not a practical option for me, being an apartment dweller.

15 gallons in one pot is really pushing it beyond anything reasonable for stove top, though.

Pelikan said:

You really don't want a roiling boil...just a gentle boil.

Click to expand...

Here's a good read on the subject. The short of it is that you want a full rolling boil.

One of the most important reactions that occurs in the wort boil is the formation of "hot break". Hot break is the coagulation of proteins, formation of protein-polyphenol complexes, and reaction with hop compounds to create larger particles that will sediment out in the whirlpool at the end of the boil. These reactions occur at higher rates at higher temperatures and more agitation. This is why your wort boil must be full and rolling... the more vigorous and turbulent the boil, the more of these compounds form over time..

Click to expand...

The Beer Life of Brian: Importance of a Full Wort Boil

May be this guy is wrong, but I believe him

Just moved from a place where I was using a Turkey Fryer to an apartment and was nervous about doing a full boil on the stove. I have a gas stove and successfully brought 6 gallons of wort (hopefully soon to be mocha porter) to a rolling boil by straddling the 7.5 gallon aluminum pot that came with my turkey fryer across two gas burners. Took about an hour to bring to a boil but it worked!
:rockin:

Jamil says you dont need a jet blaster boil. It should be boiling pretty good, but there should not be any wort jumping out of the pot.

Pelikan said:

You really don't want a roiling boil...just a gentle boil. I have no problem doing 3-4 gallon boils on the stove. For my 5.25 gallon brews, I just split them into two 3 gallon mini-batches, then recombine. Outdoors is not a practical option for me, being an apartment dweller.

15 gallons in one pot is really pushing it beyond anything reasonable for stove top, though.

Click to expand...

You really do want a rolling boil, not a violent boil, but rolling for certain. This is basically brewing 101.

I guess we're having an issue of semantics, not fact. I understand the importance of a full boil, but I suppose I associate "roiling" with "violent" (and notice I say "roiling," not "rolling;" there is a difference between the two). In other words, the boil should be going fairly well, enough to get the liquid "stirring" itself, but as someone else said, not jumping out of the pot. A contained but active boil, I suppose.

Not sure if your electric or gas on your stove. If your electric and your going to keep doing stuff like this, you can get a "canning element" for your stove (unless its a GE) that will raise the element up a bit and also add more support.

I think raising the burner, if possible, is an excellent idea.

I've decided which propane burner I'm going for, so that will be the next equipment upgrade. I'll stick with my small 5g kettle until then!

Ahoy hoy,
My solution at this point was to buy a canning element. Its a replacement element for your electric stove, thats designed to handle the weight of a large pot full of liquid, plus it sits up higher so that you dont burn the top of the stove. It is what I use during the winter months when im forced to brew in the kitchen. It still takes a bit, but in the end, it is the only way to go if your using a 40 qt or bigger pot on your stove. It works pretty good with my 50 qt pot.
I bought mine off ebay for 14 bucks. they make them for all the standard electric stoves. FYI
A good day to you all!

I thought you werent supposed to use aluminum pots for brewing. Am I wrong?

This does bring up an interesting point about boiling. I brew at sea level so my boiling point is obviously 212. Say you are brewing in the mountains of Colorado, your boiling point might only be 200 degrees. Does it matter as long as you have a full boil going on?? I was curious because when I brewed the other day I could barely get a boil going and I was kinda worried. I started thinking though that my wort still has to be at a higher temperature than somebody who is brewing at say 6 or 7 thousand feet. Kinda put my mind at ease and I was able to RDWHAHB!! What do you guys think??

You definitely want a good strong boil, but exercise a little discretion. If you've got to babysit the pot and risk volcanic eruptions, you can probably dial it back a touch. A rolling boil is crucial for hop utilization, most specifically. A violent, spewing, spitting boil is inefficient and just plain dangerous.

It can be challenging to get 3-4 gallons of wort up to an adequate boil on an average stove, but it can be done with a little forethought. By straddling burners and partially covering the pot, you can get more effective heating. Once you hit a strong boil, uncover. FermCaps are awesome for controlling boilovers, BTW.

flyangler18 said:

You definitely want a good strong boil, but exercise a little discretion. If you've got to babysit the pot and risk volcanic eruptions, you can probably dial it back a touch. A rolling boil is crucial for hop utilization, most specifically. A violent, spewing, spitting boil is inefficient and just plain dangerous.

It can be challenging to get 3-4 gallons of wort up to an adequate boil on an average stove, but it can be done with a little forethought. By straddling burners and partially covering the pot, you can get more effective heating. Once you hit a strong boil, uncover. FermCaps are awesome for controlling boilovers, BTW.

Click to expand...

Thank you. That's exactly what I've been trying to convey.

peas_and_corn said:

You're doing the boil on the stove? Crazy stuff. IMO you won't really get a rolling boil on the stove- you need to invest in a turkey burner or three ring

Click to expand...

Stovetop brewing can be done, even for full 5.5 gal batches. There may be no need to invest in a gas burner, unless your goal is to move your brewery outdoors.

See this thread for some tips:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f11/improved-boiling-stovetop-53683/

Hoserama said:

I thought you werent supposed to use aluminum pots for brewing. Am I wrong?

Click to expand...

That's purely a myth. Personally, I think aluminum pots make the BEST pots for stovetop brewing. See the link above and this one:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f11/faq-aluminum-pots-boil-kettles-49449/

Regarding scorching the stovetop, particularly with a big bot, that is a real concern. If you don't have the luxury of a canning element (best stovetop method IMO, BTW), then line your stovetop (and counter top?) with heavy duty aluminum foil (shiny side up). It will at least help somewhat.

...but back to the original topic, I just replaced an old stove. Hey, nothing's too good for the little woman for Christmas - she can now make all those great dinners, she always wanted to cook up! <looks around and ducks>

One of the burners is a monster - something like 26,000 BTU output. These are becoming standard on new stoves. I was tickled to be able to use it for brewing, and I noticed the first time I put my mega-pot (five or six gallons - stainless - not enough for a full boil but for $16 on sale a Kohl's, unbeatable) on it and cranked it up, the flame spilled right back to the counter top and if I had not noticed it, I would have either melted or scorched it.

I moved the whole thing off center a bit, away from the counter (the stove has those huge grate thingies, so no worries about tipping over) and it was fine, but the potential hazard definitely went into the "mental note" file. I'm not real interested in shelling out for all new counter tops, which is what a small scorching would have cost me since replacing these is on her scope already.

SteveM said:

...but back to the original topic, I just replaced an old stove.

Click to expand...

Yeah, we now have a soapstone countertop. It dissipates the heat really well. Any of the plastic composites or wood will be trouble.

I did manage to char a breadboard on the counter next to the stove.

what about a wok ring

Wok Ring, 16&#34; Dia., Fits 20&#34; Dia. Wok, Stainless Steel gets the pot up

Hoserama said:

I just want to say thanks to you guys for including us in all your bickering. Im trying to learn something here so please drop it and act like your older than 12 years old. That is unless you really to do care about what some faceless person on the internet thinks of a comment you made. In that case...continue with your bickering and I'll go somewhere else.

Click to expand...

Hoserama,

Sorry- things get a little heated occasionally. We're usually a pretty laid back bunch and it can be difficult to convey a gentle ribbing or jest with words at times. That's what happened here.

Stick around. It's worth it.

Jason

flyangler18 said:

Hoserama,

Sorry- things get a little heated occasionally. We're usually a pretty laid back bunch and it can be difficult to convey a gentle ribbing or jest with words at times. That's what happened here.

Stick around. It's worth it.

Jason

Click to expand...

I have often wished for a sarcasm font. I think it would cut internet bickering down by half.

simpleton said:

I have often wished for a sarcasm font. I think it would cut internet bickering down by half.

Click to expand...

Well-placed smileys do great!

flyangler18 said:

Well-placed smileys do great!

Click to expand...

Yeah, whatever you say...jackass

On topic: I boil 5.5 gallons on the stove by stradling two burners. Doesn't take too long to bring to a boil because I am partial mashing and the temps are getting realtively close to the boiling point. I don't burn up the counter, but I do get some scorch marks on the stove top. For my stove, they do come out with a little elbow grease.

So do any of you use one of the new fangled glass stove's to do your brewing??

Just wondering if any of you have an issue with them or if the glass can stand the weight. I've made 2 gal batches of Chicken stock and pea soup but as I need a bigger pot for 5 g batches (8 gal) and that will be 6.5 g+ of fluid at the boil is that going to be an issue for me?

If so I'll get a turkey fryer... but dang it's cold outside to be brewing out i the garage! BRRRRRR 4" of snow and 6 more on the way.

FxdGrMind said:

So do any of you use one of the new fangled glass stove's to do your brewing??

Just wondering if any of you have an issue with them or if the glass can stand the weight. I've made 2 gal batches of Chicken stock and pea soup but as I need a bigger pot for 5 g batches (8 gal) and that will be 6.5 g+ of fluid at the boil is that going to be an issue for me?

If so I'll get a turkey fryer... but dang it's cold outside to be brewing out i the garage! BRRRRRR 4" of snow and 6 more on the way.

Click to expand...

I feel your pain. I roast coffee outdoors 3 to 4 times per week and even with all the heat from the roaster I still get cold.

There is no way I would put 8 gallons of wort on a glasstop stove. I would worry a little that it might shatter but even more that it just couldn't do the work. Although I believe I read elsewhere in this thread that a gentle boil is fine and even preferred so you might be able to get there.

FxdGrMind said:

So do any of you use one of the new fangled glass stove's to do your brewing??

Click to expand...

I don't, but my BIL does and we often brew together. He can't boil much more than about 2.5 gals on his. I have also heard reports from others that a big, heavy brewpot traps too much heat in the stove and causes problems (scorching or discoloration of the stovetop IIRC).

FxdGrMind said:

So do any of you use one of the new fangled glass stove's to do your brewing??

Click to expand...

I do; my only piece of advice is make sure to PICK UP the pot when it is full and you want to move it, and do not slide the pot. I made that mistake the first time and it marred the cooktop a little bit. Not bad really, but any mark on a new stove like mine hurts...

I actually just did a ton of research on this and tapped into the 'canning' community. I hae a huge burner on my glass stovetop, but it consistently 'shuts off' to keep the heat down.

From what I understand, you are not supposed to use a pot that has a diameter that would place the pot more than an inch outside the burner. This is what the manufacturer states. Other areas of the stove are not meant to be heated and can crack.

Many people in the canning community still can with the big canning pots and said they never had a problem, but I just wanted to throw in my $.02.

I have since bought an 8 1/2 gallon SS brew pot with an outdoor burner. If I broke my glass stove, SWMBO would be very very unhappy and that would not be good for the home brewery.