Copper Tubing Bending

I'm about to pull the trigger on a 50' coil of copper tubing to turn into an IC and am wondering what sizes are more prone to kinking. I've only ever dealt with 1/4" copper tubing to make my current crappy IC. I've found a real decent price on 50' of 5/8" tubing. Would this size be manageable to (fairly easily) wrap around a corny to make a really bad-a IC or might the larger ID make it kink more easily?

Thanks!

I wrapped 3/8 around a growler without any challenges...just wish that I had gone for width instead of height.

the bigger the tubing the harder it tends to be to bend it. Get the tools for bending tubing and it will make it alot easier to bend without kinking it. getting your coild around a corny keg shouldn't be too hard though

I heard rolling a bucket over the laid out copper wile wrapping it works pretty well.

if you dont already have a set- pick up some tube bending coils. they are much cheaper than an actual tubing coiler (like this one i made last weekend ) and work pretty good for doing what you are trying to.

also bending the tubing in steps instead of all at once helps. for instance, if you buy the tube in a 2 foot diameter coil, and want an end product of maybe 10 inches in diameter, dont just roll it around a 10" form. instead coil it around maybe a 16" wide form, and then do it again with a 10 inch form. (or posibly add more steps)

the more gradually you do it, the less prone to kinking it will be.

audger said:

if you dont already have a set- pick up some tube bending coils. they are much cheaper than an actual tubing coiler (like this one i made last weekend ) and work pretty good for doing what you are trying to.

also bending the tubing in steps instead of all at once helps. for instance, if you buy the tube in a 2 foot diameter coil, and want an end product of maybe 10 inches in diameter, dont just roll it around a 10" form. instead coil it around maybe a 16" wide form, and then do it again with a 10 inch form. (or posibly add more steps)

the more gradually you do it, the less prone to kinking it will be.

Click to expand...

Doesn't the copper we're all using harden every time you bend it? Your suggestion seems to be the exact opposite of what I've read. Do it right the first time, otherwise it's more likely to kink.

I've worked 3/8" OD, 1/2" OD, and all the way up to 5/8" OD refrigeration tubing around a corny with zero problems. The key is to not attempt to straighten out the stock coil to then recoil it. As you can see in the video, you lay the coil down and put the corny in the middle. That was coiling the 1/2" OD. It was more challenging to secure the coil end at the bottom and coil upwards because someone had to hold the weight of the coil up and out of the way. When I did the 5/8" one, I did it by myself I simply left the corny upright (fill it to the top with water for weight or use one full of beer). Use a clamp of some sort to clamp the end to the corny handle at the top and simply let the coil sit on the floor. Now you start forming the coiling up at the top coiling downward while the stock coil sort of spins around on the floor. A carpet helps.



3/8" coils are so easy to bend that you can skip the soldering and elbows and stuff. When you coil to the point where there's about 30" left, hold the coil tight and bend it upright and that becomes the water in or out lead from the bottom of the coil.

If you think you're going to have trouble keeping it from kinking. Go to a bulk foods store and buy some salt. Fill the tubing w/salt and wind the salt filled coil around a corny. When you're done, attach the hose fittings. Attach the hose to the water supply. The water may take some time to flush the salt out of the line, but the salt will eventually come out.

Disclaimer: I've done this w/up to 1/2" not 5/8" though I suspect it would work

***edited to add disclaimer

justtaint said:

Doesn't the copper we're all using harden every time you bend it? Your suggestion seems to be the exact opposite of what I've read. Do it right the first time, otherwise it's more likely to kink.

Click to expand...

that is only true if you are bending it, straitening it out, and then bending it again. if you are only bending it one total time, it doesnt matter if you do it in small incriments or all at once. and also copper only work-hardens by a few percent; its not like it turns into steel after a few minutes.

the only thing is that when you do it all at once, if you dont have a form or mandrel, the force it takes to make a large bend can find a weak spot and kink. thats the reason i suggested do a few stages. less force is applied at any given point, and less chance of kinking.

Thank you all for the great replies! After reading your posts, I'm very confident I'll be able to make my IC without issues. Audger, I'll try out your method, I just don't know what the original coil diameter will be. Bobby, I remember watching that video a while ago. Thanks for reminding me of it! Just placed my order for the coil! $40.16 shipped ain't bad! That's about a $70 savings over MoreBeer's 50' x 1/2" IC.

dkennedy said:

...just wish that I had gone for width instead of height.

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LOL THAT'S WHAT SHE SAID

I just used one of my cornies to roll it and gently bent the ends over so the acrylic tubing i used for water didn't kink when it got soft (that's what she said!)

I used a windshield fluid jug.

I used these, from Lowe's, (mentioned above) and they worked great....pity I didn't buy them UNTIL after I had already kinked my coil. Oo'er. Chiller works just fine.

I used vinyl tubing and hose clamps but, for some reason, sprung a leak. Even with 3 clamps on the inlet it was still leaking. So I went to PEX pipe and fittings. A little more expensive since I needed to buy new tubing and the crimping tool but did a really nice job. Never heard of PEX before but seems a lot more convenient than sweating / soldering.

EDIT : ignore the poor review on Amazon. I didn't have any issues BUT I wasn't making 90 degree bends (I would use an elbow probably).

If you need to make tight radius bends, get this one instead for less money:

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000NPUKVQ/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

If you're making more sweeping bends, you DO NOT need bending tools for 3/8" OD.

barrooze said:

Thank you all for the great replies! After reading your posts, I'm very confident I'll be able to make my IC without issues. Audger, I'll try out your method, I just don't know what the original coil diameter will be. Bobby, I remember watching that video a while ago. Thanks for reminding me of it! Just placed my order for the coil! $40.16 shipped ain't bad! That's about a $70 savings over MoreBeer's 50' x 1/2" IC.

Click to expand...

Care to share your source? That's a mighty fine price!

atjsparty said:

Care to share your source? That's a mighty fine price!

Click to expand...

Sure! It was p/n AP3768521 at AppliancePartsPros.com, HOWEVER, a couple hours after placing the order I got an email telling me the part was DISCONTINUED and my order was cancelled!!! I'm now on the hunt for some alternative sources... I shoulda bought it 1.5 years ago when I first saw it....

Dagger...guess that's why the price sounded too good to be true. Pretty terrible they can't manage their website enough to pull of items that were discontinued. Especially since it just says "Out of Stock - usually ships within 5 to 6 days".

Good luck with your search...everything else appears to be over $100.

Cheapest I've found for 5/8" is $105.27. I've found 1/2" for $77.76. It might just be sticker shock after thinking I was going to pay ~$40, but I don't think the benefit of the 5/8" justifies the extra dollars. Another factor is that I'm currently using about 20' of 1/4" copper. It's terrible, so any improvement will be substantial to me. Have you seen a thermal conductivity chart comparing 1/2" to 5/8"?

https://coppertubingsales.com/store...ucts_id=754&osCsid=eki1pc88pgjdp3hcej1g7rjc51

That's 3/8" OD x 50 for $40.

barrooze, I haven't seen anything, but I've only seen 1/2" max for the most part. I agree, the price from 3/8" to 1/2"...worth it. 1/2" to 5/8"...not worth it.

Nice link Bobby, definitely some great prices at that place.

atjsparty said:

I agree, the price from 3/8" to 1/2"...worth it. 1/2" to 5/8"...not worth it.

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if you think about it- when the diameter increases by 1x, the circumference increases by ~3x, so with only a small increase in cross sectional area, you are using a lot more actual copper. thats the reason for the large price jumps.

Wow, that is a great link! Thanks, Bobby!

Looking at the charts in the Jan/Feb 2012 issue of Zymurgy, it looks like the time difference between 1/2" and 5/8" tubing (for 40-50' of submerged pipe) is negligible. A minute maybe. The article says that the time to chill 5 gallons of 13 Plato wort from 200F to 80F using 70F water flowing @ 2.5 gpm using my current IC (1/4" OD x 25') is around 26 minutes. I agree with this figure. Using 50' of 1/2" tubing, the time drops to a little over 10 minutes. Using 50' of 5/8" tubing, the time drops further to just under 10 minutes. Saving 60 seconds to cool my wort is not worth the extra $20. I'm going with 50' of 1/2" tubing.

Thanks again for the link!

50' of 1/2" tubing ordered!

Thanks for the help, guys. After I made a pretty severe kink a couple feet from the end of the coil, I ended up getting some of the bending springs and they saved me! I cut off the kinked portion and have bent that into a future whirlpool arm. I also added an inline thermometer on the inlet side so I can monitor my cooling water temp and have an idea as to whether I need to use my pre-chiller or not.

Thanks again!

audger said:

if you dont already have a set- pick up some tube bending coils. they are much cheaper than an actual tubing coiler (like this one i made last weekend ) and work pretty good for doing what you are trying to.

also bending the tubing in steps instead of all at once helps. for instance, if you buy the tube in a 2 foot diameter coil, and want an end product of maybe 10 inches in diameter, dont just roll it around a 10" form. instead coil it around maybe a 16" wide form, and then do it again with a 10 inch form. (or posibly add more steps)

the more gradually you do it, the less prone to kinking it will be.

Click to expand...

hey Audger can you give info and details on your coiler device thanks Dave

audger said:

if you think about it- when the diameter increases by 1x, the circumference increases by ~3x, so with only a small increase in cross sectional area, you are using a lot more actual copper. thats the reason for the large price jumps.

Click to expand...

there is an old plumbers rule of thumb
When you double the pipe you quadruple the flow

I.E.

3/8 *3/8*3.14 =.44
3/4*3/4*3.14 =1.76

so 5/8*5/8*3.14 =1.23

Just for others, all you need to do to get perfect bends in your copper is (assuming its already coiled) is cap one end, fill the entire coil with water and freeze. Once frozen you can create a tighter radius down to around 6" with zero kinks. When coiled allow the pipe to thaw and when done drain. No Salt/Sand/Mess.... Hope this helps someone in the future!

When bending brass horn pipes, dish soap is added to the water before freezing. It's not necessary with annealed refrigeration tube IMO. But water pipe is a different story.