Light DME grain equivalent

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Sea_of_Shells

Sea_of_Shells

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I'm making a partial mash IPA and my grain bill is as follows:

3lbs. 2 Row
1lb. Caramel 90L
1lb. Munich 10L
6lbs. Light DME

What does light DME consist of?

I ask this because I may be converting all of my partial mash recipes to all grain shortly. What is a good replacement grain for light DME?
 
Sea_of_Shells said:
I'm making a partial mash IPA and my grain bill is as follows:

3lbs. 2 Row
1lb. Caramel 90L
1lb. Munich 10L
6lbs. Light DME

What does light DME consist of?

I ask this because I may be converting all of my partial mash recipes to all grain shortly. What is a good replacement grain for light DME?
Click to expand...

Light DME is generally just two-row, with a titch of carapils in it. For 6 pounds LME, sub 10 pounds 2-row, plus a wee bit of carapils.
 
Dr_Jeff said:
Close enough
Click to expand...
Cool. My dad made a partial mash with 2 different dme sugars and hopped it with denali hops which are now called Sultana but I still say denali. It by far beats any of my all grain brews as he only does partial grains and extracts. I'd like to mimic it with all grain.
 
Wrathchild said:
Cool. My dad made a partial mash with 2 different dme sugars and hopped it with denali hops which are now called Sultana but I still say denali. It by far beats any of my all grain brews as he only does partial grains and extracts. I'd like to mimic it with all grain.
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It really depends on your system. 1lb of DME mixed with enough water to make 1 gallon of wort should yield an OG of right about 1.045. I like the 2 row plus a little carapils comment. But it depends on your system’s efficiency and how much grain it takes to get you to 1.045.
 
bwible said:
It really depends on your system. 1lb of DME mixed with enough water to make 1 gallon of wort should yield an OG of right about 1.045. I like the 2 row plus a little carapils comment. But it depends on your system’s efficiency and how much grain it takes to get you to 1.045.
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1.045, I assume this is pre boil right?
 
bwible said:
It really depends on your system. 1lb of DME mixed with enough water to make 1 gallon of wort should yield an OG of right about 1.045. I like the 2 row plus a little carapils comment. But it depends on your system’s efficiency and how much grain it takes to get you to 1.045.
Click to expand...
I will just thank you now man. Im sitting here eating lunch at work reading this stuff and a huge light bulb just went off in my head about what you said. I just brewed a smash beer with 9lbs 2 row pale male and vic secret hops. I do biab so I used 8 gallons of water in a 60 minute mash at around 150 degrees. I ended up with 1.044 sg. If I divide 9 lbs of grain by 8 gallons of water I get 1.125. Thats a little less then a pound and a quarter to get me to about 1.045 per gallon. Am I thinking about this correctly?
 
Wrathchild said:
I will just thank you now man. Im sitting here eating lunch at work reading this stuff and a huge light bulb just went off in my head about what you said. I just brewed a smash beer with 9lbs 2 row pale male and vic secret hops. I do biab so I used 8 gallons of water in a 60 minute mash at around 150 degrees. I ended up with 1.044 sg. If I divide 9 lbs of grain by 8 gallons of water I get 1.125. Thats a little less then a pound and a quarter to get me to about 1.045 per gallon. Am I thinking about this correctly?
Click to expand...
Its not as simple as that. Like DME, each grain has a gravity potential. There are charts you can find and a math formula to figure gravity extraction. Its easier to do it with software.

This explains it pretty well:
http://beersmith.com/blog/2015/01/30/calculating-original-gravity-for-beer-recipe-design/
or this shows the math formula better:
http://www.backtoschoolbrewing.com/blog/2016/9/13/grain-bill-calculations
 
bwible said:
Its not as simple as that. Like DME, each grain has a gravity potential. There are charts you can find and a math formula to figure gravity extraction. Its easier to do it with software.

This explains it pretty well:
http://beersmith.com/blog/2015/01/30/calculating-original-gravity-for-beer-recipe-design/
or this shows the math formula better:
http://www.backtoschoolbrewing.com/blog/2016/9/13/grain-bill-calculations
Click to expand...
I only have a cell phone and no computer. I was trying to avoid having to buy a laptop for beer Smith but everyone is telling me its well worth it. I know the basics and have made 12 batches of beer but only a few were worthy of being g called "ok". Im way out of balance and I think that's what messes up my flavor. Ill read through this Info and see what I can come up with. I know all grains have a potential conversion % so now I just need to figure out the formulas to work with them. Thanks again for all your great help! Much appreciated
 
My laptop is a mac powerbook from 2007. By computer standards that is ancient. But I keep it going just for beer software. Yeah I do just about everything on my cell phone now except beer software. And I can’t justify buying a new computer just for that. If it gets to where I just can’t run the software anymore, I’ll probably buy a used computer on ebay or something.

I use BeerTools. They have a free online version of their recipe calculator you can use. The free version is limited number of ingredients and such. You have to create an account. But its free to go on their site and use it.

https://www.beertools.com/tools/calculator.php
 
BrewnWKopperKat said:
I (and probably others) would be willing to post a worked out example that doesn't need a computer. I can do that this evening (about 6 - 8 hours from now) if you are interested.
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Hell yes I'd like to see one worked out! Gives me eyes directly on target! Thanks man super cool
 
One of the key pieces in converting recipes is the idea of "gravity points". This is a measure of what the ingredient will contribute to SG. It's generally expressed in PPG (gravity Points per Pound per Gallon of wort).

Aside: for simplicity, I'm going to standardize the PPG numbers. There will be some variation between products - check product information sheets for the extact numbers.

DME offers 45 PPG. 1 lb of DME in one gal water will have an SG of 45.

Base malts have a maximum potential of 36 PPG. Mashing is not 100% efficient and varies based on the brewing equipment. Published recipes often assume a mash efficiency of 75%.

A pound of base malt (mashed at 75% efficiency) in 1 gal of water will have an PPG of 27 (36 * 75%).

To convert from DME to it's matching base malt (assuming 75% mash efficiency):
  • Calculate gravity points from the DME: 3 lb * 45 PPG ==> 135 Gravity points
  • Calculate the amount of base malt: 135 gravity points / 27 PPG = 5 lbs
Another way to look at it is that 1.66 lb base malt at 75% efficiency can replace 1 lb DME. Or ...

3 lb (DME) * 1.66 = 5 lb (base malt mashed at 75% efficiency).​
 
BrewnWKopperKat said:
One of the key pieces in converting recipes is the idea of "gravity points". This is a measure of what the ingredient will contribute to SG. It's generally expressed in PPG (gravity Points per Pound per Gallon of wort).

Aside: for simplicity, I'm going to standardize the PPG numbers. There will be some variation between products - check product information sheets for the extact numbers.

DME offers 45 PPG. 1 lb of DME in one gal water will have an SG of 45.

Base malts have a maximum potential of 36 PPG. Mashing is not 100% efficient and varies based on the brewing equipment. Published recipes often assume a mash efficiency of 75%.

A pound of base malt (mashed at 75% efficiency) in 1 gal of water will have an PPG of 27 (36 * 75%).

To convert from DME to it's matching base malt (assuming 75% mash efficiency):
  • Calculate gravity points from the DME: 3 lb * 45 PPG ==> 135 Gravity points
  • Calculate the amount of base malt: 135 gravity points / 27 PPG = 5 lbs
Another way to look at it is that 1.66 lb base malt at 75% efficiency can replace 1 lb DME. Or ...

3 lb (DME) * 1.66 = 5 lb (base malt mashed at 75% efficiency).​
Click to expand...
I'm following so far but where did you get 1.66 lb of base malt to replace 1lb of dme
 
BrewnWKopperKat said:
45 (PPG in 1 lb of DME) / 27 (PPG in 1 lb of mashed base malt)
Click to expand...
Ok now I get it. I get my grains from northern brewers and I know there is a conversion % on the label but you say I have to get the gravity in ppg and thats on another table? From the maltster correct? How do you get that
 
Base malts tend to be either 36 or 37 PPG. DME will often be 44 or 45 PPG -- for me, not enough of a difference when doing the initial conversion. If you look at the PPG information in some recipe software, you can see the variation between different brands. In these examples, I wanted to initially ignore the variation to simplify the initial discussion.

Thinking of recipe software, I hear that the Brewfather app is a good web based app. Maybe someone who uses it on a phone can comment on it here. Otherwise, "home brewing with just a phone" would be an interesting topic.
 
BrewnWKopperKat said:
Base malts tend to be either 36 or 37 PPG. DME will often be 44 or 45 PPG -- for me, not enough of a difference when doing the initial conversion. Some brewers want to be more accurate (which is OK). In these examples, I wanted to initially ignore the variation to simplify the initial discussion.
Click to expand...
I understand. I also understand there are way too many variables especially as a beginner homebrewer to get rock solid numbers. Thats why standards are formed over many averages from lots of trials. Either way this opens up a whole new path for me because I was the "shoot from the hip" guy. Thank you for all your knowledge my friend its very appreciated
 
BrewnWKopperKat said:
Base malts tend to be either 36 or 37 PPG. DME will often be 44 or 45 PPG -- for me, not enough of a difference when doing the initial conversion. If you look at the PPG information in some recipe software, you can see the variation between different brands. In these examples, I wanted to initially ignore the variation to simplify the initial discussion.

Thinking of recipe software, I hear that the Brewfather app is a good web based app. Maybe someone who uses it on a phone can comment on it here. Otherwise, "home brewing with just a phone" would be an interesting topic.
Click to expand...
How important is it to get a "good" water profile? My well water tastes good cold but has a mineral taste when it warms. Is this another area where my flavor can improve or is it not as important as reaching a designated gravity and good grain selection before I brew?
 
Wrathchild said:
My well water tastes good cold but has a mineral taste when it warms. Is this another area where my flavor can improve or is it not as important as reaching a designated gravity and good grain selection before I brew?
Click to expand...

I brew with RO/distilled water, so I'm not going to be able to offer advice based on experience. I have some ideas on how I would approach this, but I'll defer to others who can offer advice based on their experiences.
 
BrewnWKopperKat said:
I brew with RO/distilled water, so I'm not going to be able to offer advice based on experience. I have some ideas on how I would approach this, but I'll defer to others who can offer advice based on their experiences.
Click to expand...
Fair enough man. Do you add any salts to it or just straight up?
 
Wrathchild said:
I only have a cell phone and no computer. I was trying to avoid having to buy a laptop for beer Smith
Click to expand...
Beersmith (v3) has a cell phone app now that's 100% equivalent with the desktop version. It was recently released.
But you need a (yearly) subscription, AFAIK. I'm not sure how easy it is to use on that platform, I'm desktop (or laptop) based, mainly.
 
IslandLizard said:
Beersmith (v3) has a cell phone app now that's 100% equivalent with the desktop version. It was recently released.
But you need a (yearly) subscription, AFAIK. I'm not sure how easy it is to use on that platform, I'm desktop (or laptop) based, mainly.
Click to expand...
I might need some feedback on how it works before I buy it. Caution.
 

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