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Home Brew Forums > Home Brewing Community > Commercial Brew Discussion > AB has gone too far
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Old 04-06-2007, 09:52 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by Bobby_M
I don't know if I want to live in a country where a company can't market a sh!tty product if they want to.
Like the Pinto? Do you know that a car full of teenagers burned to death trapped inside a Pinto because Lee Iacoca wanted decided against an $11 part because it would make it harder to fit two sets of golf clubs in the trunk? Over 500 people burned to death in all just to save $11 per car.

How about asbestos?

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I suppose those tiny bottles of hard liquor behind the counter are for kids too because they're kid sized portions?
Yes, many of them are.
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Let's ban cigarettes and porno while we're at it and physically limit cars from going faster than 50. In fact, I bet we can make cars limited to geographical limits just by using RF ids on the speed limit signs. We can make the world safe for everyone so that idiots live as long as possible. Idiocracy comes true faster.
If they did limit the speed cars could travel - say to a max of 75 - do you know how much oil we'd conserve every day?
Define "Idiocracy". In your mind, is it saving people?
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Old 04-06-2007, 10:09 PM   #22
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Please keep your nanny state out of my life

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Safety problems
Through early production of the model, it became a focus of a major scandal when it was alleged that the car's design allowed its fuel tank to be easily damaged in the event of a rear-end collision which sometimes resulted in deadly fires and explosions. Critics argued that the vehicle's lack of a true rear bumper as well as any reinforcing structure between the rear panel and the tank, meant that in certain collisions, the tank would be thrust forward into the differential, which had a number of protruding bolts that could puncture the tank. This, and the fact that the doors could potentially jam during an accident (due to poor reinforcing) made the car a potential deathtrap.

Ford was aware of this design flaw but allegedly refused to pay what was characterized as the minimal expense of a redesign. Instead, it was argued, Ford decided it would be cheaper to pay off possible lawsuits for resulting deaths. Mother Jones magazine obtained the cost-benefit analysis that it said Ford had used to compare the cost of an $11 repair against the cost of paying off potential law suits, in what became known as the Ford Pinto Memo. The characterization of Ford's design decision as gross disregard for human lives in favor of profits led to major lawsuits, criminal charges, and a costly recall of all affected Pintos. While Ford was acquitted of criminal charges, it lost several million dollars and gained a reputation for manufacturing "the barbecue that seats four."[citation needed]

The most famous Ford Pinto product liability case resulted in a judicial opinion that is a staple of remedies courses in American law schools. In Grimshaw v. Ford Motor Co., 119 Cal. App. 3d 757 (4th Dist. 1981) [1], the California Court of Appeal for the Fourth Appellate District reviewed Ford's conduct, and upheld compensatory damages of $2.5 million and punitive damages of $3.5 million against Ford. It also upheld the judge's reduction of the punitive damages from the jury's original verdict of $125 million. Of the two plaintiffs, one was killed in the collision that caused her Pinto to explode, and her passenger, 13-year old Richard Grimshaw, was badly burned and scarred for life.

However, a 1991 law review paper by Gary Schwartz [2], argued that the case against the Pinto was less clear-cut than commonly supposed. Only 27 people ever died in Pinto fires. Given the Pinto's production figures (over 2 million built), this was no worse than typical for the time, and far less than the "hundreds" claimed by the consumer safety advocates whose allegations are largely responsible for the reputation of the vehicle. Schwartz argued that the car was no more fire-prone than other cars of the time, that its fatality rates were lower than comparably sized imported automobiles, and that the supposed "smoking gun" document that plaintiffs claimed showed Ford's callousness in designing the Pinto was a document based on National Highway Traffic and Safety Administration regulations about the value of a human life rather than a document used to design the Pinto.
Due to the alleged engineering, safety, and reliability problems, Forbes Magazine included the Pinto on its list of the worst cars of all time.

Ironically Ford had originally planned to include an inexpensive rubber bladder inside the gas tank that would have prevented most of the explosive crashes that plagued the car's run; in addition, Ford had also planned to include revolutionary dual front air bags.[citation needed] The addition of these two safety features would have added a few hundred dollars to the $2000 base price of the vehicle but would have probably made it a much safer vehicle.[citation needed] However, it is quite possible Ford would not have sold over two million of the modified car due to the substantial increase in price and may or may not have made less profit.[original research?] The Pinto was once referred to as "the car nobody loved, but everybody bought."
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Old 04-06-2007, 10:13 PM   #23
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How are little bottles suppose to be for kids? They have to be sold to someone over the age of 21 and if a person under the age of 21 is in the store without his/her parent comma guardian comma or spouse over the age of 21 they are breaking the law.

It says that it's twice the alcohol compared to the same amount of beer...thats 10% comma so it's a mixed drink. Heck most mixers are most potent then that. Are premixed margaritas aimed towards kids? Those are about 15% alcohol.

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Old 04-06-2007, 10:14 PM   #24
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They are making a big deal about this here in STL. The people complaining about this are just pissed, they lost their big battle with the brewers about ad campaigns and this is retailiation.

I've tried the stuff, at the AB brewery in STL when they were in the testing phase. It tasted like crap. Worse than crap actually. And once mixed with beer it tasted even worse. I don't think they will have to worry about kids buying this stuff.

But if they want to REALLY go after someone, why not go after the dousche SELLING the beer to the minors. It shouldn't matter who AB markets to, the kids CAN'T DRINK IT IF THEY CAN'T BUY IT. Go attack Joe at the 7-11 as he is the one allowing the minors to actually buy the stuff.

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Old 04-06-2007, 10:28 PM   #25
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Ad campaigns are about creating a demand.

If a demand exists for a product, legal or not, people will endeavor to obtain it.

You can't complain about the hooch makers on this board and not see that this is the same thing.

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Old 04-06-2007, 10:49 PM   #26
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if ya dont want it dont buy it. If ya dont want your 17 year old kid to buy it impress on them, to the degree neccessary, for them not to buy it and rat out the SOB selling booze to minors . . . If you're worried about thew 18-21 crowd, dont They are adults and can make their own decisions, even if the government chooses to refuse to acknowledge that fact.

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Old 04-06-2007, 10:58 PM   #27
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...Go attack Joe at the 7-11 as he is the one allowing the minors to actually buy the stuff...
You have a "Joe" at your 7-11? C'mon....whats that short for?
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Old 04-06-2007, 11:00 PM   #28
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Josiah.

Amish.

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Old 04-06-2007, 11:45 PM   #29
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Free advertising is always good.

Add one of these to BMC and you are still below the ABV of a typical craft brew.

[Yah, I had a Pinto wagon. One of the few American cars of the period with rack & pinion steering, a good manual 4-speed and the best brakes of ANY production vehicle of the era.]

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Old 04-06-2007, 11:51 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby_M
In fact, I bet we can make cars limited to geographical limits just by using RF ids on the speed limit signs.
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Already in the works, complete with cellphone service to traffic court.

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