Online Buying Rather Than Local

Just out of curiosity I know that people purchase there brewing ingredients offline i.e.: hops, yeast, grains, and I was just wondering how it compares to buying from a local brew store. I know I have a few brews coming up in which my local store doesn't have some of the stuff I need. Do you find that what you're ordering is still of good quality? Meaning if you get the grains milled are they still good when you get them? I've heard once your grains are milled they need to be used within 48 hours and with shipping that timeframe would most certainly be out of the question.

I assume it depends on where you buy from. I buy some stuff from Northernbrewer.com (I am not affiliated, dont worry) and am always happy with their product. Using 48 hours after milling isnt anything to believe. I have milled an hour before brewing and milled a month before brewing and have had great beers each time. It is all about proper storage.

I haven't had any issues on grain quality from online orders. I've used a couple of the major vendors and usually receive prompt delivery.

One thing that could alleviate some of your concerns, would be to purchase your own mill, and order your grain un-milled. Obviously there is considerable cost involved, but the ability to mill your own grain can better ensure the freshness, and control of your crush, which can translate into better (or at least more controlled) efficiency.

I've read people experiencing a number of occasions where they've had inconsistent or less than ideal crush on their grains, even when purchasing from a LHBS. I personally saw an improvement on my efficiency once I started milling my own grains, rather than using the mill at the LHBS.

I have bought from (Midwest Supplies, Northern Brewer, Austin Homebrew, etc) many times, and never had an issue with ingredients or quality. Generally the prices are a bit better than I have seen compared to local homebrew shops, but then you have to factor in shipping cost.

Not sure where you heard the 48 hour figure, but it's bollocks. As long as you use the grain within a few weeks you'll be just fine. Some say even a month or so. Just store it in a cool dry place.

I always buy my hops online, several lb at a time and try to split shipping costs with some fellow brewing friends and coworkers. Usually works out around 1/oz depending on time of year and what hops I want.

I consider myself very blessed. I live six miles from Northern Brewer's St. Paul, MN location and their Minneapolis location and Midwest Supply are both on my way home from work. So I get the best prices and quality and get to shop locally!

I order online even though my LHBS is 15 minutes away.

Lower prices (even free shipping with large enough order) and less attitude.

Fortunately MoreBeer is fairly close to me and gets here within a day or so. I crush my own grains now, so it's easier to buy in bulk but even when I was getting them crushed, I kept my crushed grains for a month or more with no noticeable problems.

I tried to arrange my brew schedule to use up open bags and stored the grains in my basement where it's a little cooler. But otherwise took no special measures.

I'm with you KeninMN. Northern Brewer's Minneapolis location is practically on my way home from work. There's not much I need for brewing that I can't find there and their prices are usually pretty competitive with anybody else.

Don't suppose you're part of any of the local homebrew clubs are you? I've been considering joining but just wasn't sure if it's worth it.

Generally larger online shops have plenty of product turnover, so their ingredients are very likely very fresh. It then comes down to the price plus shipping vs price plus gas money...

Bono09 said:

Just out of curiosity I know that people purchase there brewing ingredients offline i.e.: hops, yeast, grains, and I was just wondering how it compares to buying from a local brew store. I know I have a few brews coming up in which my local store doesn't have some of the stuff I need. Do you find that what you're ordering is still of good quality? Meaning if you get the grains milled are they still good when you get them? I've heard once your grains are milled they need to be used within 48 hours and with shipping that timeframe would most certainly be out of the question.

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The grains aren't really a problem, as long as they're used within 2 weeks of milling. And provided that the UPS warehouse doesn't put a forklift fork right through your order, and then they just tape up the remains of your order and finish shipping it to you. Which has happened to me before and caused me to cancel a brew day.

Hops aren't really a problem either. The liquid yeast, though...I've been disappointed in the quality of the yeast after it's been shipped. I don't buy yeast via mail anymore.

cernst151 said:

I'm with you KeninMN. Northern Brewer's Minneapolis location is practically on my way home from work. There's not much I need for brewing that I can't find there and their prices are usually pretty competitive with anybody else.

Don't suppose you're part of any of the local homebrew clubs are you? I've been considering joining but just wasn't sure if it's worth it.

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Joining a homebrew club is the best thing that I've ever done in regards to homebrewing, other than deciding to start homebrewing. I highly recommend finding a local homebrew club and going to a meeting to see if you like it.

LandoLincoln said:

The liquid yeast, though...I've been disappointed in the quality of the yeast after it's been shipped. I don't buy yeast via mail anymore.

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I'm stuck between a rock and a hard place on that one. Shipping liquid yeast sucks in warm weather, but my LHBS doesn't have very high turnover on all but the most popular strains, which means they are almost always selling me 6 month old yeast (or so it seems).

cernst151 said:

Don't suppose you're part of any of the local homebrew clubs are you? I've been considering joining but just wasn't sure if it's worth it.

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I'm not in a club. I'm a total n00b. I've only just brewed my first all grain batch, after starting with extract kits from Northern Brew this past January. I've done thirteen batches total to date, with another batch planned for the second weekend of September. (It would have been next weekend, but I'm traveling the next two weekends in a row. I hate when life gets in the way of brewing!)

KeninMN said:

I'm not in a club. I'm a total n00b. I've only just brewed my first all grain batch, after starting with extract kits from Northern Brew this past January. I've done thirteen batches total to date, with another batch planned for the second weekend of September. (It would have been next weekend, but I'm traveling the next two weekends in a row. I hate when life gets in the way of brewing!)

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I'd say at 13 batches you're out of the "total n00b" category. Maybe "somewhat of a n00b" but not "total n00b". I've lost count but have at least 35 batches of beer, 10-15 batches of cider, 6 batches of wine and 1 batch of sparkling wine under my belt. I'm doing BIAB and love it. Virtually no extra equipment and it's saved me a bunch of money and allowed the flexibility of AG brewing.

No I'm not part of one. Maybe in the future. I'm still very new to the brewing community.

Thank you all for the responses. I will definitely be checking out online now. Especially since you all brought to my attention grains don't need to be used immediately.

Bono09 said:

No I'm not part of one. Maybe in the future. I'm still very new to the brewing community.

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Don't be intimidated. Brewers love to share their experience and give advice (as can be evidenced on this board). Nobody in my club would ever look down on a newbie or avoid talking to them so they're not peppered with a bunch of questions.

I buy my grain from a local brewery, it's only $35 for 55lbs of 2 row. I also get my yeast from there at $60 for 500 grams, and hops usually run me around 6 to 8 bucks a pound, so I buy them in the 11 pound box, split them up and vacuum seal them and throw them in the freezer.

Online, the local shop prices + tax is still more expensive than shipping costs from any interweb retailer.

I bought from a fairly local store for a year or so, but switched to ordering online from Morebeer. The store I was using packaged their hops in little zip lock bags and kept them in a glass door refrigerator. Their extracts were sitting in plastic jars at room temperature and grains in plastic tubs. Dry yeast was kept at room temperature. Dogs in the store were common too.

Once I switched, my beers were much nicer due to fresher and properly handled products. I have never had a problem with anything purchased from Morebeer, and I have been buying from them for almost 6 years.

BobBailey said:

....and grains in plastic tubs.

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I understand all the other issues (and those would be deal breakers for me as well), but what's wrong with storing grain in plastic tubs? That's par for the course at every HBS I've seen, including at one of the big online ones. As long as it's un milled, it should be fine.


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I've used online vendors in the past - austin, More, Brewmasters. Ingredients were always great. However, shipping was sort of an unknown as I live in NE and a day or two delay could be devastating if it resulted in a non-brew day. I have a fantastic LHBS and buy everything I can from them now. I love to support the local business and they are great people.

Bono09 said:

Just out of curiosity I know that people purchase there brewing ingredients offline i.e.: hops, yeast, grains, and I was just wondering how it compares to buying from a local brew store. I know I have a few brews coming up in which my local store doesn't have some of the stuff I need. Do you find that what you're ordering is still of good quality? Meaning if you get the grains milled are they still good when you get them? I've heard once your grains are milled they need to be used within 48 hours and with shipping that timeframe would most certainly be out of the question.

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Why not ask your LHBS to order the items you need? You'll save shipping charges and support your local shop. That means they'll be there when you might really need something urgently.
Also, if you buy the same grains routinely they'll have a reason to stock them.


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My local HBS is awesome. Great support, no attitude whatsoever, no problems answering any questions (or asking them, either). If he carries it, I buy it there. Maybe it costs me an extra buck or two, but to me that minor cost is worth it and I'm glad I'm supporting a local business.

I am also blessed to have a fantastic shop near me. I was ordering hops by the pound online to save money, but recently asked him to order them for me, which he was glad to do.

My local shop stays competitive with on line prices, is run by a cool dude that everybody likes, is open every day but monday, and has good turnover so everything is fresh. He will also sample my beers and give me some good feedback and help me troubleshoot. I am one of the lucky few, and will support him as much as I possibly can, even if I miss out on saving a couple dollars a batch.

If I didnt have such a supportive shop, I would definitely be shopping online.

hunter_la5 said:

I understand all the other issues (and those would be deal breakers for me as well), but what's wrong with storing grain in plastic tubs? That's par for the course at every HBS I've seen, including at one of the big online ones. As long as it's un milled, it should be fine.


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I too keep unmilled grains in plastic tubs. In this store the tubs were on shelves and not always kept covered. With all of the dog hair and dander around it was very unsanitary and not very appetizing.

Having a supportive LBS is a 2 way street. If the dude at your LBS is a jerk, it may be that he's frustrated that he started a business in an area that he loves and everybody and his uncle is buying their stuff online. Even if he's a tool, go there anyway. Take the time to get to know him. Share some of your best brews with him. When I lived in Northern Virginia, I used to bring a growler of what ever I had on tap to my LBS. Of course, I didn't feel bad about asking him to order something funky. When I did, I was certain to bring a sample by so that he could taste it. When I moved, I had a couple of half finished kegs that I couldn't transport because I was going to be in a hotel for 3 weeks, so I swapped them for a couple of empty NEW kegs. Try that with an online retailer.

LandoLincoln said:

Don't be intimidated. Brewers love to share their experience and give advice (as can be evidenced on this board). Nobody in my club would ever look down on a newbie or avoid talking to them so they're not peppered with a bunch of questions.

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I'll definitely have to get involved in one. I know from this site that there are a few guys from my areas on here.

I'm split. My LHBS is rarely open, and doesn't usually have all the stuff I need or they don't turn over their inventory fast enough. So I don't buy much from them and prefer to go online. The next closest place is ~50 miles away. Whenever I am down there I usually buy from them instead, but that is only about once a month.

I've pretty much stopped using my LHBS, way too much attitude and their prices are ridiculous. You know they are expensive when I can buy a 25kg sack of grain $20 cheaper at Whole Foods. I receive MoreBeer shipments in one day and shipping isn't bad considering gas prices.

A little off topic, but my LHBS is Austin Homebrew and I still order online...from Austin Homebrew. It feels a little bourgeois and lazy, but the way I look at it, 2 hours of my Saturday is worth more to me than the $7.99 for shipping.

EDITED TO ADD: AHBS is all the way across town from me.

I prefer to support local businesses if I can, the closest store to me is only open in the afternoon even on Saturday...they do sell online and I have ordered online ... mostly I order online from the closest store and drive there (about 20 minute ride through the country) and pick up stuff (they always have it ready for me so its normally a quick run in and then out). I buy in bulk as much as possible so shipping multiple 50lb and 20lb bags is not cost effective. I like the owner he is great guy as are of the other employees. We have often exchanged brews just for fun and feedback. Also if I need something special they will order it with out any extra charge.

About 60 miles away is a great LHBS but I can only get there occasionally.

LandoLincoln said:

Joining a homebrew club is the best thing that I've ever done in regards to homebrewing, other than deciding to start homebrewing. I highly recommend finding a local homebrew club and going to a meeting to see if you like it.

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I should clarify: I'm not in an official club, but a fair number of my coworkers are home brewers, so in a sense it's a de-facto club. (In fact, it was one of my coworkers who got me interested in home brewing, and was an invaluable resource after I made the plunge.) We swap information, harvested yeast and finished brews on a regular basis...

I move to a new town every 3 to 6 months for work but have been lucky to find a local shop nearby in almost every place. One of those places was just a small area in an Ace hardware but with a surprisingly good selection. Currently I am in Eureka, CA and the LHBS here is fantastic. The owners let me taste grains to get a better understanding of them and they have tasted my beers to give me feedback. I also like the idea of supporting the local stores. I have ordered from online stores too when a local shop was too far away ( Joshua Tree, CA for example) and had good experiences, especially with NB. My buddy in SoCal orders from them exclusively and is always getting good deals. For me though, there is nothing like that face to face interaction.

BobBailey said:

Once I switched, my beers were much nicer due to fresher and properly handled products. I have never had a problem with anything purchased from Morebeer, and I have been buying from them for almost 6 years.

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Thanks for the tip. I've been buying nearly all of my supplies/ingredients from Northern Brewer. While I've been pleased with their quality (ie, no problems), I bounced on over to MoreBeer's website and I like their pricing AND FREE SHIPPING!

Homercidal said:

Generally larger online shops have plenty of product turnover, so their ingredients are very likely very fresh. It then comes down to the price plus shipping vs price plus gas money plus value of my time...

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FIFY

I order the vast majority of my ingredients and equipment online, not only because of the vastly better selection, but because I value my time. My LHBS is a good 20 minute drive from my home. That's 40 minutes round trip, plus whatever time I spend in the store. I'd much rather order what I need from my iPad while I'm watching Game of Thrones and have it magically show up on my doorstep 2 days later than try to find an hour of my weekend (the store closes at 4:30 on weekdays - too early for me to get there after work) when I could be brewing instead.

Much like my cigars, I find I make most of my brewing purchases online but do occassionally drop by my local retailer just out of a sense of wanting to support them or when I want something right away.

I agree with bobbailey. Morebeer free shipping fresh quality ingredients. Cheapest prices I have found. I buy 4 kits, lots of dry yeast lots of half pound hops, and several 10lb bags of grain every other month. That's two years now. Very satisfied customer. A brew shop can't compete with online selection.


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i hear there is a shop in south Austin now.

I'm very fortunate. I have morebeer for fast free shipping from Pittsburgh to Pittsburgh. I also have a LHBS walking distance from work and another 4 miles from home. I try to patronize the LHBS first. If they don't have it I'll order online. (just never brew on a Sunday...the LHBS is closed Sunday and Monday)