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jmf143 · 11-30-2011, 12:55 PM

I'm brewing an IPA for the first time. My additions are

CaSO4: 11.5 gms in Mash tun
CaCl2: 1.5 gms in Mash tun
Sauermalz (oz): 2 gms in Mash tun

resulting in

Mash Water / Total water (ppm):
Ca: 226 / 113
Mg: 8 / 8
Na: 6 / 6
Cl: 57 / 30
SO4: 438 /198
Cl to SO4 Ratio: 0.13 / 0.15

Alkalinity (CaCO3): -13
RA: -180
Estimated pH: 5.48 (room temp)

I've never added that much gypsum before, but then again I've never brewed an IPA either.

***Yooper*** · 11-30-2011, 01:08 PM

That sure seems like a lot to me, but I don't add much of either CaCl2 or CaS04 to mine- just "enough". I know that some brewers go with a "pale ale profile" that is high in sulfate.

I made an IPA yesterday (10 gallons) and I used a water profile more like this:

Ca 132
Mg 17
Na 6
S04 135
Cl 99
Hco3 152

pH 5.4

I know that sulfate is supposed to "enhance bitterness" but I'm finding in my own brewing that less is more, and I'm getting better beer by adding less salts to it. The above water profile is a typical APA/IPA water for my brewing. I generally stick with it.

DSmith · 11-30-2011, 02:35 PM

Maybe a tangent question...

Is it common to add all the salts to the mash only to get the greatest pH reduction for all Ca added? I think that's what's planned in the salt additions from the orignal post in this tread.

The only negative I can think of though reading posts is that you'd loose more Ca to the mash grain by adding all the salts to the mash instead of just adding the sparge water salts to the brew kettle.

jmf143 · 11-30-2011, 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DSmith

Maybe a tangent question...

Is it common to add all the salts to the mash only to get the greatest pH reduction for all Ca added? I think that's what's planned in the salt additions from the orignal post in this tread.

The only negative I can think of though reading posts is that you'd loose more Ca to the mash grain by adding all the salts to the mash instead of just adding the sparge water salts to the brew kettle.

As far as I know, splitting them between mash and sparge results in the same amounts going into the boil kettle, but in my case requires more acid malt in the mash to hit the same pH. I'm not aware of any "absorption" of the ions by the grain in the mash but I suppose its possible.

When I actually brew this recipe I'll split up the salts between the mash and sparge. For purposes of my question it was easier to show them all added to the mash.

**ajdelange** · 11-30-2011, 03:40 PM

Whether that level of sulfate is excessive or not is entirely a matter of personal taste. It would be too much for me but it is not for many brewers.

As for loss of ions in the mash: some calcium and magnesium precipitate out (as the phosphate). This lowers the pH which caused much of the bicarbonate to convert to CO2 and be driven off (by heat). The other ions make it through.

DSmith · 11-30-2011, 04:10 PM

Ya, I was implying that not all the calcium would make it into the kettle if added to the mash water. By treating the mash water only and reserving the sparge salt additions, with equal volumes, you may end up with an extra 50% calcium in the kettle vs just treating all the water the same.

I assume the minimum target for calcium (50 ppm) is assuming all the water is treated the same, not concentration in the kettle. I haven't found that stated anywhere, can you confirm that?

This question stems from planning water for a pilsner. It seems like a good idea to put all the calcium salts in with the mash to reduce the pH (not by much), but a bad idea because it will result in the least amount of calcium in the kettle in a senerio where the 50ppm calcium limit has been suggested to be reduced to 30ppm.

**ajdelange** · 11-30-2011, 05:18 PM

I'm not sure what is magical about 50. More is better from some points of view and less is better from others. I repeatedly point out that many world class beers (the Bohemian Pilsners) are brewed with water containing much less than 50 ppm calcium. This is in part responsible for their wonderful, soft mellow quality. With such low calcium mash pH must be set with acid and that is, reportedly, exactly what they do. A home brewer will need acid too even with 50 ppm Ca++.

mabrungard · 11-30-2011, 05:20 PM

A target sulfate concentration of around 300 ppm is going to require about 2 gm gypsum per gallon, so the 11.5 gm in 5.5 gallons is quite reasonable. I routinely use 300 ppm sulfate as the target for my Pale Ales. Very tasty and award winning.