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Old 05-17-2008, 03:32 PM   #1
kentronix
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Default My experiences so far, and wheat malt extract questions

Thanks to some excellent advice on this forum I am now just starting to drink my second batch of weissbier

First batch was Muntons Wheat Beer. It turned out ok, I was pretty happy. It didnt carbonate as much as I would have liked and it just didnt seem quite what I was after. Still nice though and it didnt last long

Second batch is Morgans wheat, this is far better, an excellent kit to start experimenting with. Lacking in body and not quite wheaty enough.

I am aiming for something like paulaner or an unfiltered tuchers.

I plan on adding extra wheat malt extract to raise the wheat/barley ratio (and remove some sugar). From what I see these extracts are actually a mix of wheat and barley, is it possible to get pure wheat extract ? I am in the uk but if anyone knows a brand which is 100% wheat I could hunt it down. Either dme or lme.

I think the current kit is around 50/50, I want to get to 65% wheat really.

So if I replace half the sugar with 100% wheat and the rest with honey I am hoping to get closer to my perfect brew. I bought honey which has the sugar content marked on it so I will no how much to add.

I also plan to use dme to prime as although the head is excellent its very short lived at the moment.

I have been reading up on all the proper brewery processes and it seems leaving it for a while chilled is beneficial. What I have been doing is leaving it as long as I can bear and then chilling it last minute. Should I ensure I allow enough time for it to chill a while ? Cutting into the warm storage time ?

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Old 05-17-2008, 03:41 PM   #2
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Hi,
You won't find 100% wheat since wheat does not contain enough enzymes to be mashed on its own. For extracts, 50/50 is typical for a wheat mix. To get to 65% wheat you would probably have to go all grain.

I do recommend replacing sugar with malt if you are using sugar for anything but priming - this will give you much better results and body. Sugar amounts above 1 lb tend to leave the beer thin and with a cider flavor.

DME for priming is OK, but corn sugar is just fine for priming as well.

Chilling your beer will help it clear, but you need to do this after its had a chance to carbonate - usually 2 weeks of carb time, then you can put it in the fridge to cool and clear.

Cheers,
Brad

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Old 05-17-2008, 03:58 PM   #3
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I don't think priming with dme will help head retention. Try a partial mash with some flaked wheat and some 2 row to get the body, head retention, and cloudiness that your after.

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Old 05-17-2008, 04:18 PM   #4
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Thanks for your advice guys I am feeling my way through at this stage, does anyone know of any significantly higher than 50/50 ?
If I replace all the sugar with say 80%, that would probably do. Why are the kits and premixed so low when proper weissbiers are more like 60% or 70% ? I guess its the cost/difficulty of mashing higher percentage wheat.

I thought wheat dme was better for a frothy head ? I am sure I read it somewhere

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Old 05-18-2008, 06:44 AM   #5
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Hi,
Here's an article on wheat beers. A 50/50 mix is perfectly find for a Weisse and about the best you will do if you go with extract.

The head has more to do with the body of the beer than the DME/sugar priming. Wheat beers typically have a nice white frothy head due to the wheat which is high in protein, so I would not worry about it much.

Cheers,
Brad

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Old 05-18-2008, 02:25 PM   #6
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Cheers for the link very handy, good to see berliner mentioned seperately. Its the berliner weisse that I am after in the long run, like paulaner.

Obviously I plan to move on from the kits at some point but I am just starting my 3rd brew so want to get the hang of the process while still making small changes.

I think remove the sugar is the first priority, I just dont seem to get enough body using brewers sugar. I am ending up with perfectly drinkable lagery wheat beer, nice, but not ideal.

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Old 05-18-2008, 02:30 PM   #7
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A Berliner Weiss and a Paulaner are nothing alike.

BW's are lighter in body and lower in alcohol than Paulaner HWs.

If you use Munton's Wheat DME you should not need anything else.

The use of sugar or honey in either brew is not recommended except CS at bottling.

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Old 05-18-2008, 02:39 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by homebrewer_99 View Post
The use of sugar or honey in either brew is not recommended except CS at bottling.
I agree. Both of these, honey and sugar, will make you beer have less body and finish dryer.

Also, what yeast are you using? Not that contributes directly to the body but can change your perception. Depending on what kind of beer you are looking to make, it might be helpful to use a different yeast than what is included in the kit.
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Old 05-18-2008, 03:44 PM   #9
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At the moment I am just using the yeast that comes in the kit.

I switched 1 pound of the sugar to honey because both batches so far have a slight taste which could just about be described as cidery. It seems like an real art at the moment so I am trying to swap one thing at a time so I know exactly what causes what.

Maybe I have had strange Berliner Weiss before, I must say I didnt have many but it was a europe tour so I didnt find out what most of them were. And didnt remember the few that I did for obvious reasons

I am basically after a full bodied weissbier but with a more crisp taste and far more subtle in terms of esters than sneider weisse or weihenstephan. Oh well, looks like I have to go out and drink far more

I noticed a paulaner recipe in the recipe section so will be paying attention to that.

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Old 05-18-2008, 07:41 PM   #10
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From your description you need to reduce your fermenting temp to under 70 to get more of a clovy flavor versus a banana and eliminate all corn sugar and honey.

Also, per a recipe, try reducing the 6 lbs of DME to 5, the hops by 15% and use a proper German yeast for HWs.

It will reduce the alcohol percentage very little, but it will be more refreshing. Keep the same amount of water.

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