Whale Hunter

[Ding]

I didn't know there was a right and wrong way to be craft beer person. If you let the actions of others affect your enjoyment of the craft beer world (and I should think you don't based on your strong-held beliefs on how a beer should be enjoyed), you're doing it wrong. Why can't you just have some fun with this? I hope beer never becomes what you want it to be; a rigid culture following a fixed set of beliefs and practices, and rules dictating how, when, and where a beer can be enjoyed.

I guess I feel that the short term 'fun', will have long term consequences that will be bad for everyone.

 

[pjl44]

I guess I feel that the short term 'fun', will have long term consequences that will be bad for everyone.

What are you envisioning? A vast majority of breweries leaving the market because they will cease being economically viable? How will this future landscape differ from today's?

 

[yeahnatenelson]

I think that there is a whole generation of American geeks that don't understand the basics of beer, are wowed by the whale, and as such are likely to get bored and move on as the fad fades for them. In terms of finances, effort and time, perusing such things in perpetuity is unfeasible for many, as work, children, money and life get in the way. As a result, it's entirely possible that the American scene will lose a large cadre of beer drinkers, and the underlying sub-culture will be depleted/damaged. That's to say nothing of the brewers that are neglecting to perfect simple styles, techniques and sustainable production at the expense of the next limited release.

I agree that there are a lot of people on forums such as these that get excited about "rare" beers that don't want to be bothered about understanding beer, or appreciating all beer styles or even the classics of the styles they do frantically seek out. That said, the "whale chasers" are a very small segment of this community, which itself is a very small segment of the craft beer buying market.

Like more mature liquor markets such as wine and whiskey, there will be a spectrum of products in the craft beer segment to suit all tastes and budgets, running the gamut of the affordable daily drinkers to the CA cult wines, first growths Bordeaux and high age statement single malts and American whiskeys.

 

[Michigan1]

I guess I feel that the short term 'fun', will have long term consequences that will be bad for everyone.

I'll disagree with you to the very core of that statement. First, beer is all about having fun. Second, there will always be a small segment of EVERY hobby that takes it to the extreme. I think these segments actually make the whole stronger. In the communities that I am a part of (guitars, beer, cars, culinary arts, and fountain pens) there will always be the equivalent to the 'whale hunter'; that's the nature of a hobby. Those with the means and passion for the hunt, will do it. Everybody has their own personal pinnacle to their hobby, and they should be allowed to define it and seek it by any means they see fit. Third, I think this unrelenting passion for something helps to drive creativity and leaves a wake of interest and enthusiasm that builds a larger and stronger group.

 

[MordorMongo]

Anyone else craving a BA lambic session ale right now?

 

[stupac2]

There are a lot of problems with Ding's arguments here, but I think the one that bothers me the most is the idea that this is completely black and white. I like English ales on cask, and I like that there are more places around here brewing/serving them. I also like lambic. I like drinking rare beer. The other day I was at Mikkellerbar, the first thing I ordered was a 2005 Cantillon gueuze, the second was a 5% cask stout. The bar down the street from me has beers on cask. Over the past couple weeks the beer that I've had more than all others combined is 1500, a local pale ale. The first beer I had on my kegerator was a Schwarzbier. But I also really like bourbon barrel aged stouts and Berliner Weisses and American Wilds.

There's no reason that someone has to be pigeonholed into just one of these things, and there's no reason why the beer scene in American can't combine all these things and more.

I'm also pretty baffled by all this because I've been to British pubs (though maybe the ones in Oxford aren't "real English pubs", what do I know?) and they don't seem that much different from pubs here (they're different from bars in that they served food). Is the fact that they serve beers on cask and the ABVs cover a smaller range really enough to turn the scene into a horrible monster? If anything I'd say it's less healthy in that, as far as I could tell, all the beers were made by the same few places (Green King, Smith's, Fuller's).

 

[Michigan1]

 

[SeaWatchman]

This thread was boring. Then Michigan posted that picture.

 

[dontdrinkbeer]

This thread was boring. Then Michigan posted that picture.

It's crazy to think all judeochristian ethics were predicated on those 10 statements written in a language undeveloped at that time.

Straight Apollonian vs Dinoysian moral theory, Ding is the unmoved mover.

God truly works in mysterious ways.

 

[Michigan1]

Ding is the unmoved mover.

This is the greatest thing ever posted on this site.

 

[drgarage1]

It's crazy to think all judeochristian ethics were predicated on those 10 statements written in a language undeveloped at that time.

Straight Apollonian vs Dinoysian moral theory, Ding is the unmoved mover.

God truly works in mysterious ways.

8/10. Docked for spelling of "Dionysian" unless we are talking about T-Rex wine, in which case, carry on.

 

[Ding]

What are you envisioning? A vast majority of breweries leaving the market because they will cease being economically viable? How will this future landscape differ from today's?

I tried to outline that, above.

 

[Ding]

I'll disagree with you to the very core of that statement. First, beer is all about having fun. Second, there will always be a small segment of EVERY hobby that takes it to the extreme. I think these segments actually make the whole stronger. In the communities that I am a part of (guitars, beer, cars, culinary arts, and fountain pens) there will always be the equivalent to the 'whale hunter'; that's the nature of a hobby. Those with the means and passion for the hunt, will do it. Everybody has their own personal pinnacle to their hobby, and they should be allowed to define it and seek it by any means they see fit. Third, I think this unrelenting passion for something helps to drive creativity and leaves a wake of interest and enthusiasm that builds a larger and stronger group.

I think that in the US, the extreme group (in all hobby areas) represents a much larger % than it does in other countries, and that's what makes it different.

 

[Michigan1]

I think that in the US, the extreme group (in all hobby areas) represents a much larger % than it does in other countries, and that's what makes it different.

Source? Or did you just pull this out of your ass?

 

[falc0n26001]

The only thing annoying about whale hunters is when they buy up the entire store's allotment of a rare beer so that nobody else can try it. Or an entire region's! If there is a posted limit, it's there so that other people can try the beer, not so that you can call all your friends/relatives to buy more beer than the store owners intended. Other than that, hunt on!!

 

[MordorMongo]

I think that in the US, the extreme group (in all hobby areas) represents a much larger % than it does in other countries, and that's what makes it different.

You "think"? Why, because your exposure has been slanted towards internet communities full of extremists? Do you have any actual facts to back that up? I ask because damn man, you infer a LOT based upon your own tiny sample points.

It would basically be like if I inferred the UK beer culture is going to be stuck with a handful of similar choices from very few breweries because YOU are a representative sample of UK craft beer culture.

Nomsayin'?

 

[Michigan1]

The only thing annoying about whale hunters is when they buy up the entire store's allotment of a rare beer so that nobody else can try it. Or an entire region's! If there is a posted limit, it's there so that other people can try the beer, not so that you can call all your friends/relatives to buy more beer than the store owners intended. Other than that, hunt on!!

Those aren't whale hunters. Those are FIBs

 

[Treebs]

I think that in the US, the extreme group (in all hobby areas) represents a much larger % than it does in other countries, and that's what makes it different.

You say you think, but then try and push this notion off as fact. Unless you are involved in every single hobby in existence in every country there really isn't a way to tell if the % is higher in the US than any other country.

 

[pjl44]

I tried to outline that, above.

I was hoping for more clarification because I don't think you really did. Sure, a segment of the community may split. We disagree on what slice of the pie they represent. I'd like to know what you think about the impact of that. What will happen to stores, breweries, and bars? What options will I have as a consumer? How will that look different than what I experience now?

 

[MordorMongo]

For slight relevance I feel I should point out that Upland always has a crowd of people in their pubs drinking (and paying) for their regular line up. This fact alone pretty much deems all of Ding's points about the American beer scene irrelevant.

 

[drgarage1]

For slight relevance I feel I should point out that Upland always has a crowd of people in their pubs drinking (and paying) for their regular line up. This fact alone pretty much deems all of Ding's points about the American beer scene irrelevant.

DAT DOUBLE DRAGONFLY

 

[Ding]

You say you think, but then try and push this notion off as fact. Unless you are involved in every single hobby in existence in every country there really isn't a way to tell if the % is higher in the US than any other country.

No I didn't, I said 'I think'.

 

[dontdrinkbeer]

8/10. Docked for spelling of "Dionysian" unless we are talking about T-Rex wine, in which case, carry on.

Haha god damn iPhone always undermining my high handed references.

Other times I type "mite" like a 14 year old Filipino and iPhone is like "oh mite I got this, autocorrect, MITOCHONDRIA."

I mitochondria need to get a new phone

 

[Ding]

For slight relevance I feel I should point out that Upland always has a crowd of people in their pubs drinking (and paying) for their regular line up. This fact alone pretty much deems all of Ding's points about the American beer scene irrelevant.

Well, presumably you'll stop responding to me, then.

 

[Michigan1]

Ding, take your own advice.
http://www.talkbeer.com/community/threads/confirmed-i-have-no-place-in-contemporary-us-scene.6028/

 

[MordorMongo]

Well, presumably you'll stop responding to me, then.

Hahahaha you don't know me very well then, obviously.

Much like you, I consider myself generally to be right, all the time. Difference is I am humble enough to listen to (and respect) other people's opinions and consider (albeit briefly) that maybe I am wrong or could learn something.

 

[Ding]

Hahahaha you don't know me very well then, obviously.
Much like you, I consider myself generally to be right, all the time. Difference is I am humble enough to listen to (and respect) other people's opinions and consider (albeit briefly) that maybe I am wrong or could learn something.

Me too, but not on everything (for example, the definition of session beer and what makes for a sensible way of showcase the delivery method that is cask).

 

[Ding]

Ding, take your own advice.
http://www.talkbeer.com/community/threads/confirmed-i-have-no-place-in-contemporary-us-scene.6028/

Thanks, warm and fuzzy over here!

 

[Michigan1]

 

[cneville1]

ding gtfo this isn't your ama you have your own

edit: Ding so i don't look like some subtweeting girly man