American Pale Ale Three Floyds Zombie Dust Clone

[Mx750ktm]

Yes.
Yes, more than enough (I have used 1 pack several times). Check out this yeast pitching calculator: http://www.mrmalty.com/calc/calc.html

Alright thanks for you quick reply. What's the advantage of adding your first wort hop that early. Does it make it more bitter or what's the reasoning in it?

Also I was using a yeast pitching calculator on brewersfriend.com but it was showing even with 2 packets I would be quite a bit short and that didn't seem right to me. It must not be to accurate.

 

[madams]

What is the consensus with using WLP002? Is 1968 the most original? 5,300,054 pages is a lot to read thru to get the answer. Lol Thanks ahead of time.

 

[skeezerpleezer]

Alright thanks for you quick reply. What's the advantage of adding your first wort hop that early. Does it make it more bitter or what's the reasoning in it?



Also I was using a yeast pitching calculator on brewersfriend.com but it was showing even with 2 packets I would be quite a bit short and that didn't seem right to me. It must not be to accurate.

It provides a smoother bitterness, some say similar to a 20 minute addition. That is why the recipe calculates it as a 20 min FWH addition, not 60.

 

[skeezerpleezer]

What is the consensus with using WLP002? Is 1968 the most original? 5,300,054 pages is a lot to read thru to get the answer. Lol Thanks ahead of time.

It should work fine.

 

[mtnagel]

It provides a smoother bitterness, some say similar to a 20 minute addition. That is why the recipe calculates it as a 20 min FWH addition, not 60.

Funny that I just listened to the Brew Strong podcast on imperial IPAs from last year and Jamil doesn't like FWH and mash hops. He said in blind tests with him and others that it gives a harsher bitterness. Which I know is the opposite of what everyone says here. Just another data point.

 

[TheCanisDirus]

Funny that I just listened to the Brew Strong podcast on imperial IPAs from last year and Jamil doesn't like FWH and mash hops. He said in blind tests with him and others that it gives a harsher bitterness. Which is know is the opposite of what everyone says here. Just another data point.

That's odd... i was listening to a recent one where Jamil and John were saying positive things about FWH. I believe it might have been the recent Crosby Farms episode... or something in the last 3 months (that i'm sure of". Wonder if he changed his mind with something they experimented with at Heretic.

 

[danorocks17]

I spoke to soon. I pulled the first two pints or so off the keg, which had a funky flavor, but the rest is fantastic already.

 

[mtnagel]

That's odd... i was listening to a recent one where Jamil and John were saying positive things about FWH. I believe it might have been the recent Crosby Farms episode... or something in the last 3 months (that i'm sure of". Wonder if he changed his mind with something they experimented with at Heretic.

Bizarre. Perhaps he did change his mind but he was very clear that he did blind testing and he didn't like it and that anyone that did like it wasn't doing blind testing.

I spoke to soon. I pulled the first two pints or so off the keg, which had a funky flavor, but the rest is fantastic already.

This makes me think that I'm using my keg wrong. I've only kegged 2 beers so far and both tasted terrible for the first few weeks over multiple samples and then tasted great. But I only take small samples at first.

Typically I will pour off a couple ounces to clear what's in the line and drink that, then I'll pour a small ~4 oz sample. I repeat that every few days and I've come to the conclusion that my beer tastes better after 4 weeks in the keg (~6 weeks after brewing). These were both IPAs too. But perhaps I should be pulling off a couple pints right away? And then I can drink the rest. Is it due to the yeast settling at the bottom, which you're clearing off after a couple pints?

 

[danorocks17]

Typically I will pour off a couple ounces to clear what's in the line and drink that, then I'll pour a small ~4 oz sample. I repeat that every few days and I've come to the conclusion that my beer tastes better after 4 weeks in the keg (~6 weeks after brewing). These were both IPAs too. But perhaps I should be pulling off a couple pints right away? And then I can drink the rest. Is it due to the yeast settling at the bottom, which you're clearing off after a couple pints?

I think it was due to the ridiculous amount of hops used in the beer. I didn't filter out anything post boil or when I kegged, so all that hop gunk was still floating around. once that all settled to the bottom, I could pull it off with a few pints and then it's good to go. that's my theory at least hahaha

 

[mtnagel]

That could be it too. I did use a hop spider with a paint strainer bag for all the kettle hops and a paint strainer for the dry hops, so I probably didn't have as many hop particles, but I'm sure there is still some.

 

[skeezerpleezer]

Funny that I just listened to the Brew Strong podcast on imperial IPAs from last year and Jamil doesn't like FWH and mash hops. He said in blind tests with him and others that it gives a harsher bitterness. Which is know is the opposite of what everyone says here. Just another data point.

Jamil is definitely a expert and very knowledgeable and I am someone who plays around with making beer on my patio, so I am not going to say he is wrong. I have not listened to either of the episodes mentioned above, however I am curious to their their method of determining "harshness". If at some point there is scientific evidence proving that there is no benefit to using FWH I would still use it because if nothing else it smells great.

In my opinion, the "harshness" probably depends on things such as hop type, style of beer, or the person's pallette---similar to the flavors that certain hops/yeast/etc give. Maybe the whole "FWH makes it less harsh/more flavor & aroma/etc" thing is fictional, but you would have a hard time convincing me that this recipe tastes like it has ~85 ibus, which is what it would calculate as a 60 minute addition. It tastes more like 55-65 based on other beers I have drank that were advertised as having a similar IBU count. I have never cared enough to send any in to a lab to see what the actual IBU count is, but if FFF did and it is indeed ~60, then this one is much closer to that than 85.

Here is a quote from Denny Conn, who did an experiment with Jamil on FWH: "Jamil participated in a FWH experiment I did. Like Joe said, the results were kinda all over the place. It's subjective, it seems, and you have to make up your own mind. To my tastebuds, FWH adds the same amount of bitterness as a 20 min. addition. That means that in in Promash, I set my my FWH utilization to -65. Other people have other perceptions. When I did the experiment, I split a batch of wort. One half got only a 60 min. Cascade addition, the other got only the same amount of Cascade as FWH. The results were split between which tasted hoppier. When I had them analyzed, the FWH beer had about 2 more IBU than the 60 min. only beer. But to many people, it didn't taste as hoppy. " If anyone has a link to the report/results of that experiment I would like to check it out. My quick search for it came up empty.

 

[scrub0bk]

did my first BIAB with this as a 3gal batch. Missed the OG a bit which i think was due to my mash temp which dropped to about 149 halfway through. Smells awesome in the fermenter and went crazy in the first 24 hours and has calmed down since.

hoping everything goes well - will dry hop for about 6 days after about 10 days of fermenting. Hoping for a nice tasty IPA even if it doesn't come out exactly like ZD

 

[Mx750ktm]

Just brewed this via biab. It's cooling down now!! Half way through the mash I happened to realize that he lhbs didn't give many any C60 hopefully the half pound isn't make or break on this recipe

 

[Paradigm]

I just ordered the ingredients to brew this, though I subbed the carafoam for some 10L cara grain, is that OK? I did some reading and that seemed to be the general conensus.

 

[mtnagel]

I haven't listened to it yet, but interestingly based on the FWH discussion earlier, Basic Brewing Radio just added a podcast about hopping techniques:

May 8, 2014 - Hopping Technique Experiment



Homebrewer David Curtis shares his experiment comparing mash hopping, first wort hopping and traditional 60-minute boil hopping.

 

[skeezerpleezer]

I will check that out tomorrow!

 

[mtnagel]

So I listened today and what I got out of it was that mash hopping was different from FWH and 60 minute additions, but those methods produced very similar beers. They didn't give out the IBU numbers (will at a conference later), but the taste perceptions were they were very similar and if anything, I heard people say the FWH tasted more bitter, which makes sense despite what everyone says because they are in there at near boiling for longer than the 60 minute addition so you are going to get more IBUs from that (we'll see if the measurements back that up).

Obviously this is just one test and I'd be curious to see what it did to the IBU numbers, but honestly taste is really all that matters here. But I think for me it just means I don't have to be so paranoid about dropping in the 60 minute hops at exactly the first sign of boiling. After pulling my BIAB and starting to heat, I can get my hop spider ready and just dump in the bittering hops at any point before it boils. I don't need to be so concerned with getting them in the second I pull the bag for FWH or the second I see the first bubble for 60 minute hops.

 

[Purdue22]

I have brewed this beer both ways (60 min and FWH) and the FWH was definitely more bitter. Brewed 10 gallon AG with no other changes both times. I prefer the FWH and I think it is closer to ZD but my wife on the other hand liked the 60 minute version... Both were great so I wouldn't sweat it either way.


Sent from my iPhone using Home Brew

 

[Komodo]

Jamil is definitely a expert and very knowledgeable and I am someone who plays around with making beer on my patio, so I am not going to say he is wrong.

I always find him slightly conservative about stuff, but I don't think that's really surprising. Lots of brewers start out doing "hazelnut chocolate banana razz berry stout" and then later on simplify.

What drives me insane about Jamil is that he sounds EXACTLY like Phil Helmuth. Anyone play poker?

 

[mtnagel]

I have brewed this beer both ways (60 min and FWH) and the FWH was definitely more bitter. Brewed 10 gallon AG with no other changes both times. I prefer the FWH and I think it is closer to ZD but my wife on the other hand liked the 60 minute version... Both were great so I wouldn't sweat it either way.


Sent from my iPhone using Home Brew

Good to know. Thanks

 

[JonGrafto]

I always find him slightly conservative about stuff, but I don't think that's really surprising. Lots of brewers start out doing "hazelnut chocolate banana razz berry stout" and then later on simplify.



What drives me insane about Jamil is that he sounds EXACTLY like Phil Helmuth. Anyone play poker?

I HATE Phil Hellmuth... D-Bag central right there...



On a different note, brewing this up tomorrow night...

Upped it to a 15 gallon batch...

 

[Steve3730]

What fermentation schedule is everyone using? 10 days in primary than dry hopped 7 days in secondary and than keg/bottle

 

[ljames]

What fermentation schedule is everyone using? 10 days in primary than dry hopped 7 days in secondary and than keg/bottle

I went with:
7-Primary
7-DH
Bottled - tested after 2 weeks, tasted pretty good. Got much better as it got older. Will be brewing again soon!

 

[garrett19]

What fermentation schedule is everyone using? 10 days in primary than dry hopped 7 days in secondary and than keg/bottle

I have brewed this three times. Its my favorite brew by far! I go for 10-14 in the primary and 5 in the secondary for DH. Then to the Keg!

Garrett

 

[jaydog2314]

What fermentation schedule is everyone using? 10 days in primary than dry hopped 7 days in secondary and than keg/bottle

brewed this one 3 times, currently on tap and I have followed 10-7-keg

 

[mtnagel]

I missed getting some of the real stuff by 2 hours. Well my friend did. It was on their to go list and he was heading up to Chicago, so he was going to get me some so I could compare, but they had sold out 2 hours before he got there. Oh well. I've had the real stuff a few times as it shows up in Cincy sometimes.

 

[jammin]

I missed getting some of the real stuff by 2 hours. Well my friend did. It was on their to go list and he was heading up to Chicago, so he was going to get me some so I could compare, but they had sold out 2 hours before he got there. Oh well. I've had the real stuff a few times as it shows up in Cincy sometimes.

i have a couple bottles in the fridge if you wanna do a small trade?

 

[mtnagel]

Thanks for the offer, but I'm good.

 

[Brewmex41]

i have a couple bottles in the fridge if you wanna do a small trade?

I would.

 

[Roadie]

Brewed this for a wedding my son is attending tomorrow as we're providing 4 kegs and rolling kegerator to help them save some cash as groom lost his job a short while ago. We've had it on gas for a little over a week and when brewing on Tuesday my son for some reason decided to hook up a beer line to it and connect to our home keezer. Unfortunately he didn't have all the way seated so when I went to put gelatin in yesterday I popped open the lid (keezer wasn't on at that moment and it was dark inside) and pour the gelatin inside only to hear that the keg is now only 1/2 filled. I turn all the brewery lights on and yep a couple gallons of beer in bottom of keezer. Sucks a$$.