The [Horribly Unpopular] Soccer Thread

[hoppyhoppyhippo]

We could play the back and forth quote game all night

Jose Mourhino - “it was a poor decision”.

Former Ref Dermot Gallagher - "I don't think I would have given a red card for that offense"

And if context doesn't matter and a dangerous play is a dangerous play, then why wasn't Diego Lopez sent off?

 

[hopstupid]

We could play the back and forth quote game all night

Jose Mourhino - “it was a poor decision”.

Former Ref Dermot Gallagher - "I don't think I would have given a red card for that offense"

And if context doesn't matter and a dangerous play is a dangerous play, then why wasn't Diego Lopez sent off?

sure that looks like it could of been a red

I also like the edit on the pic Live doesn't look that bad



I like this one better though

 

[dwarven_stout]

"Retired referee Graham Poll on BBC Radio 5 live: "Only one offence has to be intentional - handball. It's not what you mean to do but what you actually do. He intended to jump that high with his foot raised - that's intentional. It's unfortunate, he's not that kind of player but the referee was doing his job and it is wholly wrong for us to castigate him for doing his job."

Just requoting yourself quoting someone else adds absolutely nothing to the discussion.

 

[hopstupid]

Just requoting yourself quoting someone else adds absolutely nothing to the discussion.

Umm I edited the post he quoted while he was writing his post

So his quote of my post didn't include that part


So actually

It did

 

[hoppyhoppyhippo]

sure that looks like it could of been a red

I also like the edit on the pic Live doesn't look that bad

So a player hitting a guy in the chest with his foot while both are playing the ball = red

A player punching someone in the face = could be a red

Do you start seeing the hypocrisy yet?

 

[hopstupid]

So a player hitting a guy in the chest with his foot while both are playing the ball = red

A player punching someone in the face = could be a red

Do you start seeing the hypocrisy yet?

Naw it didn't look like a red on the video. On the pic it did but that's just my opinion.

 

[hoppyhoppyhippo]

In the video you can clearly see the ball coming off Vidic's head then him getting punched in the face. Again if context doesn't matter, it should have been a straight red. Certainly was more dangerous than Nani's foul. Gimme running into someone's foot over getting punched in the head any day of the week.

 

[hopstupid]

lot of people said this should of been a red card



hand ball stopping a goal

 

[hoppyhoppyhippo]

I think you have a case for that. That's certainly more deserving than Nani's penalty. The key word when it comes to the FIFA wording with handball reds is "deliberate". There were a good number of handballs not called that game, I also saw one on Higuin where he used his (IIRC) left arm to deaden a ball in the penalty area, should have been a yellow. Certainly that was a more legit shout than Nani's red. Nani committed a foul, but a reckless tackle is a yellow. I don't think he used excessive force, one could argue that Arbeloa used more force than Nani (see how far back Nani's leg went)

Again Nani should have been shown a card for reckless play, as a yellow, because that's the card for reckless play.

 

[lgilmore]

Check law 12 for serious foul play.

The laws of the game allow for a ref to have some room in their decision making on the field. Law 18 is hopefully applied. When I mentored young refs (maybe some you guys screamed at in your kids games) I would ask the question "what did you see?" Then I'd shut up an listen. If what they explained fell within the guidelines of the laws. I couldn't necessarily disagree. From where they were, they applied the laws of the game and made a decision appropriate to the laws. Doesn't matter what angle I saw it from, what did they see?

This extends to the big boys too. What did the CR or linesman see? Is the call or non call appropriate and within the laws of the game? Within the framework of the game are the calls consistent? Is a foul in the 10th minute a foul in the 85th minute?

I also have to question here if many of you have ever read the laws of the game or know that every year points of emphasis are released to be applied to matches? The laws evolve over time. What you may of played under, may not be applied the same way now.

 

[aygov]

 

[hopstupid]

who ever wins the the replay between Chelsea & Man U gets to play Man City in the fa cup. Can't wait

 

[nickybhoy]

Hail hail, the Celts are here! Come on you bhoys in green!

 

[hoppyhoppyhippo]

Check law 12 for serious foul play.

The laws of the game allow for a ref to have some room in their decision making on the field. Law 18 is hopefully applied. When I mentored young refs (maybe some you guys screamed at in your kids games) I would ask the question "what did you see?" Then I'd shut up an listen. If what they explained fell within the guidelines of the laws. I couldn't necessarily disagree. From where they were, they applied the laws of the game and made a decision appropriate to the laws. Doesn't matter what angle I saw it from, what did they see?

This extends to the big boys too. What did the CR or linesman see? Is the call or non call appropriate and within the laws of the game? Within the framework of the game are the calls consistent? Is a foul in the 10th minute a foul in the 85th minute?

I also have to question here if many of you have ever read the laws of the game or know that every year points of emphasis are released to be applied to matches? The laws evolve over time. What you may of played under, may not be applied the same way now.

I keep up on the laws as much as possible. Bad calls are bad calls, I know that refs miss calls, but to me there was no excuse to give Nani a red, either he should have consulted the side judge who probably had a better view or erred to the side of caution.

Anyway since we haven't had a new point in a long time, I'll end my post on this point. Twitter reactions to the Nani red from a variety of famous folk

LINK

Not all are about the call, but some are amusing. I love the Michael Jackson one.

 

[hopstupid]

This was pretty incredible

Rio Ferdinand tackles Fernando Torres



I want to hear what fergie thinks of this

 

[hoppyhoppyhippo]

I don't know if he did that on purpose, but he's lucky he didn't get a red. It wasn't a smart play.

 

[lgilmore]

The thing is the call on nani was well within the scope of the law to be considered serious foul play. Usually you'll draw an automatic red card for studs to a thigh. A couple feet higher can easily be considered a red, plus he was late and actually never touched the ball.

As I said earlier on in this post, I didn't watch the game or care that much. I cheer for my local side in Seattle, have a history back into their first go round in NASL.

The laws of the game are basically parameters that allow a ref to use their judgement about what they see and how they call it something or let it go. Sometimes it's hard for Americans to understand that the laws of the game were never meant to be percise. The law book isn't thick and was never meant to be.

That is where law 18 comes in. If anybody's bothered to look there are only 17 laws of the game. Law 18 is the most important law to be used in every match. What actually is Law 18? Apply common sense. That is why it is the most important.
cheers.

 

[hoppyhoppyhippo]

If Nani had made contact with the ball, there should have been no foul. As far as your comparison of studs at the thigh, usually that's called because it's an intentional tackle. Putting your leg up to trap a ball is different. You have to recognize context, that's part of rule 18 as you've been harping on it.

Since you didn't answer, do you think Diego Lopez should have been sent off for punching Vidic in the face?

 

[lgilmore]

if nani was first to the ball his studs would have been infront of the other player. He was late that's why he tagged the guy and that's why the CR red carded him, late, sloppy, not to the skill level on he field. Yes, refs do punish play they consider below the standard on the field. It keeps the games from degrading into a foul fest. The biggest reason nani sat is because he was late so what became an attempted trap became in an instant, a poor challenge. Thats how it happens

Intent only applies to hand ball decisions any more. Studs up, you are 95% sure to sit.

I'll try and look at the other one you mention. haven't yet.

 

[lgilmore]

Ok watched the playback of the other situation. Here's my take, I don't think he saw it. The CR is going to be on the left side of the pitch outside the PA. He's tracking the ball into the crowd, the ball is played towards goal, the CR is going to be watching where the ball goes because it is so close to goal. The contact happened for sure and could easily be cardable, but it basically comes a split second after the ball is headed towards goal. It got missed because of the ball's proximitty to goal.

Lots goes on in the goal mouth, used to pop forwards in the head with one hand while parrying the ball away with the other, my timing was much better than that gk. The cr's eyes naturally track with the ball, especially in the PA. Never once got called for it. One of the hardest things to learn as a CR is to stay with the players after the ball is played.

So you're right about the keeper, he just didn't get caught.




Kinda looking back at your comments about nani being a yellow vs. a red, reckless play vs. serious foul play. The thing is with that situation, a yellow or red could easily have been given.

 

[hoppyhoppyhippo]

Or there's a double standard with goalies. I know that largely because I used to get away with it. I used to get away with elbowing people coming down with the ball. Clearing people out with my body, etc.

As far as missing the call, it's not really excusable. Tracking the ball and in your trail vision shows the goalie punch not hitting the ball but someone else. It's poor reffing.

 

[lgilmore]

Didn't say it was good reffing, just figuring why there was no call.

Listening to Bien sport talking about the nani call tonight. Said he called it to the letter of the law, would have accepted a yellow, but all see where and why he chose a red. A english talking head put it as UEFA had taken away law 18 for this CR as they want the game called to the letter of the law. If the guy wants to ref more of these matches, he's kinda cornered into strict laws of the game. In fact, nobody questioned his call as against the laws of the game, they just wish he hadn't called it so tight.

 

[hoppyhoppyhippo]

Has there ever been a team as good as Barcelona the last 3 or 4 years?

 

[Grannyknot]

That goal was fantastic.
They are coming close to a decade of dominance since that 05-06 team that won everything.
Closest I can think of is late 90s United, or (showing a little age) late 70s Forest.
But no, nothing actually comes close to this.

 

[BrewKnurd]

Barcelona is a love/hate thing for me. I get tired of any team being as dominant as they have been for long stretches. On the other hand, they are just such a joy to watch.

 

[russrob81]

I think if they could they would go far in the World Cup finals. Half the Spanish team is from them plus other top notch internationals

 

[aygov]

I agree with the love/hate thing which is why I was sort of rooting for Milan to knock them out, but my lord do they play some beautiful football. Deft little passes and flicks that don't look hard but undo the entire opposing team's defense.

On an unrelated note I was at the JW Marriot in downtown Chicago this morning for a Verizon Blackberry forum and the next meeting room over was occupied by the CONCACAF Gold Cup meeting. Perhaps they were talking about the final being in Chicago this year? Who knows, but I did see Jim Brown who used to be FIFA's Executive Director of Competitions. No, I didn't recognize him. He was holding a folder with his name on it and I Googled it.

 

[BrewKnurd]

I agree with the love/hate thing which is why I was sort of rooting for Milan to knock them out, but my lord do they play some beautiful football. Deft little passes and flicks that don't look hard but undo the entire opposing team's defense.

I was rooting for Milan as well, and I think Milan could have pulled it off if not for hitting the post in the last few minutes of the first half.....

All that said, Milan was so obviously and thoroughly outplayed that it would have been hard to argue they deserved to win the tie if they had managed to pull it off.

 

[mrgstiffler]

How about that DC United save???

 

[Punity]

I've been gone to long from this thread Go Sounders Fu Portscum.