Sparkling Water Setup

[SodaStreamStrangler]

Hello Hope everyone out there is doing well!
I used to pay for soda stream but got tired of being ripped off so I bought a five gallon co2 tank and a soda stream hookup. Now I love it so much that I drink a lot more sparkling water and am tired of doing the whole process (chilling the water,filling up to the line, turning the tank open, pushing hard down several times then reaching down and closing the tank. I simply can’t be bothered to do that.
I know that my logic tells me I ought to be happy with what I got. It’s the most economical. But I want sparkling water out a tap...
I would like to ideally only have to fill the water and pressurize it once a month. For this I’m thinking I need
three 5 gallon kegs $55x3
Regulator $45
Split for regulators and tubing so I can $25 pressurize more than one at a time (what is this called)
metal ball connectors $11x3
Some kind of tapping system $40
A fridge $160

1. So I estimate this at around $500 is this doable?
2. Is there a cheaper way to do this?
3. Will this be more work than my current system? I can currently just pressurize enough water for the day (2L) in one go it takes around 10 minutes per day to wait to fill up the water from the filter etc and push and push the button.
4. What will be the process to refill the kegs at the end of the month? As each keg Empties how easy is it to switch the tap to the next keg?
Thank you!
Ryan

 

[twd000]

You could just get a single keg with this lid can connect it to your house water supply

https://www.williamsbrewing.com/Hom...r-Parts/Copy-of-Bevelled-Plastic-Gas-Dip-Tube

 

[Spundit]

1. $500 is doable for a simple setup. The biggest expense is a fridge (or freezer) that can hold your 3 kegs. Below would be my preferred cheap option that is under $400

Co2 tank- already own
Regulator- $45
1 roll Eva barrier tubing -$20
Duotight fittings (T's, etc.) - $18
AIH loose handle ball lock kegs -$30(×3)
Ball lock liquid disconnect- $6
Duotight picnic tap - $6
Ball lock air disconnects- $6 (x3)
Fridge $160 (per OP previous post)

2. Not that I know of.

3. Each month you will need to fill the 3 kegs with water. I can't imagine that taking more than 30min. Probably will want to clean the kegs and tap system every few months.

4. Switching between kegs is simple and will take less than 1 minute. Making carbonated water is also simple. Simplest method is to just fill the kegs and set the regulator to 30 psi and wait 1 week. To do it quicker look up burst carbonation or fast forced carbonation.

One concern is how long will your 5lb co2 tank last with this setup? Honestly I am not sure but I wouldn't be suprised if you had to get it filled every 3 months (maybe more).

Good luck. Have fun with it

 

[T Murph]

I recommend purchasing new kegs. In fact you should look at the new Torpedo Kegs as they offer multiple sizes.

Why new? 1- no worry about leaks or having to replace all the O rings and poppers before use, 2- they will last a life time 3- no rubber bottoms or top handles to come off (albeit rare, it happens) or leave black marks on floors counter tops etc. 4- they simply look better and they are stackable. 5- quick connects are interchangeable with other serving vessels. The Torpedo Kegs cost a few dollars more but in the long run you'll be better off with them.

I would also suggest purchasing good quality taps and regulators, Perlick for example, as they too will out perform and out last the cheaper models. You are talking about sparkling water here. Keep in mind any level of off flavors or sanitation issues will be noticable in your finished product. The use of good quality hardware will benefit you as they are easy to disassemble for cleaning and sanitizing.

 

[SodaStreamStrangler]

You could just get a single keg with this lid can connect it to your house water supply

https://www.williamsbrewing.com/Hom...r-Parts/Copy-of-Bevelled-Plastic-Gas-Dip-Tube

This seems like an AWESOME idea! Potentially wipes out one of the biggest costs... 2 extra kegs. My only issue with it is how I would get filtered water in there because my tap water tastes horrible. Do you have any ideas?

 

[SodaStreamStrangler]

1. $500 is doable for a simple setup. The biggest expense is a fridge (or freezer) that can hold your 3 kegs. Below would be my preferred cheap option that is under $400

Co2 tank- already own
Regulator- $45
1 roll Eva barrier tubing -$20
Duotight fittings (T's, etc.) - $18
AIH loose handle ball lock kegs -$30(×3)
Ball lock liquid disconnect- $6
Duotight picnic tap - $6
Ball lock air disconnects- $6 (x3)
Fridge $160 (per OP previous post)

2. Not that I know of.

3. Each month you will need to fill the 3 kegs with water. I can't imagine that taking more than 30min. Probably will want to clean the kegs and tap system every few months.

4. Switching between kegs is simple and will take less than 1 minute. Making carbonated water is also simple. Simplest method is to just fill the kegs and set the regulator to 30 psi and wait 1 week. To do it quicker look up burst carbonation or fast forced carbonation.

One concern is how long will your 5lb co2 tank last with this setup? Honestly I am not sure but I wouldn't be suprised if you had to get it filled every 3 months (maybe more).

Good luck. Have fun with it

Thanks! Great response, learned a lot. Much appreciated.

 

[Dr_Jeff]

This seems like an AWESOME idea! Potentially wipes out one of the biggest costs... 2 extra kegs. My only issue with it is how I would get filtered water in there because my tap water tastes horrible. Do you have any ideas?

A RO filter between the water source and the keg.

 

[SodaStreamStrangler]

Thank you . Do you have any clue how much pressure these lids can take? I have heard that the kegs themselves can withstand up to 110 but that the lids can only safely be used at 30? Is this true? When I google it I can’t seem to find much

 

[Dr_Jeff]

The keg and lid are rated to 130psi.

There are replacement PRVs that handle less.

 

[Dr_Jeff]

If I remember correctly, soda was served at ~60psi.

I have found some of my beer that was severely over carbonated at ~90psi

 

[peterpants]

Day 1 of when I originally got a kegerator, I carbonated a keg of water to have sparkling water on tap. Every week or two, we'd drink all the water, and have to pull out the water keg, refill, put it back in the kegerator, and wait 3 days until it carbed back up again. In the past week, I've finally finished making the remainder of the connections, and now I have the water keg plumbed into the house water main. I just wanted to share how I got it to work, since its something I've been envisioning for almost 2 years, and hopefully someone will find it helpful.

Parts:
- All the things you already have, if you have CO2/kegs/lines/taps/keezer-kegerator
- Ice maker outlet box $25 (this connects your house water main to a clean box with a shut off valve in the wall behind the keezer, it has a 1/4" compression male fitting exposed. How you plumb the house water main into the box out of scope here, but I used PEX and sharkbite fittings).
- 10 foot ice maker supply line (1/4" compression female on both ends) $15
- 1/4" compression male to 1/4" flare female adapter $5 (from big box hardware store) (had to open a few baggies at the store to verify full connection between ice maker outlet box thru to ball lock quick disconnect 1/4 MFL)
- liquid ball-lock quick disconnect with 1/4 MFL (you should have a handful of these)
- MFL bulkhead with ball lock liquid post $22 (this exposes a ball lock post on the outside of the keezer that will pass water thru the wall of your keezer two-by wood, the inside of your keezer has 1/4 MFL, which is the universal connection for all things beer line).
- I use duotight fittings and 8mm evabarrier tubing everywhere. So you'll probably want a bunch of evabarrier tubing + ball lock quick disconnect + 1/4 FFL to duotight 8mm adapters. Easy to pick up in the form of beverage hose kit.
- KegLand Duotight inline regulator with integrated gauge 8mm $15
- KegLand Duotight 8mm check valve (2x 5 = $10) (you need a check valve on both gas in and liquid in, in case there is ever a pressure loss, such as you shut of the house water main to do some repair, that loss of pressure could allow co2 into your house water main's other lines, potentially carbonating your shower water... and also preventing the water from trying to go up your gas line, and into your beer kegs. I'm not really sure how this could happen, but best to prevent it. Jesus could turn water into wine, you'll just end up with a weak session ipa)
- KegLand Continuous Soda Carbonator Keg Lid ($70) (The star of the show, this has a float valve that fills up the keg with water to the brink. It also has a special spray hose end that perhaps mists the water into the CO2 headspace allowing the water to carbonate faster).

I guess thats at least $160 in extra parts...

Always having sparkling water on tap, priceless.

Plumbing Info:
- 1/4 MFL = 1/4" male flare - this is what is common on ball lock quick disconnects, as you connect to beer line flare or duotight adapters.
- 1/4 FFL = 1/4" female flare - connects your duotight/evabarrier or traditional beer lines onto fittings
- 1/4 Compression = Ice maker / refrigerator water supply line. You have a hose, you slide the hose thru a fitting, you insert a brass ferrule inside the hose, you butt-up the hose with insert against the piece your mating with, and you tighten the nut, and it compresses the hose to the insert and to the nut, and you magically have a leak free connection. I think push-fit / duotight is a masterpiece compared to this.


I added a refrigerator / ice-machine outlet box to the wall behind my keezer. Measure your spot, drill a hole in the drywall, saw it into a rectangle. Nail in the outlet box to the stud. Run a new pex cold water line to the outlet box, and connect with sharkbite.

I connect the outlet box with an ice maker supply hose, then an adapter to go from compression to flare, then to a ball lock disconnect, then to a liquid post connected to a new bulkhead in the keezer.

Inside the keezer, it connects from bulkhead, then a water pressure regulator to step down the main to about 50 psi. Afterwards its a check valve, then into the soda carbonator lid in a keg. Also note that the gas line has a check valve, and pressure there is set to 40 psi.

I have the water pressure set to 50 psi, and the CO2 set to 40 psi. It took about 20 minutes for the carbonator lid to do the initial fill. The water was slightly spicy right away, which is very surprising. When I fill from the sink it takes about 3 days until it gets a hint of spicy, and maybe a week until its painfully spicy. I'm not pre-chilling the water, but KegLand Kee says that pre-chilling water will make it carbonate faster. But alternatively you could daisy-chain water kegs to act as a larger buffer, in case you consumed so much sparkling water.

 

[twd000]

I got that same Continuous Carbonator lid for my seltzer keg, but I'm just running EVABarrier through the wall of the kegerator straight to the outlet box, without the bulkhead or icemaker adapters

 

[peterpants]

EVABarrier through the wall of the kegerator straight to the outlet box, without the bulkhead or icemaker adapters

Awesome, sounds vastly simpler. And with a smaller tubing, means a smaller penetration in the keezer, so potentially less heat loss in the keezer. I went with the ice-maker-supply-line, since its metal braided, I assumed that would be a bit more rugged for handling someone wheeling the kegerator a few feet until the hose yanks it. Also, I found a dearth of information how on how to connect from house water main to beer line. What fittings did you need to get from the outlet box to evabarrier? I believe the ice maker outlet boxes are all pretty universally 1/4" compression. I walked around the plumbing section of Lowes and Home Depot for an hour or more, looking at brass unions, couplers, John Guest, etc, until I finally found what I needed. I would assume that you found some type of adapter between 1/4 compression and 1/4 flare? Or just tightened the 1/4 flare fitting onto the 1/4 compression fitting, it sort of threads on, but the threads are an imperfect match.

Since I have plastic ball-lock quick disconnects sticking out the back of my keezer, the keezer now sticks away from the wall another 2 inches, and I don't want someone to push the keezer against the wall hard, cracking the plastic, so I probably need to additionally screw in a 2x4 barrier/bumper behind the keezer to protect the plastic...

 

[twd000]

hooked up my water supply and seltzer lid and ran into a problem. It's filling the keg (I can hear it slowly trickling in) but seems like the back-pressure is carbonating our house water supply!

I'm wondering if there is not enough water pressure from the house supply to overcome the 30psi seltzer carbonation pressure.

I ran about 10-12 feet of 4mmx8mm EvaBarrier line from the wall water source to the keg. If I have 60 psi from my well pump, how much pressure drop can I expect due to line resistance? All the line-balancing calculators require an input for "time to fill a pint" but I don't really care about speed. I just want to know how many PSI of pressure drop per foot I should expect.

And do I need to change out the the 4x8mm line for the larger 6x9.5mm line? And what pressure drop would the fatter line yield?

 

[cfrazier77]

hooked up my water supply and seltzer lid and ran into a problem. It's filling the keg (I can hear it slowly trickling in) but seems like the back-pressure is carbonating our house water supply!

I'm wondering if there is not enough water pressure from the house supply to overcome the 30psi seltzer carbonation pressure.

I ran about 10-12 feet of 4mmx8mm EvaBarrier line from the wall water source to the keg. If I have 60 psi from my well pump, how much pressure drop can I expect due to line resistance? All the line-balancing calculators require an input for "time to fill a pint" but I don't really care about speed. I just want to know how many PSI of pressure drop per foot I should expect.

And do I need to change out the the 4x8mm line for the larger 6x9.5mm line? And what pressure drop would the fatter line yield?

Do you have an inline check valve for your water in line?

 

[Tallgrass]

I use that KegLand lid and it's been trouble free. Our city water through standard under sink filter then a check valve to the lid. Water pressure is 50psi and the co2 is set to 30psi.

 

[twd000]

Do you have an inline check valve for your water in line?

I do not. Was considering getting one, but then I thought if the pressure on the keg side is higher than the water pressure, yes the check valve will prevent the CO2 bottle from carbonating the house water supply, but it will also prevent the keg from refilling.

I checked the gauge on my house water tank and it's set at ~40 psi. So the seltzer pressure must be lower than that at all times. Unless I crank up the well pump pressure.

For right now, I turned down the seltzer pressure to 20 psi and it's working fine without any problems on the supply side. Just a bit less carbonated seltzer.

 

[twd000]

also, someone was asking about the adapter fitting to go from the main supply to the EvaBarrier line:
https://www.freshwatersystems.com/p...ose-adapter-5-16-push-in-x-3-4-nh-flat-inside
This is what I used - it adapts the garden hose thread from my washing machine supply, to 6mm push-connect for the Evabarrier line. I ran this right through the kegerator wall then a single liquid ball lock to connect to the keg lid

 

[Bobby_M]

I do not. Was considering getting one, but then I thought if the pressure on the keg side is higher than the water pressure, yes the check valve will prevent the CO2 bottle from carbonating the house water supply, but it will also prevent the keg from refilling.

I checked the gauge on my house water tank and it's set at ~40 psi. So the seltzer pressure must be lower than that at all times. Unless I crank up the well pump pressure.

For right now, I turned down the seltzer pressure to 20 psi and it's working fine without any problems on the supply side. Just a bit less carbonated seltzer.

It doesn't work too well on well water systems. I especially have trouble because I'm feeding the system after an RO filter so that's dropping my pressure quite a bit. I can get away with 22psi of carbonation pressure. One PSI over that and my keg won't refill with water.

The plan is to put a diaphragm booster pump ahead of my RO system because that increases production speed, rejection ratio, and waste ratio and it will also allow me to run 35PSI on the seltzer tank.

 

[cfrazier77]

It doesn't work too well on well water systems. I especially have trouble because I'm feeding the system after an RO filter so that's dropping my pressure quite a bit. I can get away with 22psi of carbonation pressure. One PSI over that and my keg won't refill with water.

The plan is to put a diaphragm booster pump ahead of my RO system because that increases production speed, rejection ratio, and waste ratio and it will also allow me to run 35PSI on the seltzer tank.

Bobby, I believe you can also put a booster pump after the RO to raise pressures. I was looking at having to do this when I install one. We like our carbonated water at 35 psi. I am manually filling a keg now.

 

[peterpants]

I can get away with 22psi of carbonation pressure. One PSI over that and my keg won't refill with water.

Is this a situation where daisy chaining another water keg would be helpful? I wonder if you could step up the pressure if you have two water kegs, each with a kegland carbonation lid. I haven't tried this, so I have no idea if it would work.

Keg 1
=> well water + RO @ whatever psi into carbonation lid
=> gas in @ 22psi
<= Black liquid out post to keg2 carbonation lid

Keg 2
=> keg1 water into carbonation lid at 22psi
=> gas in @ 35psi (maybe, not sure if it would work, but hopefully higher than 22psi)
<= black liquid out to tap handle.

This might get you above tingly water, and closer to the spicy water zone.

hooked up my water supply and seltzer lid and ran into a problem. It's filling the keg (I can hear it slowly trickling in) but seems like the back-pressure is carbonating our house water supply!

100% you should have a check valve on your water in to the water keg, I'd also recommend having a check valve on the gas in as well. Back pressure doesn't work as a check valve, a regulator doesn't work as a check valve. You don't want CO2 getting into your shower (waste of gas), and you don't want water getting into your gas lines (though float valve should prevent that). Running out of CO2, or temporarily shutting off water pressure to the house could be a hiccup event where you don't want weird side effects. You can either add the check valve using beer-line equipment, or using house plumbing / sharkbite to your nearby water outlet.

 

[Bobby_M]

Bobby, I believe you can also put a booster pump after the RO to raise pressures. I was looking at having to do this when I install one. We like our carbonated water at 35 psi. I am manually filling a keg now.

It's better to put it before the RO unit because it's all upside. Better purity, less waste water, faster production. I actually installed it on the system last night and I can now run my seltzer keg at 35psi and it will still auto-fill from the RO output.

If anyone is curious, this is what I bought and it came with everything needed.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07KHV93S5/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o04_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

[elohwhydee]

Thanks peterpants for that parts list, that was super helpful!

For anyone else following along, this part wasn't right for me:

- 1/4" compression male to 1/4" flare female adapter $5 (from big box hardware store) (had to open a few baggies at the store to verify full connection between ice maker outlet box thru to ball lock quick disconnect 1/4 MFL)

Ended up using this:

https://www.amazon.com/LASCO-17-675...8E5CQM8/ref=pd_lpo_2?pd_rd_i=B008E5CQM8&psc=1