Smoking Grains & Jalapeños

[rodwha]

Planning on making a BBQ beer by smoking some grains on the 90% oak 10% mesquite I often use. This is what I’m planning so far given some pointers on another forum:

As I want the smoke flavor to be pronounced I’ll use 1/3 to 1/2 of my pale ale malt grains and attempt to keep the temp lower <150*, which is hard as my air damper is rusted open 1/2 way. I’ll also moisten the grains much like when conditioning them.

I don’t have any sort of screen that is small enough. Figuring I’ll use aluminum foil and stir the grains once or twice over an hour. After they’re done I’ll put them in a paper sack and let them rest at least a few days, maybe a week or a little more. Not sure when I’ll be able to schedule brew day.

The jalapeños I’ll smoke will be done longer and will be used in the boil at 10-15 mins. I figure this will also add to the smoky flavor (7 peppers).

Any pointers or insight?

 

[rodwha]

Figured I’ll just go with all of the pale ale malt (~2/3 of the grain bill) as I’m figuring it won’t be well smoked on foil. I won’t bother trying to stir it. Guessing I’ll go for about an hour if I can keep the temp <125* and 1/2 that if it’s much hotter.

Fingers crossed!

 

[sonic7173]

No advice but curious how this works out for you. Keep us posted

 

[BrewingAroundtheRrealm]

I've been wanting to brew a jalapeno beer for a while. This sounds interesting. I'm curious to see where this goes.

 

[rodwha]

I've been wanting to brew a jalapeno beer for a while. This sounds interesting. I'm curious to see where this goes.

I’ve been making a jalapeño blonde for several years now. It’s one of the favorites of us and those who come over, though at times, and for some, they’re too spicy for more than one. I use 12-14 jalapeños in 5.25 gals (1/2 roasted at 350* for 30 mins and used in the boil, and 1/2 in a 50/50 Everclear extract used at bottling instead of as a dry pepper now).

Here’s the jalapeños getting started. I’ll smoke them for 2 hrs when all I said and done:



Smoking a bit myself while I’m at it:

which game is better fallout 3 or fallout new vegas

 

[rodwha]

Without a screen I just lined trays with foil. Moistened the grains much like conditioning the malts as I was told it would absorb the smoke better. Initially the temp was about 175-200* and those grains sat for 30 mins. The temp dropped to about 150* and those stayed for 45 mins.

They’re sitting in a paper bag now and smell great!

 

[MaxStout]

@Schlenkerla might jump in here with some ideas. He's big into smoking grains.

But looks like you're getting a good batch put together. I'll be curious to see how the end product works out for you.

 

[Schlenkerla]

@Schlenkerla might jump in here with some ideas. He's big into smoking grains.

But looks like you're getting a good batch put together. I'll be curious to see how the end product works out for you.

Right up my alley...

I have a thread you should hop into since you're doing what I'm doing. It's got all the how to stuff with pictures.

I got all the details from The Schlenkerla in Bamberg.

Here's a few pointers.

I only use distilled water to wet the grain. Makes the smoke stick. You don't want them too wet. Distilled water is to keep from getting chloride formation on the grain (band aide aroma). The problem is chlorinated water.

I use aluminum screen to keep ash from floating on the grain. Important to keep ash out to prevent harsh smoke flavors getting deposited on the grain.

I use aluminum screen baskets to smoke and dry the grain. Smoke can permiate the grains through the mesh. I smoke the grain for two hours typically.

My grain smoker is Charbroil cabinet smoker. (Food Smoker is a Traeger). I have a separate one to keep meat fats from getting on my grain and negatively impacting head retention. Cleaning the racks and keeping the grease at bay is a good practice regardless.

I dry in my electric oven at 170F for roughly 2 days. I want to flash off the formation of acetic acid. It will sour your grain if not done. Lactobacillus exists in your grain, you might denature it by smoking it, but you want it dry so it doesn't stale or get mildew or mold.

Then open air ventilate to mellow the grain. Age it for a few weeks.

I like to use roasted grains of some sort to complement the smoke flavor that you get from rauchmalt.

This is what I drank yesterday. It's a brown hefeweizen that I smoked about a 1/3 of the grain (the barley) with spent pistachio shells. It's a very mellow smoked wheat.

I'll post my thread here shortly.

 

[Schlenkerla]

Here's my thread....

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/forum/index.php?threads/637254/

 

[Schlenkerla]

Here's my grain that I'm currently drying. It's acidulated malt that I made yesterday.

It shows the aluminum baskets. They're just folded and stapled. Very simple, very cheap.

After one smoke they're seasoned and smell good.

 

[BassBabiesBeer]

I plan on making a smoked IPA, but the first time I got to make it I was working at a brewery in Denver. My initial recipe used a majority smoked malts, a mixture of mesquite-, cherrywood-, peated, and... I forget the last one.

Granted, the extraction is kind of low using that sort of mix. I'm curious how this beer will turn out.

 

[rodwha]

Here's my grain that I'm currently drying. It's acidulated malt that I made yesterday.

It shows the aluminum baskets. They're just folded and stapled. Very simple, very cheap.

After one smoke they're seasoned and smell good.View attachment 634194

Thanks very much for all of that information!!!

Unfortunately I used tap water thinking it wasn’t a big deal. No chlorine but it does have chloramine I believe.

I’ll put the grains in the oven tomorrow. Does it really need to be dried for 48 hrs?

I have a feeling I’m going to love this and will just end up making some stainless screen trays for this. I like for things to be done right and efficiently.

2 hrs of smoking? I’m guessing this is cold smoking around 100*? How hot can you go for say an hour of smoking?

Would adding some sort of raised base keep the fats off? I don’t really want a new smoker just for this.

It’s been a long day and I didn’t quite get enough sleep last night so I’ll read your thread tomorrow.

Thanks again!

 

[Schlenkerla]

Thanks very much for all of that information!!!

Unfortunately I used tap water thinking it wasn’t a big deal. No chlorine but it does have chloramine I believe.

I’ll put the grains in the oven tomorrow. Does it really need to be dried for 48 hrs?

I have a feeling I’m going to love this and will just end up making some stainless screen trays for this. I like for things to be done right and efficiently.

2 hrs of smoking? I’m guessing this is cold smoking around 100*? How hot can you go for say an hour of smoking?

Would adding some sort of raised base keep the fats off? I don’t really want a new smoker just for this.

It’s been a long day and I didn’t quite get enough sleep last night so I’ll read your thread tomorrow.

Thanks again!

Just saw this, it's getting late. We'll chat more tomorrow.

 

[rodwha]

The grains have been placed in a dehydrator set at 160*, it’s highest point, and the remainder is in the oven set at 170*.

48 hrs seems more than what’s necessary to dry them. Why so long?

I was planning on brewing this on Tues, and still would like to. Is weeks of resting necessary?

With such a lengthy process I’m thinking next time I should increase the length of time to smoke and decrease the amount of grains. 6.5 lbs of barley seems a bit much.

My house is already smelling amazing though!

 

[Schlenkerla]

The grains have been placed in a dehydrator set at 160*, it’s highest point, and the remainder is in the oven set at 170*.

48 hrs seems more than what’s necessary to dry them. Why so long?

I was planning on brewing this on Tues, and still would like to. Is weeks of resting necessary?

With such a lengthy process I’m thinking next time I should increase the length of time to smoke and decrease the amount of grains. 6.5 lbs of barley seems a bit much.

My house is already smelling amazing though!

48 hours is a long time, but it's too be sure they dry. You could verify the dryness with weighing them to confirm the original weight. Which is typically 5% moisture. Weighing them is kind of a pain in the butt.

Resting for a week or more may not be necessary, but everyone of the books I read said to do it to mellow the volatiles that may flash off or evaporate. Even the Schlenkerla ages their grains for a few months. They also age the wood. In the book I read, "Smoke Brews" said they have lots of real estate tied up in grain and wood. The risk is the smoke flavor might be harsh. It depends on the amount how much you use in your grain bill as to what the impact might be.

I do recommend using less than 50% on your first beer to see how strong the smoke is on your process. You can make a small barley tea to test this. Remember the carbonation will amp the smoke more that it would flat and fermented.

I do 5-6lbs just so I don't have too much grain inventory. I like to have a few types aging. So right now I only have mesquite but I want to do alder and make a smoked brown malt with a blend smoke of maple, cherry and hickory. The brown malt is roasted smoked malt at 250-300F.

BTW - I never thought of SS screen. The aluminum gets tarnished after the first smoke. I like the idea, not sure if my Lowe's has SS mesh.

Have to run we'll talk more. Heading to the movies.

 

[Schlenkerla]

In my Roast'em thread I talk about caution in the amount to use in your first beer quite a bit. You might check it out.

 

[Schlenkerla]

As for the separated smokers. It's not necessary. I wanted pellet mainly for cooking. I got it as a gift so the wood chip cabinet was relegated to grain. Not necessary. I like Rauchbier so much that I wanted that be separated.

If you keep the smoker, baskets, and grates grease free you'll be ok.

 

[rodwha]

I only used 2/3 of the malts because I was using foil and figured it wouldn’t be nearly as good as using a screen. I didn’t bother trying to mess with the grains.

The smoke smell was nice in the bag. It’s not nearly as strong now that it’s been out.

Now that you’ve given me a lot of information I’ll certainly do things better next time and plan accordingly.

Hopefully nothing is too far off as I’ll have 5 gals of it!

 

[Schlenkerla]

Missed your water comment too. Both sources recommend distilled but say carbon filter is the minimum. I hope chloramine isn't as bad as chlorinated water. You can remove chloramine with Camden tablets. It's just easier to go buy distilled and be 100% certain of your water quality for smoking grains.

 

[Schlenkerla]

I only used 2/3 of the malts because I was using foil and figured it wouldn’t be nearly as good as using a screen. I didn’t bother trying to mess with the grains.

The smoke smell was nice in the bag. It’s not nearly as strong now that it’s been out.

Now that you’ve given me a lot of information I’ll certainly do things better next time and plan accordingly.

Hopefully nothing is too far off as I’ll have 5 gals of it!

If you like smoke beer you'll warm up to it...

Make sure you have that to drink as you're smoking meat.

If you're anything like me, you'll laugh at smoke burps. LoL

It's funny the first time you and your friends have it happen.

 

[rodwha]

I certainly hope the water doesn’t show itself to be an issue. I use distilled water to brew with and had enough here to have done so. Didn’t realize water used in this manner could be an issue. Hopefully it’s not one of those lessons!

I’ve not had a smoked beer other than maybe a scotch ale that was mildly peaty. But I love smoke so I’m sure I’ll be good with it.

Drinking this beer while BBQing was certainly something I had in mind!

I just might be quite like you from what I’ve read.

 

[BassBabiesBeer]

I certainly hope the water doesn’t show itself to be an issue. I use distilled water to brew with and had enough here to have done so. Didn’t realize water used in this manner could be an issue. Hopefully it’s not one of those lessons!

I’ve not had a smoked beer other than maybe a scotch ale that was mildly peaty. But I love smoke so I’m sure I’ll be good with it.

Drinking this beer while BBQing was certainly something I had in mind!

I just might be quite like you from what I’ve read.

Schlenkerla takes his user name from the (imo) best rauchbier brewery in Germany that exports to the states. Their marzen, ur-bock, and doppelbock are incredible smoked beers and their helles is basically the dictionary definition of the style in it's most perfect form.


Seriously looking forward to hearing about this. Smoked beers have always been a passion for me. I'd love to have the space to smoke my own grain one day - it would probably make the grain mash efficiency a bit higher. At least I'd hope.

 

[Schlenkerla]

Schlenkerla takes his user name from the (imo) best rauschbier brewery in Germany that exports to the states. Their marzen, ur-bock, and doppelbock are incredible smoked beers and their helles is basically the dictionary definition of the style in it's most perfect form.


Seriously looking forward to hearing about this. Smoked beers have always been a passion for me. I'd love to have the space to smoke my own grain one day - it would probably make the grain mash efficiency a bit higher. At least I'd hope.

Truth be told....

I'm not sure what you meant about grain mash efficiency. IMO - Extraction efficiency gets to water chemistry and hitting the ideal pH and how well you can lauter, (thinking minal dead spot loss).

As for space do you have a grill? If, so I have an idea for you.

https://www.schlenkerla.de/indexe.html#

https://www.schlenkerla.de/rauchbier/sorten/sortene.html

 

[BassBabiesBeer]

Truth be told....

I'm not sure what you meant about grain mash efficiency. IMO - Extraction efficiency gets to water chemistry and hitting the ideal pH and how well you can lauter, (thinking minal dead spot loss).

As for space do you have a grill? If, so I have an idea for you.

https://www.schlenkerla.de/indexe.html#

https://www.schlenkerla.de/rauchbier/sorten/sortene.htmlView attachment 634489View attachment 634490

Using HBS bought smoked grains usually yields lower fermentables from mashing, in my experience. Even with the amazing water in Denver it was a bit of an issue. Could be the mill as well but I can try it again when it comes around on my brewing schedule. Will definitely look at using distilled or RO water if it's that big an issue.

 

[Schlenkerla]

Using HBS bought smoked grains usually yields lower fermentables from mashing, in my experience. Even with the amazing water in Denver it was a bit of an issue. Could be the mill as well but I can try it again when it comes around on my brewing schedule. Will definitely look at using distilled or RO water if it's that big an issue.

If you know you have good water it's not so much of a big deal.

Checking your mash pH is important. Your grain bill can change your pH differently based on the pH of the grains. If my memory serves me right the darker grains tend to be more acidic, so if you are trending to lower SRM beer style it may not be in the correct pH range as you might think.

https://www.winning-homebrew.com/testing-your-beer.html

Mash temps are important based on what you're after. The grain can also change slightly from the same malt house batch to batch. Thus effecting how close you are to your target pH

http://counterbrew.blogspot.com/2016/10/a-beer-geek-guide-to-step-mashing-even.html?m=1

Also start doing an iodine test if you have not started doing it.

https://www.winning-homebrew.com/starch-conversion-test.html

There's lots to read about this.

 

[BassBabiesBeer]

If you know you have good water it's not so much of a big deal.

Checking your mash pH is important. Your grain bill can change your pH differently based on the pH of the grains. If my memory serves me right the darker grains tend to be more acidic, so if you are trending to lower SRM beer style it may not be in the correct pH range as you might think.

https://www.winning-homebrew.com/testing-your-beer.html

Mash temps are important based on what you're after. The grain can also change slightly from the same malt house batch to batch. Thus effecting how close you are to your target pH

http://counterbrew.blogspot.com/2016/10/a-beer-geek-guide-to-step-mashing-even.html?m=1

Also start doing an iodine test if you have not started doing it.

https://www.winning-homebrew.com/starch-conversion-test.html

There's lots to read about this.

Because I lack a lot of the lab space needed, I won't be doing pH or iodine tests until I have more space. I've been pretty fortunate to get some really clean tasting beers so far with just a 5.2 pH stabilizer for a few batches, then I switched to Acid malt for the rest. I will totally check out the step mashing for smoked beers though. Thanks for the links.

 

[rodwha]

One very important thing I hadn’t contemplated. Does having smoked the grains and then dried them at 160-170* for maybe 12 hrs change anything as far as figuring up my water tomorrow? I can see how it might well change the Lovibond a point or three. Anything else?

 

[Schlenkerla]

One very important thing I hadn’t contemplated. Does having smoked the grains and then dried them at 160-170* for maybe 12 hrs change anything as far as figuring up my water tomorrow? I can see how it might well change the Lovibond a point or three. Anything else?

If you dried them really really good you might need to top off the brew pot a little more, it's possible your mash volume might be a little thick.

How wet did you get the grains? Did you do a quick soak or spray the them.

It may be inconsequential for water usage.

Definitely you'll get a little SRM change not much a couple points. I typically run my fingers through the grain. I occasionally have a few really dark grains. To the point maybe 5-10% have had an obvious color change ranging from amber to brown to almost chocolate or even black.

If you find a few like that you can pull them out and cut them in half with a sharp knife on cutting board. When I make brown malt I want the inside to have turned from bleach white to darker antique white, changing to tan. In that instance I know I'm going to get a brown color. I get that strictly from smoking not the drying.

If you're not finding any discolored malt then I think you'll find very subtle color changes. You might have a nice biscuit taste with the malt.

Take a taste of about 4-5 grains and chew them up. It'll give you an idea of what it will taste like in the beer.

 

[rodwha]

I used my sprayer and got them almost as wet as when I condition my malts before milling them. They didn’t quite feel like leather yet.

For my purposes I’ll change them from 4 to 5 Lovibond.

 

[rodwha]

While I was conditioning the grains the smoky smell was rather noticeable. Now that’s it’s boiling not so much.

I didn’t bother trying a few grains to chew on as I had weighed out my grains the night before so the barley was all together.

So how is the impact different if one were to cold(er) smoke for a longer period vs hotter and shorter? Why would one chose one over the other?

An aside question:

Now I need some authentic smoky beer. I’m hoping either my grocery store B/W manager will (I know they can to a degree) order specific beer like this, or that a liquor store can. I’d prefer a smoke-forward beer and I’m thinking something along the lines of a Doppelbock on into something roasty. What might I want to inquire about? Seems I should have a smoky beer to sip on next time I brew a smoked beer...