Questions about partigyle

[b-boy]

I'm making a batch of Bourbon Barrel Imperial Stout in a few weeks. When I made the last batch I did 15 gallons using 4 coolers. We did a mash and a single MLT drain without any sparging. I was a little low on my numbers, but it turned out OK.

It seemed like I was leaving a lot of good sugar behind in the mash tuns. I've heard of people doing second runnings with barleywines and strong ales. Do people do second runnings beers using a Stout recipe? How did it turn out? Is it worth doing?

I'd hate to waste 100lbs of grain by leaving a second batch of OK beer behind.

 

[SnakeRidge]

I do this on my yearly RIS. Just dump in 3-4 gallons of 160* water and let it ride while the RIS boils. I get 4 gallons of about 1.030 pre boil for a small stout. You can add DME if you want or 'cap' the mash by adding a couple #'s of base malt when you add the water.

Edit to add: I didn't see you were using 100# of grain, mine is a 5gal batch with 20#, but the principle is the same

 

[Bill_in_VA]

Yep. I do this too. You get something like a dry/extra stout. You can cap with few ounce of dark malt or caramel malt if you wanna up the flavor or something. Like snake said when doing a partigyle it's always a good idea to keep some DME on hand.

 

[Krid]

Not sure what your setup looks like, but if you can mash enough grain to do a 15 gallon batch, you should be able to a hefty partigyle. There are charts available ( Like this one---> http://morebeer.com/brewingtechniques/library/backissues/issue2.2/moshertable.html ) that help you figure out what gravity you could expect from running out the mash in two batches.

So say you're figuring your 15 gallon batch would be 1060 all together, the first third would be 5 gallons at 1090 (definite RIS level gravity) and the other 2/3 would give you 10 gallons of a respectable 1045 porter or stout.

I love partigyle because it gives you another way to increase the variety of homebrew you have available.

 

[b-boy]

Nice. I will have to try this. I'm trying to bottle 15 gallons of RIS, which will be shared with 2 other people.

I'm mashing with 3-10 gallon coolers and 1 rectangular cooler. I'm targeting ~15 gallons at about 1.100 OG. My pre-boil should be about 1.090. Last time I did the RIS I got about 1.104 OG.

I have a 2-burner stand and 2 15-gallon pots. I have an extra 10-gallon pot and a fryer, so I'll be boiling on this on the side. I'm looking to make an extra 8 gallons or so.

I like the idea of adding some DME to change it up a little, using different hops in the boil, and maybe adding some adjuncts.

Anyone have good recipes or ideas?

 

[Hopper5000]

I have done a second beer off of an RIS before that essentially was a dry stout. It was pretty tasty and I added a bit of turbinado to get the gravity up a little more. I would for sure put more hot water through it as you will get good results IMHO.

 

[SnakeRidge]

I don't have any specific recipes since I usually just let it ride and deal with what I get (small brown stout). That's the fun of the partigyle for me. But this would be an excellent opportunity to do some experimenting. Peanut butter, chocolate, peppers etc. It's basically free wort so go crazy.

 

[b-boy]

Hmm...Pumpkin Stout.

I think we have a winner!

My friend has been wanting to do a pumpkin beer anyway, so I'll toss in some spices and some pumpkin along with dome DME and give it a shot. It won't cost me anything but a couple of cans of pumpkin.

 

[SnakeRidge]

The Great Pumpkin Charlie Brown Stout!

 

[GrogNerd]

you could steep your dark specialty grains separately from your mash, combine them for the boil, so then your second runnings could be whatever style & color you want

my last partigyle was the other way around; barleywine from the first runnings, second runnings were capped with roast barley for a dry stout

 

[b-boy]

Can BeerSmith handle doing a Partigyle?

 

[SnakeRidge]

Sort of... I'm still getting the hang of it myself and I've done a dozen or so. My numbers are kind of all over the place because I do it differently almost every time. Sometimes I want to get 4 gallons pre-boil of a really big beer and 8 gallons of smaller beer. Other times, like you, I want a big batch of big beer, and don't want to waste the sugars locked up in the grains so I just do the 'dump in some hot water and get what I get method.' I've figured out how to use Beersmith as a guide, but you just have to flexible with what you get. You can always mix the two gyles in ratios to get what you want also.

Check out this link:

http://morebeer.com/brewingtechniques/library/backissues/issue2.2/mosher.html

 

[b-boy]

That's funny. When I clicked on your link it took me to the same page I was just looking at. Great minds think alike!

I will use BeerSmith to build a beer using the same ingredients as my RIS, but adjust the amount (keeping the ratios the
same) to get to a target pre-boil gravity that should be reachable using the second runnings. Then I can add hops, adjuncts, etc as if I built the beer from scratch. This should give me close bitterness numbers and ABV numbers.

I think my approach will be to dump about 2.0-2.5 gallons into each mash tun, stir and drain. I'll pool that into one pot, take a reading and, depending on the reading, add some DME or not. My boil time will also be determined by the reading I get as well.

Now I just need to figure out my gravity based on my second runnings. Maybe add 2 gallons of extra water to the recipe in BeerSmith and look a the difference in expected gravity? Can I use that somehow?

I'm just throwing stuff at the walls for now. I'll try to figure this all out.

 

[catdaddy66]

I'm making a batch of Bourbon Barrel Imperial Stout in a few weeks. When I made the last batch I did 15 gallons using 4 coolers. We did a mash and a single MLT drain without any sparging. I was a little low on my numbers, but it turned out OK.



It seemed like I was leaving a lot of good sugar behind in the mash tuns. I've heard of people doing second runnings with barleywines and strong ales. Do people do second runnings beers using a Stout recipe? How did it turn out? Is it worth doing?



I'd hate to waste 100lbs of grain by leaving a second batch of OK beer behind.

I'm getting ready to do a double (partigyle) batch from a recipe for Kate the Great RIS. I want to make a big then a small stout and hop each differently.

I am not sure my mash tun can handle 23#'s of grain as it's only 10 gallons. Can I split the mixed grain equally between two MLT's? Would the wort from each combine to give me my proper OG? I would think so, but have never tried this ambitious of a brew day before.


Sent from my iPhone using Home Brew

 

[b-boy]

I'm getting ready to do a double (partigyle) batch from a recipe for Kate the Great RIS. I want to make a big then a small stout and hop each differently.

I am not sure my mash tun can handle 23#'s of grain as it's only 10 gallons. Can I split the mixed grain equally between two MLT's? Would the wort from each combine to give me my proper OG? I would think so, but have never tried this ambitious of a brew day before.


Sent from my iPhone using Home Brew

Trust me. It will be a long day. God help you if you get a stuck sparge like we did.

A 10 gallon mash tun won't handle that much grain. You'll be over by a few gallons. Splitting it is your only option. I came out a little low on my OG, but not by much. Overall I'm happy with the results.

I used BeerSmith. I used 4 10+-gallon mash tuns. I broke my recipe down into 4 4-gallon batches, which just barely fit into a 10-gallon cooler (In fact, I probably should reduce it to a 3.75 gallon recipe). I also scaled the recipe for 8 gallons, which I use to figure out my hop additions for the boil.

I do each 4-gallon recipe as a single recipe - weigh and grind the grain seperately and mash seperately. I combine all my wort into 2 15-gallon pots. These 2 pots are treated as seperate 8-gallon recipes for hop additions, etc...

When the boil finishes I cool and fill as many carboys as I can with the results.

Last time we did this, it was a real chore. Adding the Parti-gyle might push it over the edge, but I really hate the idea of throwing out 'future beer'. We'll see in a few weeks.

 

[uncleleon]

From what I understand partigyle would mean blending the runnings to get different strength beers (table, export, etc...) Everyone is just referring to second runnings.

For quick figuring, 10lbs grain leaves me with 4 degrees brix second runnings. Hope this helps!

 

[GrogNerd]

I've used Kai's Batch Sparge and Party Gyle simulator for my partigyles. it's an invaluable resource (and if you ever want to try decoction mashing, his wiki is a must-read)

another great resource is Randy Mosher's Parti-Gyle Brewing

 

[b-boy]

Thanks GrogNerd.

 

[uncleleon]

Latest issue of zymurgy had a big write up on it this month!!!

 

[SnakeRidge]

I've used Kai's Batch Sparge and Party Gyle simulator for my partigyles. it's an invaluable resource (and if you ever want to try decoction mashing, his wiki is a must-read)

I second both of these resources. Really, Kai's whole wiki is great. He used to post a good bit on here as Breukaiser or something

 

[b-boy]

Thanks for the resources. I'm still planning it. Won't be brewing till the 22nd. I'm working on building another 70qt mash tun from an old cooler I had in my garage. That will allow me to do close to 20 gallons of RIS. Once I get my capacity down I'll work on the Partigyle. My brew partners are interested in the pumpkin ale. They want to get serious and actually roast up the pumpkin.