NEW EZboil unit with automated step mashing and boiling

[TexasWine]

Another question for y'all. The manual for the 310 says...

"When temperature rise to the bAST, the output will automatically reduce to a lower level to prevent a messy boiling over."

Does anyone know what % output this "lower level" is, and how is it determined? I have some of my own ideas, but didn't know if someone here had already unearthed the answer.

I'm really wanting to know what % output I would have going into the boil if I don't make any adjustments on the controller.

 

[Wagon_6]

After the acceleration phase ends, it will automatically revert to the rotary knob percentage power setting (P). So if you set it to 50%, the acceleration phase takes precedent until the temperature set point is reached and then drops to 50% power.

 

[TexasWine]

After the acceleration phase ends, it will automatically revert to the rotary knob percentage power setting (P). So if you set it to 50%, the acceleration phase takes precedent until the temperature set point is reached and then drops to 50% power.

Excellent! Just what I wanted to know!

 

[BeardedBrews]

After the acceleration phase ends, it will automatically revert to the rotary knob percentage power setting (P). So if you set it to 50%, the acceleration phase takes precedent until the temperature set point is reached and then drops to 50% power.

This is the same behavior on my 120 unit. The display will show the rotary knob value, but the element will fire at "bout%" (menu defined) until the boil set temperature.

The 310D has the same functionality in the mash side through the "mout%" in the menu. If you were worried about overheating the enzymes around the element when you make a step you could lock it down to 30 or 40%.

 

[Smellyglove]

So it sounds like the DSPR120 and 310 are definitely deferent in regards to tSP. An excerpt from the 120 manual is below. The initial setting for tSP is 151 degrees Fahrenheit.

"When timer function is enabled, the timer counting will be started by timer start temperature, tSP. When temperature reaches timer start temperature, the timerstarts to count."

So if I'm thinking about tSP with the 310 correctly, if a positive tSP is utilized it must be combined with a negative oScr. Otherwise the temperature may never overshoot and the timer will never start.

Which brings up another question. For anyone with a HERMs, have you used any of these settings to prevent the timer from starting before the grain bed temp has reached the set point? I'd rather not overshoot my desired rest temp, but oScr seems like the best option to artificially induce a delay. I wished there was a setting that allowed the timer to be started on a timed delay after reaching the set point.

This sounds correct, although I've never tried. The way I do it is that I just add 6 minutes to my mash times entered into the program. 6 minutes is because the herms reaches the SV 6 minutes faster than the SV in the mash tun itself. These numbers vary a bit with grist size (I do only no-sparge, so grist sizes affects the total volume in the MT which needs to be heated, instead of a set water/liquid ratio), but 6 minutes is pretty much "default" in my setup. But I do change the RTD calibration for different grist-sizes. With a good crush it varies between 0 offset to 0.4 degrees C offset, depending on grist-size (these are the extremes, from 0 to 0.4, meaning an OG of 1.115 to 1.048)


I use oScr negative value (which is an arbitrary number) to get it to overshoot about 2C in the HERMS. The overshoot lasts for maybe 45 seconds or so. I can't compare any differnces in attenuation due to prematurely denatured enzymes to my previous PID since I programmed that too to overshoot a little bit during ramps.

 

[Smellyglove]

I'm interested (and hopeful) to hear the results when you get your unit in for testing. In general I'm thrilled with the 120's performance, but having a menu defined temperature as the start condition for the mash timer is clunky. The delta to setpoint approach is much more logical in my opinion and would be a great firmware addition to the original units

One other thing I've been curious about for those using step mashing, do you rely entirely on the re-circulation to move the grain bed temperature, or do you also give a quick stir at some point during the ramp? If just recirculating it seems like 10-20 minutes of the step could be consumed simply waiting for the temperature to equalize.

I already addressed this in my post above. But if it takes 15 minutes to equalize, then you could add 15 minutes to the mash programme. But. 15 minutes is a lot. I guess this is where programming meets experience and combines into "know your equipment and end results" If it uses 15 minutes to go from 63 to 64C, then you wouldn't want to add 15 minutes extra mash-time. You're stepping, you want to know the summed effect of the stepping, instead of thinking that it must be held at xx temperature for xx amount of time. When stepping with a recirculated system it's not like you're adding boiled water which would heat the mash instantly to SV.

For instance, if you say 20 minutes protein rest is good at a given temperature. You have to take into account that your heating it, and you'd maybe want to just keep it there for 10 minutes, since the other ten minutes are "close enough" in temp-range when stepping.

 

[Smellyglove]

So it sounds like the DSPR120 and 310 are definitely deferent in regards to tSP. An excerpt from the 120 manual is below. The initial setting for tSP is 151 degrees Fahrenheit.

"When timer function is enabled, the timer counting will be started by timer start temperature, tSP. When temperature reaches timer start temperature, the timerstarts to count."

So if I'm thinking about tSP with the 310 correctly, if a positive tSP is utilized it must be combined with a negative oScr. Otherwise the temperature may never overshoot and the timer will never start.

Which brings up another question. For anyone with a HERMs, have you used any of these settings to prevent the timer from starting before the grain bed temp has reached the set point? I'd rather not overshoot my desired rest temp, but oScr seems like the best option to artificially induce a delay. I wished there was a setting that allowed the timer to be started on a timed delay after reaching the set point.

I just did a test with some simple temps on my strike water for tomorrow. I actually have to set a negative TSP value, a positive value makes the timer start prematurely.

 

[TexasWine]

I just did a test with some simple temps on my strike water for tomorrow. I actually have to set a negative TSP value, a positive value makes the timer start prematurely.

Oh yes, you're right. By default it is set to +1, which makes the timer start early, so that makes sense.

I just installed mine today, replacing the 120. Tightened up a few loose-ish connections in my box, put it all back together, and took it for a test drive with a little water in mash mode.

I think I'm gonna like this little thing! Simple, intuitive, just like the 120, but with more features. Getting through the program menu is a breeze.

The next thing I'm contemplating is building out a larger box to house my current hardware plus a second SSR so I can run both elements off the 310 instead of just one (120v, two elements). But that'll be further down the road.

 

[Smellyglove]

Kind of weird though. -1 relative to set point seems intuitive, instead of the opposite. But as long as you know how it works it's all good.

I've now set mine to +1, just to delay the timer start a little bit. The oScr function does not always boost the temperature with the same amount, so if you do one test and it works, don't rely 100% it will at the next step, but most often it will.

 

[gerard weyns]

I'm looking to use a 310 to control my 3 vessel eHERMS. Will I be able to use one 310 and switch between elements in my HLT and boil kettle, or do I need separate pids for each element?

 

[doug293cz]

You can use one controller and switch between elements, but you also have to switch temp probes at the same time (this requires a 3PDT switch which Auber offers.) If you switch the elements and forget to switch the probes (or vice versa) you will get some interesting, but not desirable, results. This is a very easy operator error to make, which can be avoided by using a separate controller for each element.

Brew on

 

[BeardedBrews]

It would be interesting to draw up an ice cube relay diagram that simultaneously switches the temp probe and triggers the contactors for the elements.

 

[aeviaanah]

It would be interesting to draw up an ice cube relay diagram that simultaneously switches the temp probe and triggers the contactors for the elements.

I've done it, the problem I had was poor resistance on the RTD side tho, It worked fine at first. The contacts on the relays I bought require a larger load to "self clean" the contacts. After 2-3 brews, the accuracy of the RTDs started to be influenced. The electromagnetic field from the relays may have messed up the resistance too, not sure. I'm thinking of trying reed relays?

The Auber switch referenced above works great.

 

[Smellyglove]

I'm looking to use a 310 to control my 3 vessel eHERMS. Will I be able to use one 310 and switch between elements in my HLT and boil kettle, or do I need separate pids for each element?

I use RTDs with QC's. There's an RTD installed in each of the vessels, I just move the cable between them depending on where in the process I am, reading temps on the same PID-unit.

 

[jc587491]

Hey guys, I just wanted to ask a quick question about this PID. I'm building an Ebiab system and it looks like this is an awesome PID but I was wondering if I could program the timer to delay heating. So for example heat strike temp. in 4 hours from now, ECT.
I'm new to using pids and controllers and couldn't find an answer.
Thank you!

 

[BeardedBrews]

Hey guys, I just wanted to ask a quick question about this PID. I'm building an Ebiab system and it looks like this is an awesome PID but I was wondering if I could program the timer to delay heating. So for example heat strike temp. in 4 hours from now, ECT.
I'm new to using pids and controllers and couldn't find an answer.
Thank you!

For sure on the step mash capable units.

You could set the first mash step at 40f or something below ambient, and the time for that step as 4 hours. The next step in could be your strike temperature (162 or whatever) and then set the timer to hold. It will stay at that temp as long as you want, until you click to start it on the next step (mash at 155 for 60 min or whatever).

Keep in mind, energizing a DIY 5500w heater using a DIY controller while you are asleep and far away is certainly one potential way to burn your house down. Proceed with abundant caution.

A safer solution is to go turn it on in your jammies first thing, then go make a pot of coffee and eat breakfast while you wait.

 

[jc587491]

For sure on the step mash capable units.

You could set the first mash step at 40f or something below ambient, and the time for that step as 4 hours. The next step in could be your strike temperature (162 or whatever) and then set the timer to hold. It will stay at that temp as long as you want, until you click to start it on the next step (mash at 155 for 60 min or whatever).

Keep in mind, energizing a DIY 5500w heater using a DIY controller while you are asleep and far away is certainly one potential way to burn your house down. Proceed with abundant caution.

A safer solution is to go turn it on in your jammies first thing, then go make a pot of coffee and eat breakfast while you wait.

Thank you. I appreciate your help. I will keep safety in mind, I was not intending on running when asleep or away from home. More of a "if I get stuck doing a chore or something for longer than expected, my strike water will be ready" type of thing.

Thanks again!

 

[Smellyglove]

You can also do a "smart home wifi-outlet" and have your entire brewery controlled by this, and set the PID to start up doing it's job when it gets power. I have one of those "smart home" things which is controlling a contactor. When I turn on the smart plug it sends power to the contactor which in turn passes main power to the brewery. So it's basically a remote on/off switch for the brewerry, without the main power passing through that unit. I use it so I can start heating up the brewery from my phone while eating breakfast or still lying in bed on lazy days.

 

[jc587491]

You can also do a "smart home wifi-outlet" and have your entire brewery controlled by this, and set the PID to start up doing it's job when it gets power. I have one of those "smart home" things which is controlling a contactor. When I turn on the smart plug it sends power to the contactor which in turn passes main power to the brewery. So it's basically a remote on/off switch for the brewerry, without the main power passing through that unit. I use it so I can start heating up the brewery from my phone while eating breakfast or still lying in bed on lazy days.

That would be awesome and I love the idea. However, unfortunately, I'm one of the millions of Americans that don't have access to the internet at my home. I use a wireless 4g mifi as my home internet and it sucks. It never stays connected and throttles after 20gb/mo. I'm right on a main road and Comcast want $23,000 from me to run lines to my house. I've been fighting this battle for 6 years now. Sigh....

 

[Smellyglove]

That would be awesome and I love the idea. However, unfortunately, I'm one of the millions of Americans that don't have access to the internet at my home. I use a wireless 4g mifi as my home internet and it sucks. It never stays connected and throttles after 20gb/mo. I'm right on a main road and Comcast want $23,000 from me to run lines to my house. I've been fighting this battle for 6 years now. Sigh....

This can be run on wifi, so If you have a home network you can trigger it.

In Norway, access to Internet is almost treated as access to pure water. And no throttling. it's by law. Europe welcomes you

 

[rafoster1987]

Are you still using this setup? I’m looking to make the move to ebiab and think your controller would work well for me. Do you have a parts list for the controller? Where did you source the parts?

 

[Soulshine2]

Here are a couple pics of my controller; inside are 2 40W SSRs driving twin 1500W elements. SSRs are cooled by the custom heatsink, the three toggle switches control each element and an outlet for my wort pump. This setup requires plugging the two power cables into receptacles on separate circuits to avoid tripping the breaker. Heats up plenty fast for my taste, and isn't limited to 20A circuits. If I get bored with the 1500W elements I can one day upgrade them to 2000W without changing anything else.

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I noticed your Aurelios Pizza glass. I grew up in Joliet,IL .There was an Aurelios (owned by the Cemeno family)on Jefferson Street in Marycrest shopping center.

 

[Jayjay1976]

I noticed your Aurelios Pizza glass. I grew up in Joliet,IL .There was an Aurelios (owned by the Cemeno family)on Jefferson Street in Marycrest shopping center.

Are you a fan of their pizza? IMHO, Aurelio's makes the world's best pizza. I grew up in Tinley and was raised on Venuso's, which was perhaps my first solid food, though that place closed down in the early 90's. Aurelio's is about as close to the taste of Venuso's as you can get, except maybe Village Pizza on Oak Park avenue, though they only have one location. While we were living overseas for a few years and my wife could see I was suffering from a lack of good pizza, she took up the challenge of cloning that Aurelio's taste at home. Over the course of a couple of years (and countless delicious pizzas!) she came up with a very authentic tasting recipe which she still makes for me every couple of weeks.

We moved back to the states a few years ago and I'm in the west 'burbs now, there are a couple of Aurelio's within a short drive so we go there often. I don't work close enough to one though to have for lunch, so sometimes my wife and I take a day off work just to go enjoy their lunch buffet, where I try to eat my weight in pizza. I might have to go hit up Village someday soon, just for comparison.

 

[Soulshine2]

Are you a fan of their pizza? IMHO, Aurelio's makes the world's best pizza. I grew up in Tinley and was raised on Venuso's, which was perhaps my first solid food, though that place closed down in the early 90's. Aurelio's is about as close to the taste of Venuso's as you can get, except maybe Village Pizza on Oak Park avenue, though they only have one location. While we were living overseas for a few years and my wife could see I was suffering from a lack of good pizza, she took up the challenge of cloning that Aurelio's taste at home. Over the course of a couple of years (and countless delicious pizzas!) she came up with a very authentic tasting recipe which she still makes for me every couple of weeks.

We moved back to the states a few years ago and I'm in the west 'burbs now, there are a couple of Aurelio's within a short drive so we go there often. I don't work close enough to one though to have for lunch, so sometimes my wife and I take a day off work just to go enjoy their lunch buffet, where I try to eat my weight in pizza. I might have to go hit up Village someday soon, just for comparison.

Tinley... been there to the outdoor concert venue a few times. Also same town where Freddie Bear Sports is. Nice area.
Well, the Aurelios I was referring to was bought out by the Cemeno family instead of being a franchise , back about 15 yrs ago I guess,probably longer .
Anyway the Cemenos Pizza (Essington Rd, Joliet) is the same as the old Aurelios recipe ,that I can remember anyway. We go back up north to visit family and Cemenos pizza/Joe's Dugout is a "must have" crave meal,(but so is Portillo's,lol)we eat like fat kids . Their crust is nothing short of amazing and something I wish I could re-create. I'm planning to build an outdoor fireplace by our pool deck and even further trying to include a brick lined pizza oven...
Since moving to Alabama summer of 2017 ,good pizza is hard to find , mediocre pizza is rare enough. We have found Mellow Mushroom is about the best we've had here. Hand tossed crusty chewy crust, fresh toppings. Its still no Aurelios/Cemenos. But...it has an entire 2 chalkboards full of tap beers.

 

[Jayjay1976]

Tinley... been there to the outdoor concert venue a few times. Also same town where Freddie Bear Sports is. Nice area.
Well, the Aurelios I was referring to was bought out by the Cemeno family instead of being a franchise , back about 15 yrs ago I guess,probably longer .
Anyway the Cemenos Pizza (Essington Rd, Joliet) is the same as the old Aurelios recipe ,that I can remember anyway. We go back up north to visit family and Cemenos pizza/Joe's Dugout is a "must have" crave meal,(but so is Portillo's,lol)we eat like fat kids . Their crust is nothing short of amazing and something I wish I could re-create. I'm planning to build an outdoor fireplace by our pool deck and even further trying to include a brick lined pizza oven...
Since moving to Alabama summer of 2017 ,good pizza is hard to find , mediocre pizza is rare enough. We have found Mellow Mushroom is about the best we've had here. Hand tossed crusty chewy crust, fresh toppings. Its still no Aurelios/Cemenos. But...it has an entire 2 chalkboards full of tap beers.

Mellow Mushroom is pretty decent, I've had it in Indianapolis a couple of times. Also, Village Pizza that I mentioned is literally next door to Freddie Bear, ever had their pizza? It still looks exactly like I remember, but I'd like to know if the old guy who ran it is retired or sold it, and if their pizza is still awesome. I haven't been back to Tinley in probably 17 years, it's not that far to drive I just don't have family there or much reason to visit. There is an Aurelio's there though, at 159th & Oak Park where Jardine's used to be. My grandmother waited tables in that dining room for more than 40 years, so it would be nice to visit again.

Anyway, if you would like to try out my wife's recipe I could post it here or PM it to you. If you substitute the sugar in the sauce recipe with a bit of LME or DME it tastes even better

 

[Konadog]

@Jayjay1976, did you ever make out a part list for your panel, and are you still using it (original build)?

 

[Jayjay1976]

I haven't gotten around to the parts list yet but yes I use it all the time, 28 batches on it so far and zero tweaking or adjustments have been made. It suits my purposes exactly and I wouldn't change a thing.

 

[Konadog]

Good to hear, do you remember what box you purchased to house everything?

 

[Jayjay1976]

It was a plastic junction box made by Carlon, I think its the 8x8 model, home depot sells it.

 

[Konadog]

Thanks! I was looking at that one but couldn't tell if it was the same size.

 

[jc587491]

Reviving this thread for a quick question, I currently have a Wort-Hog controller with the 120 model. If I purchase the 320 model to upgrade, would I be able to just plug and play the wires on the new model. I'm confident I can wire it, just want to make sure it uses the same wires, connections, ECT.
Thanks guys!
Cheers!

 

[doug293cz]

Reviving this thread for a quick question, I currently have a Wort-Hog controller with the 120 model. If I purchase the 320 model to upgrade, would I be able to just plug and play the wires on the new model. I'm confident I can wire it, just want to make sure it uses the same wires, connections, ECT.
Thanks guys!
Cheers!

Yes, all models from the 120 on are pin-out identical. The 3xx models have some additional terminals used for the relays, but power, SSR, and temp Pt100 sensor terminals are the same.

Brew on

 

[jc587491]

Awesome! Thanks for the quick response!
Cheers!

Yes, all models from the 120 on are pin-out identical. The 3xx models have some additional terminals used for the relays, but power, SSR, and temp Pt100 sensor terminals are the same.

Brew on

 

[augiedoggy]

besides those extra relays though what other advantages does the 3xx have to make it an upgrade? I have a 3xx but its been a few years since I used it.

 

[jc587491]

besides those extra relays though what other advantages does the 3xx have to make it an upgrade? I have a 3xx but its been a few years since I used it.

The main thing I was interested in was the step mashing and boil temperature programmability. It would be nice to just set my brewday up once before I start, rather than messing with the temperature settings so much. Even if it's a simple single infusion mash, it would be nice to set strike temp, then holding mash temp, then mash out. And for the boil, go up to boiling for x-time then to 175 for whirlpool.

 

[ShaLaH]

The main thing I was interested in was the step mashing and boil temperature programmability. It would be nice to just set my brewday up once before I start, rather than messing with the temperature settings so much. Even if it's a simple single infusion mash, it would be nice to set strike temp, then holding mash temp, then mash out. And for the boil, go up to boiling for x-time then to 175 for whirlpool.

This is exactly what I'm looking for. Are you able to program all these steps with the 3xx? How has your experience been with it?