IPA off flavors...Again!

[Mountainsax]

We brewed a Chinook IPA kit from Northern Brewer and just poured out first pint. Lots of estery flavor! What did we do wrong?

Here are the details:

Ingredients - 6lbs Pilsen LME, 2 lbs Pilsen DME, .75 lane Belgian Cara 8, .25 lbs Briess Caramel 120, 3oz Chinook pellet hops (1oz @ 60 min, .5 oz @ 10 min, .5 oz @ 1 min), ~2oz green whole come Chinook hops at flameout, 11.5g Safale US-05 dry yeast.

Added 1lb DME at 60 min and the other lb at 11 min. Total boil 60 min. Steeped grains at 150F for 20 min. Chilled to 140F in 15 min using immersion chiller, then ran through counter flow chiller to 70-75F. Aerated by shaking carboy vigorously. Rehydrated yeast and pitched at 64F. Fermented at 64F for 6 weeks. Dry hopped 1oz for 1 week.

Kegged and put in kegerator at 36F for 2 weeks. OG 1.061, FG 1.012

We have read that others have had issues with esters and US-05. Is it just something this yeast does if not super healthy, pitched at high enough rate, etc.?

 

[Mountainsax]

If it is a yeast/ester issue, should we pull it out of the fridge and let it sit at room temp for a week or so? Should we pitch a little more yeast?

 

[Mountainsax]

We tasted 6 days after dry hopping and it tasted great!? Pretty sure we then cold crashed (didn't write it down) for 6 days and kegged.

 

[Komocabo]

Sounds like your fermentation temp and time we're good. First pint from the keg may have got some dregs from the yeast settling. Try another pint and see if that helps. I really like liquid yeast. Just my preference, and lots of people say they have had success with dry yeast. Have a few friends that use dry yeast and I just haven't been amazed (yet).

I use Wyeast 1056 for basically all of my IPAs. It's clean and very basic. I think it's the same strain as the 05 you used.

I would say drink this batch and try again with the liquid yeast.

I Probably should have started with the question of "what kind of esters are you detecting? "

 

[Mountainsax]

Getting fruity esters, banana and berries maybe? Poured a second 1/2 pint and there was less ester aroma, maybe slightly less flavor too. Still very in your face though.

 

[Mountainsax]

Might have a bit of astringent or alcoholic flavor too... Anyone live in Durango that knows what they are tasting who wants to come try it!?[emoji39]

 

[beerkench]

Six weeks on the yeast cake is quite a long time. Maybe your beer has picked up some flavours there?
Also 1oz of dry hops is not a lot for a
an IPA. Was it a 5 g batch? People are using anything from 3-6 oz these days. Hop flavour often diminishes quickly leaving the taste of a green beer if not dry hopped a lot in my experience. Try keg hopping too.


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[unionrdr]

Banana esters from US-05 @ 64F doesn't seem very likely to me. And berries? Combining the two, it could be something I've experienced with how different hops work in combination with various grains & extracts to make the over-all flavor? The Belgian malt & crystal 120 in the small amounts used could be giving flavors that taste like that combined with the hops?

 

[aprichman]

One possibility is that the yeast was stressed, possibly when hydrating it. Personally I find dry yeast to be a bit finicky.

 

[iijakii]

With US05 and low 60s I've had the dreaded peach off-flavor a couple of times. Not sure if that's what you're tasting, but I'd advise you to bump it up a couple degrees next time you use it. 64 should be fine, but maybe youre hitting the top end of that peach range. Try more 68ish next time. I've also switched to WLP001 and have cleaner results with it.

 

[JonM]

Maybe you just don't like Chinook?

 

[j1n]

Use a different yeast. i dont see anything wrong with your process. you could cut down on fermentation time though, prob could have dry hopped after a couple weeks. chico is better in the 65-68* range but ive done it at 64* before and its not much of a difference. i strongly dislike that yeast and never use it now.

 

[Mountainsax]

Maybe you just don't like Chinook?

We have done Chinook before and liked it... maybe its the fresh hops??

 

[iijakii]

We have done Chinook before and liked it... maybe its the fresh hops??

Very possible. I've had some super floral fresh hop beers I didn't care for much. Maybe your tongue is broken and you think bananas taste like flowers.

 

[Mountainsax]

Sounds like a couple votes for fermenting it higher, around 68. We have a Nut Brown fermenting now (should be just about done with primary) using the same yeast. We were doing this one at 62, but I think we will start bringing it up to 66-68.

Thanks for all the replies and suggestions!

 

[Mountainsax]

Maybe your tongue is broken...

SWMBO has accused me of this for years!!

 

[FloppyKnockers]

FWIW, my suggestions echo others. Don't re-hydrate US-05. Just sprinkle it on the wort (per the instructions), increase fermentation temperature, and six weeks is a bit long in the fermenter...for christ sakes, man!...there's sober kids in China. Drink your beer sooner than that!

 

[FloppyKnockers]

Maybe your tongue is broken

SWMBO has accused me of this for years!!

The fastest shortcut to poundtown is to go downtown...unless the red line is in service. If that's the case just stay home.

 

[Mountainsax]

FWIW, my suggestions echo others. Don't re-hydrate US-05. Just sprinkle it on the wort (per the instructions), increase fermentation temperature, and six weeks is a bit long in the fermenter...

Sounds like I need to start taking SG readings instead of just defaulting to the long end of the instructions. I thought that direct pitching of dry yeast could cause stress (since it was rehydrating in the wort)?

...for christ sakes, man!...there's sober kids in China. Drink your beer sooner than that!

ROFLMAO!!!!!

 

[beerkench]

Nothing wrong with dry yeast nor US-05


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[ScrewyBrewer]

I agree that 6 weeks is three times longer than I've ever fermented my Chinook IPAs. I used US-05 at 66F for two weeks and all 30 gallons of Hiphopapocalypse IPA tasted fantastic. I use a chest freezer with a temperature controller and a thermowell inside the fermentor to maintain that temperature.

IBU=134, SRM=5, OG=1.060, FG=1.012, ABV= 6.2%

As was stated previously by @FloppyKnockers I just sprinkled the dry yeast on top of the beer. I then let the yeast sit for 15 minutes before oxygenating the beer for a minute with O2. I've always gotten good attenuation when following these steps.

 

[TimKennard]

For what its worth, I brewed a DIPA recently and was low on Caramel 40, so I tossed in a couple ounces of Caramel 120 to try give the beer some color. I got lots of berry flavor out of the beer. Can't say I'd do that again. Not saying that is/was cause but its the only time I've used C120 in an IPA and the only time I've ever gotten berry flavor out of an IPA.

 

[Patrick87]

I've had two random batches of IPA made with US05 that ended up with a very estery profile. Even after looking through all my notes and using pretty much the exact same processes over-and-over, I still can't figure out what went wrong on those batches. One is still bottled up in my keggerator. Yeast was sprinkled directly on the wort, temps kept in the low to mid-60's, and everything was identical to my other batches of US05-IPA's. It's happened to me twice out of 25-ish batches.

 

[Mountainsax]

I agree that 6 weeks is three times longer than I've ever fermented my Chinook IPAs. I used US-05 at 66F for two weeks and all 30 gallons of Hiphopapocalypse IPA tasted fantastic. I use a chest freezer with a temperature controller and a thermowell inside the fermentor to maintain that temperature.

General consensus that the fermentation is longer than needed. Check!

Sounds like fermenting this yeast a little higher (66-68) is better. I was working under the assumption that staying on the cooler end of the yeast's range would give a cleaner fermentation. Maybe that isn't always the case?

We use a ferm fridge with temp controller. No thermowell, the probe is on the side of the fermenter stuck down a little notch in a piece of foam insulation that is strapped onto the carboy.

Hiphopapocalypse IPA - Killer name!

As was stated previously by @FloppyKnockers I just sprinkled the dry yeast on top of the beer. I then let the yeast sit for 15 minutes before oxygenating the beer for a minute with O2. I've always gotten good attenuation when following these steps.

So either don't rehydrate US-05 or use a liquid yeast (Wyeast 1056) and make a starter.

 

[Mountainsax]

I've had two random batches of IPA made with US05 that ended up with a very estery profile. Even after looking through all my notes and using pretty much the exact same processes over-and-over, I still can't figure out what went wrong on those batches. One is still bottled up in my keggerator. Yeast was sprinkled directly on the wort, temps kept in the low to mid-60's, and everything was identical to my other batches of US05-IPA's. It's happened to me twice out of 25-ish batches.

I hear you! This is our third occurrence of these flavors in roughly 15 batches, with no major differences in process. Definitely want to eliminate it for the future!

 

[ScrewyBrewer]

I think you're on the right track. I believe with of flavors, more times than not, they can be attributed to the yeast as the cause somehow.

 

[Mountainsax]

For what its worth, I brewed a DIPA recently and was low on Caramel 40, so I tossed in a couple ounces of Caramel 120 to try give the beer some color. I got lots of berry flavor out of the beer. Can't say I'd do that again. Not saying that is/was cause but its the only time I've used C120 in an IPA and the only time I've ever gotten berry flavor out of an IPA.

Good to know!

 

[Mountainsax]

I think you're on the right track. I believe with of flavors, more times than not, they can be attributed to the yeast as the cause somehow.

I think understanding yeast is almost as hard as understanding women!!

 

[FloppyKnockers]

I think understanding yeast is almost as hard as understanding women!!

A bazillion of one thing and one woman balances the scales of understanding. This thread just turned quite profound.

 

[Jim311]

It's getting deep in here. I ferment US05 at 66-67. Also it took me a little experimentation to realize that setting my temp controller to 67 doesn't mean it holds my booze at 67 degrees. It means the fridge kicks on at 67, so most of the time it stays a degree or two cooler than the temp I set the controller to. Make sure you're factoring that in when choosing your temp.