I know most here seem to use pulleys. But, on our last brew, we used a ratcheting tie down strap to suspend the bag. A few quick cranks on that thing and it was up out of the bucket and good to go. There should be very little concern about weight limit, and the effort is minimal.
Input from BIABers
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BeardedBrews
Well-Known Member
The thing that's easy to forget is that the darn thing is HOT!
I picked up some cheap-o silicon oven mitts from Amazon which are easy to clean and keep my hands away from the wort.
Also keep in mind that the bag will want to tip over/spill out/otherwise misbehave at the worst possible times. You'll think "oh man, let me just balance this here and grab my spoon" and BLAMMO! Spent grains all over the floor!
It's really not that bad, especially if you spend a couple minutes planning your attack. Get everything ready, and then lift slowly and carefully. If you have a second person to help, then it gets really easy.
I picked up some cheap-o silicon oven mitts from Amazon which are easy to clean and keep my hands away from the wort.
Also keep in mind that the bag will want to tip over/spill out/otherwise misbehave at the worst possible times. You'll think "oh man, let me just balance this here and grab my spoon" and BLAMMO! Spent grains all over the floor!
It's really not that bad, especially if you spend a couple minutes planning your attack. Get everything ready, and then lift slowly and carefully. If you have a second person to help, then it gets really easy.
UndeadFred
Well-Known Member
I did the braid in the bottom of the cooler, and then I tried and stuck with a curtain panel in the bottom of my cooler instead. It actually made clean up EASIER. All you need to do is shake out and hose the bag off a couple of time.. If I go more than 45 seconds doing that..it's a lot...
The huge advantage to the curtain panel (which I used with bungees) or a bag in the cooler is no need EVER to use rice hulls, the ability to stir the mash to get efficiency up (it works) and freeing stuck sparges with a tug on the bag.
But then I decided I was tired of freezing my rear end off in the winter and built up a PID controlled recirculating (pump) eBIAB system.
It is not faster. Not at all. It's about the same amount of work. Cleaning is a little more because I added the pump. However, being able to do it all inside, at about 1/7th the cost of energy vs. propane, being able to keep mash within about 1 degree F, being able to step mash and even making decoction mashes (with a second electric small vessel) easier.. there are reasons to do it that don't have anything to do with the bag. It's much smaller, probably taking up 10 sq ft of floor space in my basement.
My beers have been a little better with the hot side control.
I really think most comments out there (and I'll get attacked for it) about "cleaning the bag" are by people who either never have tried it, or tried to clean out the bag three days later after forgetting it. Really it's on the boil side so shaking out the bag, just water and then if there's any grain matter next time you use it -- shaking it out dry before use, is all you ever need. I sometime get picky and will run it through the top shelf of the dishwasher but it's never needed.
The huge advantage to the curtain panel (which I used with bungees) or a bag in the cooler is no need EVER to use rice hulls, the ability to stir the mash to get efficiency up (it works) and freeing stuck sparges with a tug on the bag.
But then I decided I was tired of freezing my rear end off in the winter and built up a PID controlled recirculating (pump) eBIAB system.
It is not faster. Not at all. It's about the same amount of work. Cleaning is a little more because I added the pump. However, being able to do it all inside, at about 1/7th the cost of energy vs. propane, being able to keep mash within about 1 degree F, being able to step mash and even making decoction mashes (with a second electric small vessel) easier.. there are reasons to do it that don't have anything to do with the bag. It's much smaller, probably taking up 10 sq ft of floor space in my basement.
My beers have been a little better with the hot side control.
I really think most comments out there (and I'll get attacked for it) about "cleaning the bag" are by people who either never have tried it, or tried to clean out the bag three days later after forgetting it. Really it's on the boil side so shaking out the bag, just water and then if there's any grain matter next time you use it -- shaking it out dry before use, is all you ever need. I sometime get picky and will run it through the top shelf of the dishwasher but it's never needed.
Good info. I will consider this for future upgrades. Being a one man show, I thought it made sense to reduce steps/equipment to make brew day easier and more enjoyable. I've had good success with the mash tun. Really no reason to change other than hoping to reduce lifting and steps during the process. Managing multiple pots and heating sparge water while taking pH readings can sometimes make things difficult. I know I could probably be more efficient, but BIAB seems to help address these items for me. Hope it works out.
I just moved from a house where I had a natural gas line for brewing. It was so convenient. Back to propane for the time being, but I hope one day to get back on natural gas or possibly go electric.
Egmonster
Well-Known Member
I have been BIAB from the start but actually have just ordered the gear to make a cooler mash tun. Like BIAB well enough but just thought I would give it a try. But I like fooling with stuff.
![Craft A Brew - Safale BE-256 Yeast - Fermentis - Belgian Ale Dry Yeast - For Belgian & Strong Ales - Ingredients for Home Brewing - Beer Making Supplies - [3 Pack]](https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/51bcKEwQmWL._SL500_.jpg)
Wet hot and sticky but no mess.
12.6lbs of grain
Bag management plan is key. No pulley but I only do 5.5 gallon batches.
To clean the bag I use one of these after dumping the cooled grain in the flower beds. Simple. Same for my hop spider bag.
No better no worse than a multi-vessel setup.
If your doing either correctly a mess should not be a factor.
12.6lbs of grain
Bag management plan is key. No pulley but I only do 5.5 gallon batches.
To clean the bag I use one of these after dumping the cooled grain in the flower beds. Simple. Same for my hop spider bag.
No better no worse than a multi-vessel setup.
If your doing either correctly a mess should not be a factor.
user 128202
Active Member
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For the Anova users in this thread: have you guys sorted out the 'don't let it touch anything but water' warning in the owner's manual? Well... I guess I shouldn't assume yours has that warning (don't know what model #, etc., you have...), but I know my immersion circulator has that warning in the manual. For that reason, I've never tried it in a mash even though that was one of my original thoughts when buying it (in addition to delicious food of course ). Any chance you guys called them to inquire about this? I'm guessing it's a warranty issue? But I also considered it could be a food safety type of issue as well. Just curious. Cheers!
). Any chance you guys called them to inquire about this? I'm guessing it's a warranty issue? But I also considered it could be a food safety type of issue as well. Just curious. Cheers!
buzd
Well-Known Member
I burned a hole in my specialty grain steeping bag during my first batch. Barely any grain escaped and the Anova seems no worse for it.
andrewmaixner
Well-Known Member
For the Anova users in this thread: have you guys sorted out the 'don't let it touch anything but water' warning in the owner's manual? Well... I guess I shouldn't assume yours has that warning (don't know what model #, etc., you have...), but I know my immersion circulator has that warning in the manual. For that reason, I've never tried it in a mash even though that was one of my original thoughts when buying it (in addition to delicious food of course
It's just a warranty/cleaning issue. The parts of the ANOVA that contact wort are literally just a stainless housing, stainless element, stainless water level sensors, and stainless impeller.
Keep the electronics out of liquid and wash it properly.
For the Anova users in this thread: have you guys sorted out the 'don't let it touch anything but water' warning in the owner's manual? Well... I guess I shouldn't assume yours has that warning (don't know what model #, etc., you have...), but I know my immersion circulator has that warning in the manual. For that reason, I've never tried it in a mash even though that was one of my original thoughts when buying it (in addition to delicious food of course
in my experience, the anova doesnt let that happen. the impeller is below the heating coils, so if and when the bag gets close enough to be almost touching the element, it ends up getting sucked into impeller on bottom instead, and the unit shuts itself off and gives loud annoying alarm. the openings near the element are small, and the suction from impeller is strong enough to take over and pull the bag down. so burning bag has never happened to me.
now i just clip my bag to the kettle so that the bottom doesnt rest on bottom of kettle, and that usually means there isnt enough slack in the bag for it to get pulled into unit, and keep it away from the unit.
if you look at the ads that pop up on the right of this forum, there's a guy called ArborFab that makes a wire mesh strainer for biab that is 3/4 round with one side of the circle that's been flattened- that's how you want to get your bag to hang. never had a problem since i got that shape down.
user 128202
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Hey y'all. My bad! I think I worded my question poorly, though andrewmaixner, you did speak a bit to what I was wondering. My manual clearly says something like "the circulator should not come into direct contact with food products" about three times. I'm trying to sleuth their reason for this: could it just be a warranty issue? Andrewmaixner, it sounds like your vote is in this column. However, I also considered that it it could be a food safety issue and I was wondering if anyone's ever called them up to inquire. Regardless, thanks to both of you for chiming in.
Used to be very limited in AG recipes due to limited space in 5gal cooler and forced to partial mashes & partial boils...switched to BIAB in 10gal pot with full vol mashes combined with my own mill and have never been happier!
Ok, one last question. I've been wanting to upgrade my kettle from a 9 gallon aluminum to stainless steel. I've thought about a 15 gallon, but I think 10 gallons will fit better budget-wise and I won't be making 10 gallon batches in the foreseeable future. I've narrowed it down to an SS Brewtech or spike kettle. I'm leaning spike because of the welded fittings, but SS Brewtech seems to offer a great value. For Spike kettles, they offer a vertical or horizontal configuration for the couplings, or I could get a ball valve only. If I go Spike, anyone have a recommendation on the ideal configuration of ball valve and thermometer? Is thermometer necessary since I'll use a digital one to record temps? Thanks.
ThatVideoKid
Well-Known Member
Just remember that the bag will be 150-160 degrees and that temperature can inflict minor burns in seconds. 25-30lbs is much more of a pain when it's wet, sticky and hot. Plus it's weighs more than that while most of the water is still draining. I'd say my bag is prove belt closer to 40-45lbs when I pull it out.
That being said I would recommend BIAB. I am working on building an arm with a pulley for about $30 in 4x4s and a pulley.
Personally, I'd go with a 15 gallon. I just upgraded from 9 and 10 gallon kettles to a 15.5 gallon. It was a very good choice.
And, again my opinion, but I'd also skip the premium kettles and go with something like a Bayou Classic and outfit the kettle myself. If you're adverse to doing it yourself, you can buy a Bayou Classic from @Bobby_M and have him silver solder whatever fittings you want into it.
https://www.brewhardware.com/product_p/laborptsolder.htm
https://www.brewhardware.com/product_p/labortcsolder.htm
Thanks for the tip. I wasn't originally seeking a premium pot, but I would rather it be ready to go and have peace of mind that it was done right by buying through a reputable vendor instead of doing the install myself. I'm all for DIY, but I would rather pay someone to do this for me. The other plus on the pots I mentioned are the interior gallon markings and the fact that more than 10 gallons can fit in the pot so it gives a little more space on boils. I brew average gravity beers so I don't think mash volume would be an issue, but I will reconsider a 15G pot. Saving money to invest elsewhere would be great. I'll check it out.
wilserbrewer
BIAB Expert Tailor
Bag management haha, we have a new phrase, I like it.
If possible, I would suggest a ratchet pulley, as it allows you to slowly lift the bag as it drains click by click as you raise the bag. No need to ever touch the hot grain.
If a ratchet pulley isn't possible in your situation, and If you are reasonably fit, I don't think 5 gal 13lb grain bills will be excessive, as long as you have a plan on where the bag is going. One poster just simply removed the bag, then placed it in a bucket with an overturned sauce pot or bowl in the bottom of the bucket. Quite simple and effective as it keeps the bag off the bottom of the bucket and allows it to drain. After 20 - 30 minutes it is well drained and cool enough to be easily and safely be managed.
Bag management is one reason I don't prefer a batch or dunk sparge, too much moving the bag around for a nominal gain IMO. I'll gladly take a slight knock in efficiency doing a small pour over sparge and brew like a gentlemen.
Lol
If possible, I would suggest a ratchet pulley, as it allows you to slowly lift the bag as it drains click by click as you raise the bag. No need to ever touch the hot grain.
If a ratchet pulley isn't possible in your situation, and If you are reasonably fit, I don't think 5 gal 13lb grain bills will be excessive, as long as you have a plan on where the bag is going. One poster just simply removed the bag, then placed it in a bucket with an overturned sauce pot or bowl in the bottom of the bucket. Quite simple and effective as it keeps the bag off the bottom of the bucket and allows it to drain. After 20 - 30 minutes it is well drained and cool enough to be easily and safely be managed.
Bag management is one reason I don't prefer a batch or dunk sparge, too much moving the bag around for a nominal gain IMO. I'll gladly take a slight knock in efficiency doing a small pour over sparge and brew like a gentlemen.
Lol
Thanks for the tips. I would definitely use a pulley but my planned location for brewing would not allow for it, yet. Moving the location is possible, but I will try lifting it out and placing it in something to drain first. Will probably go ahead and purchase a pulley to have on hand if needed in the future.
If you have an A frame ladder, just set it up over your kettle and use it like a derrick, tying off to the top as your anchor point.
BeardedBrews
Well-Known Member
I think the reason you will hear people coming back to the pulley over and over again is because those of us that use that approach have really enjoyed the simplicity.
There are tons of different ways to do this, and I'm sure you'll be just fine lifting the bag into a basket or strainer or whatever. For my first BIABs I lifted the bag into a steamer basket and set it over the kettle. It worked fine, but moving into the garage and using a rafter for a pulley is way cleaner and easier for me.
lawrenjl
Well-Known Member
I use a pulley to lift my basket, which works good. For the OP question, I am going back to batch sparging as the time is about the same and I have far less trub in my ferment. Before anybody chimes in, I use Irish moss, whirlpool, and have a great hot and cold break. I will miss having automated mash temperature control though. Additionally, my ebiab is more efficient than batch sparging. Just my 2 cents.
So is it an aesthetic thing or do you perceive change in flavor due to additional trub.
My method of draining the kettle leave 99% of it behind but it also slows the process to almost 4 hours (I just open the valve and let it run while do other things). The BiaB process changed that only a little in that it doubles the trub in kettle bottom which increases the filtering, which slows the drain.
lawrenjl
Well-Known Member
No change in taste but I lose 3/4 gallon of finished beer after it settles out in the fermenter. I leave behind a ton of stuff in my kettle.
lawrenjl
Well-Known Member
Ebiab isn't bad, just not for me.
Did not take it that way at all. I was just curious. The loses to trub and cloudier than normal starting wort are common and valid complaints about the process.
Morrey
Well-Known Member
I am all in favor of multiple opinions, and in depth comparisons. In fact I ran a poll on the BIAB vs. 3 vessel topic some time ago, for pretty much the same reason you started this thread.
What bothers me is slanted (either intentional or unintentional) arguments that omit material facts, misrepresent facts, or use inflammatory phrasing in an attempt to sway readers. I want to see fair comparisons.
In my first reply to this thread, I specifically brought up bag management as something that needs to be dealt with, because it causes issues for some brewers who try BIAB.
Brew on
Doug, I appreciated your original BIAB posts and comparisons (you referenced them) back some time ago when I was comparing 3 vessel to BIAB. I had additional questions which you answered and supported, of course along with other members. Overwhelmingly, I heard that if BIAB is working for me, why create more work trying to go 3V. A local professional brewer told me exactly what you told me.
One major factor that I tend to overlook when someone posts about BIAB, is how MY particular set-up may compare to theirs. I am lucky to have an outdoor brew cave with exposed rafters making hanging a BIAB pulley a breeze. I can set up my burners and kettles under a covered roof with no concerns. I have a water source for filling and cooling 10 feet away. I tend to look at what best serves me and not what someone else may have available. What if they live in a townhome or a condo? The list goes on and on. My conditions make BIAB very easy for me, while others may find my conveniences a challenge to them. You are keen to realize this my friend.
Thought I would come back and thank the posters on this thread for their input on BIAB. After a few years of utilizing a mash tun, I decided to give BIAB a try to simply the brew day. I recently brewed a 5G haus pale ale with centennial hops and san diego super yeast. Brew day went pretty good. Hit my mash temp and the reflectix jacket on my kettle held temps well. My SS Brewtech kettle worked great, and really liked transferring from a ball valve with camlocks and silicone tubing to my fermenter. The bag from wilserbrewer worked awesome, and the rachet pulley was great. I have a big space in a brew cave outside and I used my garage door frame to hold the pulley. I think I'll utilize a rafter next time because I didn't like the feeling of pulling on the frame with a bag of grains, but it did work fine. However, I spilled a little but I think next time I need to pull it out a little slower so the liquid can drain to the middle first instead of over the sides, but it was a rather small amount. I squeezed a little because I wanted to get going with the boil. My $10 silicone oven gloves from amazon worked well for this. I think my brewhouse efficiency was spot on at 80%. Had to rely on my refractometer only because I misplaced my hydrometer. Sampled tonight before cold crashing and it tastes great. Clarity is good and will be clear once it chills in the keg for a couple weeks.
Overall, I really enjoyed my first BIAB. I didn't save as much time as I had hoped, but I think that will improve as I get used to this process. Also was entertaining the kids for most of it, which was easier since I didn't worry about sparging. Also didn't measure my pH since my probe is dead, but it was just another thing not to worry about and made the day easier. I would recommend this be the first step to all-grain for a new brewer and then they can decide where to go from there.
Overall, I really enjoyed my first BIAB. I didn't save as much time as I had hoped, but I think that will improve as I get used to this process. Also was entertaining the kids for most of it, which was easier since I didn't worry about sparging. Also didn't measure my pH since my probe is dead, but it was just another thing not to worry about and made the day easier. I would recommend this be the first step to all-grain for a new brewer and then they can decide where to go from there.
