Infusion Mash Roggenbier Possible?

[wintermute2]

I'm about to do my first all-grain batch and wanted to do something memorable, something that really couldn't be done as a partial-mash, something interesting. I was thinking of doing a roggenbier similar to this one, but in a 5.5 gallon batch:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f70/poobahs-roggenbier-117612/

I know that rye is tricky and can gum up the mash, and it seems like decoction mashes are recommended, but since my mash/lauter tun consists of a screened 10-gallon cooler and I don't have circulating pumps, can I do this as a single infusion mash w/ sparge? Or am I really asking for trouble with a 50% rye grain bill? I was thinking of dumping at least a 1/2 pound of rice hulls into the mash to be safe.

My backup plan is to do a dampfbier, which isn't as interesting.

 

[roastquake]

What you could do is start with a low grain/water ratio (1qt per lb) start with a beta-glucan rest (around 110 degrees F) for 20-30 minutes. That will break up the molecules responsible for gumminess. Then add boiling water to reach conversion temp.

What I would do is mash in my brew kettle so I can apply direct heat so as not to worry about adding water and thinning the mash. And I would do rests as such: beta-glucan, protein, conversion, and mash-out. Then I would transfer to my lauter tun, lauter and sparge.

I like this method because I can add hot tap water to the mash without pre-heating since it comes out at about 125 F, which puts the mash at beta-glucan temps immediately. I've done this for rye, wheat and oats and never had a gummy mash problem.

Edit: I just caught that this is your maiden voyage into all grain brewing. I know you're gonna do what you want anyway, but there is always the option to try something simple the first time.

also, remind me what a dampfbier is.

 

[wintermute2]

also, remind me what a dampfbier is.

Dampfbier is a German steam beer (dampf = steam). Pilsner (70%)/Munich (30%) grain bill, moderate noble hops, weissbier yeast.

I happen to have some 3068, tettnanger, and hersbrucker on-hand, hence why I'm gravitating towards these beers. I'm bottling a grain-steep/extract hefe this weekend, so I don't want to make another of those just yet.

Hmmm, after your mash suggestion, maybe I should stick with the dampf.

 

[roastquake]

dampf sounds good, I want to make one now. Never had a true roggen but I know for a fact that 30% rye in a c-hop American pale ale is awesome

 

[DSmith]

Rice hulls should be a safe bet. I've used a rule-of-thumb where you add-up your wheat & rye in your mash and take 10% of that for deterimining how much rice hulls to add. Seems to work fine. Be sure to soak the rice hulls in some hot water before adding them to the mash. They won't affect your mash water volumes and gives them a nice rinse. A strainer is nice to have for soaking/rinsing the hulls.

 

[DROOO]

even with a cooler mash tun, you can decoction mash. we used a spare kettle on our boil kettle burner. (we didn't want to to deal with cleaning the boil kettle before lautering.) returning the decoction after boil, raises your mash temp. granted, it's not foolproof and having the ability to raise temp with a burner is advantageous, but it could work. the trick is determining the size of decoction in order to hit your mash temps for each step. that said, i would never suggest / recommend a decoction mash for your first all grain brew.

 

[JBOGAN]

Forgot the name of the German guy on You tube but he does a three part series on decoction(really good info).I have been reading and watching on this topic for the past couple weeks and would advise you to at least try a normal AG brew day before you tackle a decoction.Better to get your AG process down and make a great beer than to be stressed out about it..Make that Dampfbier and good luck

 

[Beernik]

I decoct and my system isn't automated. I have a Pyrex measuring cup and I scoop out how much wort and grain I'm decocting and boil it. After its had its boil, I pour it gently back into the MLT.

Oxidization is all you have to worry about and I've never experienced pre-boil oxidization.

But decoction is a lot to bite off your first time out. I'm not saying "don't go for it" but it will be trial by fire. If you survive, you can survive anything.

 

[wintermute2]

Thanks everyone, you talked some sense into me and I'm going to try that dampfbier when I get my burner. I'll take on the fancier stuff when I've got my system down.