In trouble for composting spent grain?

[arkowa]

Has anyone been hassled over throwing spent grain in your garden or composting? I've just received a Health Department Cease letter, discussing future legal actions if "raw garbage" is not removed from garden area.

Folded into the soil, spent grains make the sweetest, most beautiful rich soil. *drool*

Raw garbage? Food? Rats? Nuisance? All descriptive terms used in the Health Dept. letter. The bane of my garden existence, rabbits, birds, squirrels, and ground hogs, all love my spent grain. Rats? Never.

It is not even like I live in a great area/gated community/HOA... Cincinnati inner-suburb of Norwood. A blue-collar low-income city. Heck, my backyard goes: interstate highway, shrubs, govt' chainlink fence, and my garden. Again, not the Hilton Paris.

/rant over

 

[Arneba28]

That blows the big one. I had to stop composting them at my old house. The flys were absolutely insane. But yes it makes the best soil ever once its good and broken down.

 

[arkowa]

Flies do suck - thankfully the garden is a decent distance from the house - and the two next door neighbors are cool as hell. It amazes me that someone, likely a neighbor two or three houses down, who I've never talked to, nor bothered, would send anonymous complaints to the Health Dept.

(this is the second, in the fall, the complaint was "tall obnoxious weeds... aka, dried cornstalks, okra, sunflowers, and hop bines)".

This is starting to become fodder for the drunk rambling forum ;-\

 

[superjunior]

that really sucks, I don't see the harm in composting spent grains
sounds like you have a neighbor with way too much time on their hands

 

[Mongrel]

Is it legal to own chickens in Cinci? Spent grain is no longer garbage, it's feed. A rooster is a great way to say thank you to a concerned neighbor.

 

[arkowa]

I'm fighting it. Seriously - in the current environment of "green" (wife is a HS science teacher and head of the school's Go Green Initiative), does the city really want hundreds of pounds of grain put into landfills? It smacks against common sense and good public relations. Hell, wife was so upset over this, she is starting to ramp up her desire to leave the city.

 

[EdWort]

I have magic rocks that I used to put my spent grain on after brewing.

Here's the same magic rocks the next morning.

I now give the grain to my chickens.

 

[arkowa]

Actually - my suburb just passed a law allowing chickens ($25 annual inspection fee). *evil laughter*

Too bad SWMBO reminded me that she'd kill me if I ever attempted. Something about a "fear of chickens". WTF? Screw this, I'm moving back to rural NC

 

[KevinM]

Sounds like a problem neighbor, especially with the "weeds" bit.
Were you working the grain into the soil, or just tossing it on top? Might have to use a composting bin.

 

[bierhaus15]

I don't see why composting would be a problem. If you left it out in a big pile, maybe, but mixing it in with the soil should be fine. I'd tell your neighbor to go ---- ------- and keep on doing it.

 

[arkowa]

I'm guilty of throwing it on top (a la EdWort's picture). This winter, with the ground frozen and at times covered in snow, it would have been insane to try to mix it in. Now that we have a warm spell, I've been working the grain in. Between snow melt, rain, and birds having their fun, I can not tell there is grain in the garden unless I am directly over it. What neighbors two+ doors down see, god only knows.

Granted, I have no idea what they think about their young neighbor who periodically stands in the backyard with a turkey fryer and igloo cooler. Boil boil cauldron boil! A eye of newt and tongue of Rosie ODonnald!

In terms of telling the neighbor to _____________ them self... it is possible, the first Health Dept letter fell on deaf ears... I ignored it and nothing ever happened. Heck, part of the first warning, aside from the "tall noxious weeds" was about illegal firewood. Hint: I don't have firewood. Neighbors do, on their land. Not I!

Just annoying knowing someone has too much time on their hands... and go out of their way to inconvenience "good" neighbors. I'm an educator during the week and play Army reserves on the monthly weekend I'm not brewing! Dicks ;-\ *drinks another one*

 

[Pilgarlic]

Mine gets spread thinly, then raked into, the grass. It's done wonders!

 

[tbel]

While I agree with you on the letter and neighbors, I don't think it's a good idea to dump spent grains directly into the garden. It's my understanding that when organic material breaks down in a garden it actually robs nutrients from the surrounding soil. I can't site any sources but I know I've seen that many times. If you got your self a composting barrel you could kill 2 birds with one stone. No grains for anyone to complain about, and you would find they break down quickly allowing you to add them as true compost into your garden.

 

[arkowa]

My understanding is that the negative is somewhat of a misconception... nitrogen is "tied up" to aide in breaking down the organic material, but, in the end, there will be a net gain as the nitrogen using decomposers (fungi, bacteria, etc) finish the job go to germ heaven.

Alas, I won't debate that having a true compost bin/barrel would be best. The city even sells bins at reduced prices. Out of sight and would allow throwing additional organic material without the scorn of being a neighborhood blight!

 

[lumpher]

i fling mine over my back fence onto an area by a culvert. birds love it, as they get to eat some good stuff

 

[COLObrewer]

Wow, sounds like your neighbors need to get a life, this is why I don't live in a city, it's a pity that some people have no logical sense of priority. Just too bad you don't know exactly who it is that has a problem. The chickens compost mine for me with great efficiency.

 

[weirdboy]

WTF this sounds like a dickhead neighbor to me. It's not like the health department is doing random garden inspections.

You could always get a compost bin, or dig a small hole, throw the spent grain in, and cover it.

 

[40watt]

This is why my days of city living are over. I can't find a good brew pub to save my life, but I am free to play Farmer Brown in the woods in Oklahoma.

I support the buy the loudest rooster with the baddest attitude you can find idea.

 

[samc]

I usually toss mine into the garden. However this fall I noticed a not so little RAT staring in at me from my brewing deck. I've decided to stop the grain dumping at this point. I've only noticed the birds eating it, not the rabbits, chipmunks or deer - so it seems that Rats & Birds will have to feed elsewhere this year.

 

[biochemedic]

This is why I feel a good buffer between neighbors is a damn good thing....I can dump grains in the woods behind the house and not even think about hearing a damn thing about it. (Although if I had time for a garden, they spents that weren't bound for bread would go right in there....)

 

[Flomaster]

any idea who said "dick head" neighbor is? can you request the info from the health department of who has been calling. how about you tell the health department that you have no idea what they are talking about. you are using fertilizer in your garden.

-=Jason=-

 

[StMarcos]

Cover it with some straw each time you put it down. It ought to be illegal not to compost.

 

[millsware]

Wow Edwort, you should put those magic rocks on the market! What else can they get rid of?

 

[payton34]

put up the tallest fence your city will allow. someone had to see you dumping the grains in your garden. it is sometimes true that fences make the best neighbors

 

[Gordzilla]

I would just take your spent grains down to the complaining neighbors house in the middle of the night put them on their property then call and complain to the city

 

[StMarcos]

If you compost correctly there is no smell.

 

[Jawbox0]

Yeah, I wish I could just bring the spent grains to the city compost piles, but they specify yard trimmings only. I know that spent grains make excellent compost, but I don't want to get a ticket for dumping 'waste' into the compost heap.

 

[Golddiggie]

Any vegetable matter, which includes grains, is fair game for composting. You just don't want to put any meat parts/waste out there (bones, fat, etc.) since that can rot and stink to high hell.

We would put seaweed in our garden from time to time, either at the end of the season, or far enough ahead of planting for it to break down nicely.

I would agree that a nice fence is in order. I would also make a decent terrace for the hops to grow up, so that even IF they come by to inspect, when it's growing, you could just say it's decorative. Since it dies back every year, it's non-invasive.

IF you can find out who actually complained, I would figure out a way to ask them WTF their issue is (but in a calm way, at least initially)... Maybe offering them a home brew (if they drink) will help them see the light. I wouldn't bring that on the first visit though, better to do that later...

Maybe organize a block party for the neighborhood, providing some home brew for the event. Then as more people ask where you got it (make some decent labels for the bottles, or keg) you can explain how you make it, and it's 100% legal to do so. How you're a "green" brewer in that you recycle virtually everything, including composting spent grain... Maybe the buttmunch neighbor will get the idea and leave you alone...

 

[Toga]

If you know who it is I recommend filling their mail box with manure. Turds for turds :rockin:

 

[ChshreCat]

My guess is that the neighbor called and said you were "throwing garbage" in your yard and the health department never even came out to see what they were referring to. I would contact them, contest the letter and explain to them that you're COMPOSTING and that your neighbor is an idiot.

 

[Pilgarlic]

I compost everything I can and have a very successful compost bin. But I do NOT put my spent grains in there. Any "green" materials (like spent grains, perhaps counterintuitively), in the presence of moisture and lacking aeration, will rot and stink. Few things smell as bad as spent grains when they are allowed to do this. This isn't composting (aerobic), it's rotting (lots of anaerobics). It's really hard to keep spent grains from doing this in the compost pile, and I don't want those nasties in my compost. The stuff works great, though, when spread evenly on the lawn and raked in. Five to ten minutes and it's done.

 

[cklages]

I compost everything I can and have a very successful compost bin. But I do NOT put my spent grains in there. Any "green" materials (like spent grains, perhaps counterintuitively), in the presence of moisture and lacking aeration, will rot and stink. Few things smell as bad as spent grains when they are allowed to do this. This isn't composting (aerobic), it's rotting (lots of anaerobics). It's really hard to keep spent grains from doing this in the compost pile, and I don't want those nasties in my compost. The stuff works great, though, when spread evenly on the lawn and raked in. Five to ten minutes and it's done.

I'm going to give this a big +1 (even though there was that post about the +1 getting on someones nerves, please don't call the HOA!)

Anything heavy and wet can really muck up a compost pile. I dig it right into my garden so the soil can soak up the moisture and it can break down in a more user friendly fashion.

 

[jamaha]

Anything heavy and wet can really muck up a compost pile. I dig it right into my garden so the soil can soak up the moisture and it can break down in a more user friendly fashion.

I've not had this problem, and I compost every bit of organic matter my house produces that I can't recycle, including meat, bones, fats and grease, and the contents of my humanure toilet. My bin is enclosed on the sides to keep critters out, and covered with alot of cover material (straw or gathered leaves). I've never been able to detect a smell after I've covered the pile. However, I'm an extract brewer, so I've never had that much wet grain, although I doubt it's any more heavy and wet than my toilet contents.

But if you don't have a compost bin, spreading it out and raking it into the lawn would be a great way to go.

 

[arkowa]

My guess is that the neighbor called and said you were "throwing garbage" in your yard and the health department never even came out to see what they were referring to. I would contact them, contest the letter and explain to them that you're COMPOSTING and that your neighbor is an idiot.

Indeed. Today I have calmed down a bit. Composting - good neighbor - wife that is a HS green Initiative sponsor, husband that is Army Public Relations Representative, and I share my bountiful harvest with anyone willing to take yet another bag of squash!

Scare tactic - I'm basically calling their bluff - and calling the Health Dept to give my terse response. Kinds warms my heart that people in the ghetto care enough about their neighborhood to "rat" on "nuisances" like myself!

.... *real estate websites* Yup, moving to N. Kentucky... where land is plentiful and sisters make SWMBOs.

 

[Zamial]

Man you have the most powerful weapon to derail "the system" at your disposal and have not tapped it??? WTF???

1st off love just love the "spent chicken feed" + composting. You can also use it to grow mushrooms (I would suggest the legal varieties...) Did you know you can also dry the spent grains (That is actually part of a DIY project coming this late spring.) and then use a blender to make a spent grain like flour to bake with?

Now onto your great untapped weapon.

(wife is a HS science teacher and head of the school's Go Green Initiative)

Your wife has how many students? Unless this is a real strange HS I guess she has 6 classes all full of kids. Did you know that your city/township offices addresses are public domain?
I would bet that your wife could have the students write a letter to the city with a "green idea". I bet she knows more teachers as well, the younger the better, Kindergarten is where it is at though. Letters and pictures in crayon... If every student sends 1 letter every day for a week...ZOMG!!! This is a "snail mail denial of service style attack." That much volume of mail WILL cripple them. They also need to reply to each one because it is their constituents children. You would hate to have to inform the local paper that the city does not care about the children or the environment...that is just bad politics. I bet you could go into the office after a day or 2 and have an impromptu meeting with the "city officials" and explain that the letters will stop as soon as "you leave me alone" unless I am actually breaking a law. I am going to guess that they will never bother you again...

 

[chromados]

Well if you cannot move and a fence is not possible I found that brewing in a teeny weenie speedo is a great way to have the neighbors stop watching what your doing and pretty much leave you alone forever. Dangerous, yes......effective, absolutely.

Chromados

 

[Golddiggie]

Could be a bit scary in the middle of winter...

You could always brew in the buff, after sunset... If they complain, ask what they were doing looking into YOUR yard after dark... If they're not right next door, that means they had to actually put effort into looking at you...

You could always plan on dumping the grain into the compost heap/bin late at night. Of course, during the summer you could just do it like you're tending the garden anyway... Or have SWMBO take care of it for you, while doing the gardening (or whichever of you does it)...

Basically, since you're not doing anything to harm him, or his property, he should sit on a flag pole... wow... where did THAT come from???

 

[northernlad]

The nice thing is, since you are not dumping raw garbage on your garden, you have nothing to worry about.
I compost my spent grain and if I don't keep it stirred it smells like dead bodies.

 

[Golddiggie]

Get some fake animal tails and stick them in the top of the compost heap... Get some that look like cats, dogs, any other pet or even exotic animal you can find... As long as they look real, get them and stick them in all over the place... Maybe rotate which ones are in the pile with others in reserve, so it looks like you're always adding more, and others are decomposing...

Get that neighbor to sheit a BRICK!!

 

[Zen_Brew]

I have magic rocks that I used to put my spent grain on after brewing.

Wow mister. I have this money that my mom gave to to buy some groceries and to get her medication, but I think I'd like to buy some of your magic rocks instead. Are they for sale?