How's this for a jacketed fermenter?

[harpo]

Man, you guys are relentless!!

I purged the keg with argon to minimize any affect the welding had on the interior, and then we used a stainless wire wheel to brush the interior bright and clean and then used a surf-ox machine to eliminate any contamination.

I have yet to try it with glycol. I will have an opportunity here in the next month or so. I have actually decided to go pro. In reality, I decided to go pro 2 years ago, so after 2 years of planning and testing and building things like this things are coming to fruition and we should be opening up in April or May!!!

As soon as I test this setup on glycol I will post up if it works with 10Gal batches.

 

[Stevo2569]

Awesome. Its cool that you've gone pro. Big Choice is a cool name.

 

[wyzazz]

That's great! I wish you the best of luck!!! And definitely report back on how that cooling jacket works.

 

[maida7]

Why not just put the fermenter in a temp controlled refrigerator?

 

[harpo]

Why not just put the fermenter in a temp controlled refrigerator?

Wouldn't that defeat the purpose of the jacket?

For my purpose, I wanted one centralized cooler/freezer with a 10 gallon batch of glycol at 27 degrees. From the cooler I would pump the glycol to multiple fermenters in one area. Therefore, instead of trying to build a homemade cooler to house all my fermenters, I just put them all on a rack connected to the glycol loop.

 

[maida7]

Wouldn't that defeat the purpose of the jacket?

For my purpose, I wanted one centralized cooler/freezer with a 10 gallon batch of glycol at 27 degrees. From the cooler I would pump the glycol to multiple fermenters in one area. Therefore, instead of trying to build a homemade cooler to house all my fermenters, I just put them all on a rack connected to the glycol loop.

How many fermenters? A sanke keg will fit in a fridge, no problems. Get one fridge per fermenter. Add a temp controller to each fridge and you can dial in each fermenter. Quick, easy, No glycol needed, No welding or modifications are needed for the fermenters. This is how I ferment (15.5 gal sanke in a fridge). Obviously there are more ways to skin a cat but I'm not sure I would try to jacket a tiny fermenter when you can use a fridge. Refrigerators work very well at this scale. Now if your doing anything larger then 1 BBL fermenters, the glycol system is probably the best solution.

 

[harpo]

How many fermenters? A sanke keg will fit in a fridge, no problems. Get one fridge per fermenter. Add a temp controller to each fridge and you can dial in each fermenter. Quick, easy, No glycol needed, No welding or modifications are needed for the fermenters. This is how I ferment (15.5 gal sanke in a fridge). Obviously there are more ways to skin a cat but I'm not sure I would try to jacket a tiny fermenter when you can use a fridge. Refrigerators work very well at this scale. Now if your doing anything larger then 1 BBL fermenters, the glycol system is probably the best solution.

I'm not sure which fridge style you are looking at, but a garage full of upright refrigerators would leave little room for anything else. I regularly would have 4-6 sankes in various stages of fermentation/secondary/chilling. Prior to this idea I used one 7cuft chest freezer to chill the beer to 30 degrees for filtering and carbing. That means at least 24 hours in the chest freezer to get it down to that temp. With the glycol setup, once the beer is ready to drop, I set the temp and go. No waiting for room in one chest freezer.

It was all about space for me. It may not be what works in your house, but it was for me.

Cheers!

 

[ajm163]

I don't think the current number of Fermenters is the point.... If you plan to scale buying a new fridge every time you want to add a fermenter is just not a sustainable both from a cost and floor space angle. The idea is to have a scalable solution.... using the jackets and Glycol all you would have to do to add another fermenter is hook up the glycol lines. Yes having a fridge for 1 or 2 fermenters is easier.... but are you going to have 25 fridges for 25 fermenters i think not

 

[maida7]

I'm not sure which fridge style you are looking at, but a garage full of upright refrigerators would leave little room for anything else. I regularly would have 4-6 sankes in various stages of fermentation/secondary/chilling. Prior to this idea I used one 7cuft chest freezer to chill the beer to 30 degrees for filtering and carbing. That means at least 24 hours in the chest freezer to get it down to that temp. With the glycol setup, once the beer is ready to drop, I set the temp and go. No waiting for room in one chest freezer.

It was all about space for me. It may not be what works in your house, but it was for me.

Cheers!

40-60 gallons is a lot of beer to have fermenting (for a home brewer). How often do you brew? If your going pro you should really consider much larger fermenters. And larger batches just to save time and keep up with demand. I'm also looking to go pro but I'd consider a 3bbl system the minimum size to start with.

As a home brewer, I only have one or two (10 gallon) batches going at a time so I can get by with one fridge. I also don't cold crash or filter. I rack the beer from the fermenter to the keg at ambient temps. I get some yeast in my kegs but it doesn't really bother me. If I was really concerned with clarity I'd probably use finings

 

[maida7]

I don't think the current number of Fermenters is the point.... If you plan to scale buying a new fridge every time you want to add a fermenter is just not a sustainable both from a cost and floor space angle. The idea is to have a scalable solution.... using the jackets and Glycol all you would have to do to add another fermenter is hook up the glycol lines. Yes having a fridge for 1 or 2 fermenters is easier.... but are you going to have 25 fridges for 25 fermenters i think not

First off you can get a fridge for 50.00 on craigslist. Sometimes you can get them for free.

I must have missed the part where you talked about having 25 fermenters.

Having 25 tiny fermenters vs 2 or 3 larger fermenters. Are you pro brewing or home brewing? If your going pro it makes more sense to have 2 or 3 big ones. At least that's my opinion.

 

[harpo]

Well there's the rub now isn't it. In my preparations for going pro, I attempted to simulate the same procedures as if I was at the scale as I intend to start. However, a 7bbl conical won't fit in my garage, nor is that a productive and cost effective way to end up gathering the information I was looking for.

I understand that some of the Procedures I was doing were pushing the envelope for what typical home brewing is. But becoming a great homebrewer was not my ultimate goal. Becoming a proficient brewer using equipment and methods used in typical (and sometimes not so typical) production breweries was my purpose. I believe I have been accomplishing that.

This forum is a wealth of knowledge. It has been helpfully in many aspects. I also know that the camaraderie shown by fellow brewers in the professional world is the best I've ever experience during my short 25 years in the workforce. In my own small way I intend to embrace that effort and hopefully spread it as best I can.

No, I am not using sankes in my endeavors. That was my practice for living my dream which I do every day now. I hope you do(will) too.

Cheers!

 

[ClaudiusB]

So I searched for tanks similar to these and realized that the jacket is not all 360° around the tank. It is separated, having the inlet on one side at the bottom and the outlet on the top of the other side.

I am currently putting at divider plate between the inlet and outlet on the prototype. It won't be a complete seal, but close enough to make the outlet port the path of least resistance. The next one will have the split between the inlet and outlet and we will have the divider welded completely.

Thanks for the questioning of the separator!

Look at my post #2 from 2006 and you can clearly see how the in port is separated from the out port.
The cooling belt has an upper and lower half and the cooling fluid has to go around the belt before it can exit, like a loop.
Welded shut on one side and open on the other end.

http://hobbybrauer.de/modules.php?name=eBoard&file=viewthread&tid=3032#pid143551

Cheers,
ClaudiusB

 

[BrewBeer74]

I love this!!Very nice work.to answer the question above your not going to have a problem because your batch size is much smaller so your thermal mass is not as much of a factor.and plus if your in a northern envirnment your going to be ok.

 

[BrewBeer74]

opps.didnt realise there were more pages to this.still i love this idea.i am currently using 1bbl stout fermenters and wish they were jacketed for glycol.

 

[TriangleIL]

This is a really cool idea. Good luck going pro. I think a lot of us here have the same dream.

If you are going to be creating your own glycol chillers on larger (1BBL+) fermenters, why not wrap them with multiple layers? You could have 2-3-4 of these wraps connected top down. In port on the top wrap, goes 97% around the fermenter (assuming you are using the most of the way around the fermenter method to ensure you get complete utilization of the glycol around the keg), then has an out port that is either directly hooked into the in port of another ring just below it, or even better, just weld a connection piece that flows down and into the next level jacket.

I could probably mock something up if I'm not really being clear. Good luck!

 

[tomroeder]

For everyone who is suggesting a fridge instead of the jackets, have you ever wrestled a snake with 11+ gallons of wort? My guess is no. The jackets are the way to go! The only concern I would have is the vessel sweating, but that should be easily overcome.

 

[Mellman]

For everyone who is suggesting a fridge instead of the jackets, have you ever wrestled a snake with 11+ gallons of wort? My guess is no. The jackets are the way to go! The only concern I would have is the vessel sweating, but that should be easily overcome.

that was a humorous typo

 

[Supurb]

This is an impressive project !

 

[Phunhog]

Another easier and cheaper option for controlling temperatures in a Sanke keg is a modified water bath set up. I put my Sanke in a large rolling plastic tub and fill it with water. I use a dual stage temp controller. The Heat side has an aquarium heater. The Cold side controls a cheap submerisible pump. The pump pumps the water bath through an immersion chiller in an iced down cooler. I am able to maintain temps within .5 degree. The best part is that it is much cheaper and easier than a glycol system and it could be easily expanded for multiple fermentors.

 

[Islandboy85]

I got this idea after looking at some wine tanks. They only had a center section jacketed with glycol. I have heard they can keep the contents at fermentation temps relatively easily, as well as crash cool.

I basically started with two sections of 20GA 304 stainless steel 25.250" long and 7" wide. After putting the holes and dimple features into the pieces, and adding a 5° bend on the 25" sides both top and bottom, we pre-bent them around a 5 gal bucket to start the form. One side has the holes for the 1/2" couplings for goes-inta and goes-outa for glycol. Goes-inta is on the bottom with a directional flow. It basically is a coupling with an end on it, like a cap, but in the end which is inside the jacket it has a .125" slot milled into the side, thus allowing sideways flow of the glycol. The goes-outa is just an open coupler.

Each dimple is .225" high, inside to outside and has a .250" hole in it where the dimple is rosette welded to the wall of the keg. The 5° bends allow for the edge to be fused to the rib of the keg. It was pressure tested at over 25PSI with no deformation or leaks! I plan to run the glycol at about 5PSI to start, and the solenoid valve will be on the goes-outa (output) to avoid any lack of glycol in the jacket. The idea behind the staggered dimples is to induce turbulence and increse contact with all parts of the jacket before the glycol leaves and goes back to the reservoir.

Now I gotta hook it up and see if it works!

Can you explain more about the dimpling process?