Help with a Wee Heavy recipe

[SaisonMan]

I'm interested in brewing a Wee Heavy that was featured on The Apartment Brewer several years ago. The recipe is below. He liked the beer, but at the end of the video he mentioned that "some of the the harsher characteristics of some of those dark caramel malts are coming through a little bit more. It's not in an offensive way'' but could use a little bit more sweetening.

I don't like harsh or overly roasty, so my question is how to tweak the recipe to tone that down and bring out the maltiness more.

I don't know a ton about the mixing of specialty malts, but my first thought is that there's too much Special Roast. Thoughts?

Here's the recipe:

Recipe for 5 gallons, your efficiency may vary:

"Say Hello to My Wee Beer"

8% ABV

29 IBU

15 lb Golden Promise (84.4%)
1.25 lb Special Roast (7%)
0.5 lb Crystal 120L (2.8%)
0.5 lb Pale Chocolate Malt (2.8%)
0.5 lb Melanoidin Malt (2.8)
Handful (0.5 oz) Black Malt (0.2%)

Mash at 150 F (65 C) for 90 min

Water (ppm): Ca: 57, Mg: 6, Na: 17, SO4: 60, Cl: 75, HCO3: 45

Add 2g Gypsum, 2g Epsom, 5g CaCl, and 2g Baking Soda to 8.5 gal (32 L) of water

60 minute boil

60 min - 2 oz (56g) East Kent Goldings (4.4% AA)
5 min - 1 oz (28g) Fuggles (4.4% AA)

OG: 1.075 (estimated)

1 large starter of Wyeast 1728 Scottish Ale

Ferment at 60-65 F (15-18 C) for 1 week, then raise to 70 F (21 C) for the end of fermentation, for a total of 3 weeks in the fermenter. Then cold condition and bulk age for another 2-3 weeks, preferably a month.

FG: 1.015

 

[SaisonMan]

Anyone? Anyone? Bueller?

 

[DBhomebrew]

98% UK pale malt
2% roasted barley
30 IBU EKG nearly all at 60-120m
If you're going to use a bit of late hops, might as well use the finer EKG over Fuggle

 

[Brockness Monster]

^^^ this is better. Don't overcomplicate things. Pull off a quart of first runnings and boil down to a syrup if you want to get fancy.

 

[SaisonMan]

Thanks to both for the feedback. I've seen that Traquair House recipe several times while researching the Wee Heavy style. I'm still curious about the mix of malts in the original recipe, just for educational purposes. I assume most of them are for color, but the amount of Special Roast seems over the top, flavor-wise. Do you agree? Also, are Special Roast and roasted barley similar?

 

[Brockness Monster]

C120 - Residual sweetness, Dark fruit flavors
Pale Chocolate - not sure why this is here, presumably a light chocolate note
Black malt - Color
Melanoidin - Biscuit notes
Special roast - toasty and biscuity (similar to a Biscuit Malt)

Kind of a whole lot of nonsense except maybe the C120 if you wanted some toffee/dark fruit flavors going on.

 

[DBhomebrew]

American homebrew and craft beer has a history of using near flavorless "2-row" base malt and adding special malts for flavor, color, character. Your recipe screams this approach. The classic European styles typically have rather simple recipes utilizing distinctive ingredients. With 98% UK pale malt (Golden Promise is a great choice), you don't need to add biscuit, bread, malty flavors. It is bready, malty. In a beautifully balanced, nuanced way.

Pale chocolate, black. Both a roasted malt. You don't need both. 2% roasted barley for color.

Melaniodin, special roast. Both trying to bring that biscuit, bready flavor. Neither are needed with a good UK pale malt.

Crystal. Yes, a strong Scottish ale should be malty, but definitely not cloying like many American 'wee heavies'. Residual sweetness off a ~1.075 is sweet enough. Dark fruit. You don't need it. You might get a slight fruitiness from the UK yeast, but in a strong Scottish ale it should be very minimal.

Really, that recipe is a mess.

I recall using special roast in a Weikert recipe long ago. It was supposed to bring a sourdough, almost marshmallow flavor. Nothing like roasted barley or black malt. Although, I do believe biscuit/melaniodin are at the very pale end of the same process that gives you chocolate and black malts. Roasted barley and black malt are fairly interchangeable at 2%. The former is not malted. At some time in history that had tax implications.