First Wort Hopping

[Denny]

as usual, i disregard all brewing "truths" and try things for myself. Here's a pic of my citra-amarillo apa that only had a fwh and then a 5 day dry-hop in the primary after a 2 week ferment. Not seeing a problem with head retention here.....and it's a delicious little hop-bomb. Ymmv

this^^^^^

 

[Denny]

I didn't say it was the truth, I actually have not experimented with it. I thought that I would add some info to the discussion..

It would be great if you (or anyone else who simply quotes without personal experience) would post a disclaimer saying that you have no idea if it's true.

 

[Denny]

Truth.

Which is why I found ways to get smooth bitterness without doing FWH for IPAs. That seems to be the only reason people do it. It always seemed very arbitrary that people are FWH'ing a beer with 6-12 oz. total hops and 60++ IBUs on average for a 5 gallon batch. I understand the technique for a German Pilsener, but it makes no sense for an American IPA/IIPA. It just seems to be a fad now for that style and I doubt the .25 and .50 oz that some people are using for FWH really matters vs. a traditional bittering addition. So if I want smooth bitterness, I will simply use less hops at bittering and/or choose low cohumulone hops to bitter with. Combine this with a ton of late hops, and it works just as well to offer a smoother bitterness and great hop flavor/aroma!

Not me...I do it mainly for hop flavor and 99% of the time still do a normal 60 min. addition. I don't do it for a fad. I do it for the results.

 

[bobbrews]

FWH for hop flavor (pine, grapefruit, etc.) under a 60-90 minute boil whereupon the flavor dissipates into pure bitterness? I don't know about that.... That's what late additions are for. Even if it were true, the 1/2 oz. you used at FWH would not lend as much flavor as 2 oz. at 15 minutes.

 

[Voodoo_Child]

I have two 3 gallon batches I'm planning, basic pales with 1 type of hop each and basic malt bill. I could see using FWH with a hop bursted pale to see what it adds. I agree that you would want that bitterness from a 60 min addition in an IPA though.

I'm in the 30 min 150 degree hop steep camp, amazing flavor and aroma.

 

[Denny]

FWH for hop flavor (pine, grapefruit, etc.) under a 60-90 minute boil whereupon the flavor dissipates into pure bitterness? I don't know about that.... That's what late additions are for. Even if it were true, the 1/2 oz. you used at FWH would not lend as much flavor as 2 oz. at 15 minutes.

Nope, the flavor doesn't dissipate during the boil. I find that I get a much more "integrated" flavor than from a late (10-20 min.) addition. And I tend to use 1-2 oz. as FWH.

 

[Akavango]

It would be great if you (or anyone else who simply quotes without personal experience) would post a disclaimer saying that you have no idea if it's true.

The first line on my initial post was "A couple days ago while researching the issue I came accross this info:" It would be fair to assume that I hadn't been able to experiment. I didn't see the need to put a disclaimer because It is not possible to make a beer ready to drink in 2 days.

This is a forum where people come to get and share info, some of it is first hand, some of it is second hand. It would be nice if people were a little more open to contradictory information. After it is up to you what you want to do with it, experiment or research it some more.

As I said I came accross this info 2 days ago and since I'm new to making IPAs and have been researching the best method to make a delicious IPA. I came accross some info that i never read before so I thought i would present it to the good people on this site to see if anyone has experience with this or not. Now If I'm going to feel agressed every times I post something that might challenge people believe and common practice I don't see the point of this forum.

 

[Denny]

Hey, calm down! Just a friendly suggestion for everyone.

 

[TyTanium]

Good use of the word aggressed.

Challenge common practice, yes. But there's good reason for common practice; it's not arbitrary.

 

[bobbrews]

Challenge common practice, yes. But there's good reason for common practice; it's not arbitrary.

For some things... like not murdering people. But I'd say that the "laws" of brewing are a lot more bendable.

 

[Bamsdealer]

Just to clarify the conversation - 1 IBU = 1 PPM of Alpha Acid. You're correct - but PPM works in all units. That doesn't mean that Alpha Acid is the only thing that creates the bitterness profile of beers - technically it's the only thing represented in the IBU number.

For chemistry-types, is there anything that happens specifically to the Alpha Acid during a longer, below boiling soak or does it just allow for a more complete AA extraction?

I view home brewing as a chemistry experiment. I'm capable of making some excellent beers - but with the really great selection in local stores I can't claim to make better beer than I can buy. I figure that brewing is a fun activity with tasty results. So, with that in mind, I think I'll plan to do a split batch. I'll brew a basic IPA and split the collected wort to two boils. I'll do a FHW on one and the standard hop schedule on the other. I can then have some bjcp certified friends blind taste them and tell me what they think.

So, for those of you that have done FWH (I haven't yet) - if I were aiming to keep IBU totals similar how should I proceed? Should I simply replace the 60 minute addition?

Obviously I want to make a tasty beer - but with something like this the fewer variables the better. I'll prob stick to a very basic malt profile and maybe just go with multiple additions of a single hop. Any suggestions for very basic but tasty IPA recipes?

I agree with a basic malt profile and pick a hop like Centennial or Simcoe. If you go with a low AA like Cascade, you will need double the first hop addition to get a similar bitterness

10lb 2 row
.75lb crystal 10 through 60, your choice
.25lb carapils

1oz hops at 60 vs FWH to compare
1oz hops at 15
1oz hops at 5
1-2oz dry hop

 

[hotpants]

sorry that was my roommate

 

[brycelarson]

I agree with a basic malt profile and pick a hop like Centennial or Simcoe. If you go with a low AA like Cascade, you will need double the first hop addition to get a similar bitterness

10lb 2 row
.75lb crystal 10 through 60, your choice
.25lb carapils

1oz hops at 60 vs FWH to compare
1oz hops at 15
1oz hops at 5
1-2oz dry hop

sounds reasonable. I've been moving away from crystal malts recently. I'll try to knock this out and report back.

 

[Denny]

I agree with a basic malt profile and pick a hop like Centennial or Simcoe. If you go with a low AA like Cascade, you will need double the first hop addition to get a similar bitterness

10lb 2 row
.75lb crystal 10 through 60, your choice
.25lb carapils

1oz hops at 60 vs FWH to compare
1oz hops at 15
1oz hops at 5
1-2oz dry hop

The experiment I did used only 60 in one batch and only FWH in the other. That's the way I recommend you do it. Other hops could cover up subtleties.

 

[brycelarson]

The experiment I did used only 60 in one batch and only FWH in the other. That's the way I recommend you do it. Other hops could cover up subtleties.

good point. I like that idea. Now I just have to do a recipe that'll be tasty and worth brewing.