First Partial Mash

[mrgrimm101]

So I really want to brew an American Stout I saw on BYO. I am pretty sure it is a partial mash recipe, but I could be wrong.

It has almost 3lbs of grains and it says to steep them in about 1 gallon of water at 170F for 30 minutes, which if I understand correctly is basically a mash.

I've never steeped this much grains before. What is the best way to properly steep almost 3 lbs of grains in 1 gallon of water in a 5 gallon kettle?

Even if i separated the grains into 2-3 muslin bags, I would be worried about burning the grains if they touch the bottom of the kettle. Is that a legitimate concern?

I have a big mesh bag that I use sometimes to line my primary and strain the trub after I've poured the kettle. I was thinking of using this bag as a BIAB system where I put it in the kettle and just make sure it's slightly off the bottom of the kettle and make a grain bed with that.

Does anyone have any thoughts on this?

Thanks.

 

[hopjunkie26]

Back when I did partial mash I had a small pasta strainer (similar to this: http://www.webstaurantstore.com/5-1...t4C8p6PmR2zyjoZEDkZH0qhnZtShofRJQm5-SO8zw_wcB) that I would put in the bottom of my kettle, upside down. This gave the bag of grains something to rest on without the worry of scorching.

 

[kh54s10]

That would technically be an extract with steeping grains recipe. I did mine by adding the grains to a muslin bag. I would put that into the water when it was hot with the stove on high. I tied the knotted end to the handle of my pot. I never worried about the bag touching the bottom and never had any problems.

My kits were Northern Brewer and this is the method I used: "Steep for 20 minutes or until water reaches 170°F. Remove bag and discard". I would put the grains in when the water was fairly hot, the 20 minutes and 170 degrees was usually pretty close. If I reached 170 too soon I just turned off the heat.

All my extracts were done this way and I always got good results.

170 degrees is not hot enough to harm the bags or scorch the grains.

 

[peterj]

So I really want to brew an American Stout I saw on BYO. I am pretty sure it is a partial mash recipe, but I could be wrong.

It has almost 3lbs of grains and it says to steep them in about 1 gallon of water at 170F for 30 minutes, which if I understand correctly is basically a mash.

I've never steeped this much grains before. What is the best way to properly steep almost 3 lbs of grains in 1 gallon of water in a 5 gallon kettle?

Even if i separated the grains into 2-3 muslin bags, I would be worried about burning the grains if they touch the bottom of the kettle. Is that a legitimate concern?

I have a big mesh bag that I use sometimes to line my primary and strain the trub after I've poured the kettle. I was thinking of using this bag as a BIAB system where I put it in the kettle and just make sure it's slightly off the bottom of the kettle and make a grain bed with that.

Does anyone have any thoughts on this?

Thanks.

170F is not a mashing temperature. At that temperature any enzymes will be denatured and no conversion will take place. It really depends on what the 3 pounds of grains are as to whether or not they need to be mashed. But 170F for 30 minutes is a steep.

 

[peterj]

Is it this recipe: https://byo.com/stories/item/2341-american-stout-style-profile?

If so, the grains are roasted barley, crystal 40L, and chocolate malt which can all be steeped. None of those have any diastatic power so mashing them won't do anything.

 

[mrgrimm101]

Is it this recipe: https://byo.com/stories/item/2341-american-stout-style-profile?

If so, the grains are roasted barley, crystal 40L, and chocolate malt which can all be steeped. None of those have any diastatic power so mashing them won't do anything.

Yes it is that exact recipe. I guess I misunderstood the definition of "partial mash".

All of my batches so far have been extract with steeped grains. I've just always used about 3 gallons of water and this recipe calls for only 1 gallon during steeping. I've never steeped that much grains in such little amount of water so I was worried.

Would I be ok then to just let the muslin bags sit on the bottom of the kettle in the 1 gallon of water?

 

[peterj]

Yes it is that exact recipe. I guess I misunderstood the definition of "partial mash".

All of my batches so far have been extract with steeped grains. I've just always used about 3 gallons of water and this recipe calls for only 1 gallon during steeping. I've never steeped that much grains in such little amount of water so I was worried.

Would I be ok then to just let the muslin bags sit on the bottom of the kettle in the 1 gallon of water?

It's not really recipe specific, that's just how he suggests doing a steep. It really doesn't matter how much water you use. Just use your normal steeping procedure. All you're really doing is soaking the grains and rinsing the color and flavor from them. Exact temperature and time don't really matter very much either. As long as you're between about 145-170F for 20-60 minutes with enough water to completely soak all of the grains, then you're good.

 

[kh54s10]

As I said previously, I tie my muslin bags to the handle of the kettle. But, my recipes start with 2.5 - 3 gallons, boil down to 2 - 2.5 then top up to 5 gallons. I also untie and swirl them around every few minutes. I also don't think you have anything to worry about by the bags touching the bottom of the pot. Just make sure they get fully saturated with as much water getting to all the grain as possible.

When the recipe calls for 1 gallon steep water, what is the amount for the boil? I would guess you will need to add water for the boil amount. That volume is more critical for hop utilization. The recipe should have been designed with that in mind. For example the recipe for a 2.5 gallon boil and them top up to 5 gallons would need a different hop schedule than a full 6.5 to 7 gallon boil to end up with 5 gallons. You will need to follow the recipe.

 

[mrgrimm101]

It calls for 6.5 gallons of preboil water but i only have a 5 gallon kettle so Ill probably add enough water to do a 4 gallon boil and then top off to 5 when i transfer to primary.

How would i adjust the hops to account for this?

 

[peterj]

For example the recipe for a 2.5 gallon boil and them top up to 5 gallons would need a different hop schedule than a full 6.5 to 7 gallon boil to end up with 5 gallons. You will need to follow the recipe.

I don't really think that's true. The only thing you have to look out for with partial boils is that if you dilute with an equal amount of water, you'll only be able to end up with around 40-50 IBUs total in the finished beer. The isomerized alpha acids have a maximum solubility limit of around 100 IBU (probably more like 85 or so actually) in any solution. So 2.5 gallons of 100 IBU wort + 2.5 gallons of 0 IBU water = 5 gallons of 50 IBU wort. The same is not true of flavor and aroma, so if you add the correct amount for 5 gallons of wort to 2.5 gallons and then top off to 5 gallons, it will be correct. Especially with extract brewing, hop utilization is not nearly as dependent on gravity as the calculators would lead you to believe.

It calls for 6.5 gallons of preboil water but i only have a 5 gallon kettle so Ill probably add enough water to do a 4 gallon boil and then top off to 5 when i transfer to primary.

How would i adjust the hops to account for this?

You don't need to adjust them, that will be fine. It is a good idea to do as large a boil as you can though.

 

[mrgrimm101]

Awesome i think i have all the info i need on the steeping. Thanks everyone!

One last thing: with the yeast, the recipe says "The proper pitch rate is 2.5 packages of liquid yeast or 1 package of liquid yeast in a 3.1-liter starter."

As I am planning on using dry yeast, would I be safe with 1.5 packets of yeast? Is this too much?

 

[peterj]

Here is a pretty good pitching rate calculator: http://www.mrmalty.com/calc/calc.html. It was actually developed by the same guy that wrote that article and recipe (Jamil Zainasheff).

But yeah, for 5 gallons of 1.072 wort I would use about 1.5 packets of properly rehydrated dry yeast.

 

[unionrdr]

This is where the Cooper's 15g yeast packets came in handy when I did my Burton ale. Then rehydrate the dry yeast & pitch at the yeast's sweet spot at high krausen. I've been using the same 5G SS kettle for pb/pm biab that I started brewing with. When doing E/SG, I steep in two gallons of spring water @ 155-160F for 30 minutes. Then dunk sparge the bag in 1.5 gallons of the same water @ 170F. Stirring well for 5 minutes or so to extract more goodness. My OG's are just about always higher than the recipe. Why add water when you can add wort?