First OverCarbed Keg

[Munchkin]

well I tried to carbonate my brown ale in the keg at room temperature 8 days ago. From the charts ive read i decided to set the regulator at 30psi @ 68-70F. I moved it into the fridge about an hour ago and decided i wanted to give it a taste even though it hasnt yet been cooled down. The beer is way overcarbonated just spraying foam everywhere even at 5psi. Can someone outline a simple step by step process on how to degas some of this co2? Is it simply a matter of just burping the keg daily until it loses more and more co2?

 

[Valtyr]

Burping it should be fine. I'm sure someone on here has a much more scientific answer that will give more accurate results, but that's the method I usually use if I overcarb.

 

[Munchkin]

Burping it should be fine. I'm sure someone on here has a much more scientific answer that will give more accurate results, but that's the method I usually use if I overcarb.

thanks man. However the situation has turned alittle odd. I poured a couple foamy glasses from the keg, then set them in the freezer for abit to cool down. After the foam had subsided the beer surprising appeared and tasted undercarbonated. I suspected i had some kind of air leak in the outlet valve that was introducing air as i was pouring but that doesnt appear to be the case. After pouring though, the outlet line connected to my picnic tap slowly fills with either air or co2? Usually the line just looks filled with beer from end to end so this worries me as well. Any thoughts or ideas?

Pouring very slowly i can see bubbles coming into the tap line from from the ball valve outlet. Spraying sanitizer on all connections doesnt show any leaks

 

[freisste]

thanks man. However the situation has turned alittle odd. I poured a couple foamy glasses from the keg, then set them in the freezer for abit to cool down. After the foam had subsided the beer surprising appeared and tasted undercarbonated. I suspected i had some kind of air leak in the outlet valve that was introducing air as i was pouring but that doesnt appear to be the case. After pouring though, the outlet line connected to my picnic tap slowly fills with either air or co2? Usually the line just looks filled with beer from end to end so this worries me as well. Any thoughts or ideas?



Pouring very slowly i can see bubbles coming into the tap line from from the ball valve outlet. Spraying sanitizer on all connections doesnt show any leaks

Your keg is pressurized, so no air is getting in. It is likely just a nucleation point for CO2 to come out of solution because it is a little warmer and the CO2 and beer are not at equilibrium.

I don't know long long the keg has been cooling, but I would make sure it is at fridge temps before doing anything else.

Your beer seeming undercarbed makes me think this is an issue with the temperature. More CO2 comes out of solution than it should because your picnic tap is too warm, then you cool it and the rest of the CO2 is not driven out because it is below its equilibrium point. So it seems flat.

Personally, I'd burp the keg and then make sure to get it to fridge temp. Try again then and see what happens. Keep in mind, sometimes you have to dump the first half pint to get good beer in your line. This is because you have to cool it to keep CO2 in solution.

 

[chickypad]

That foam is all the CO2 coming out of solution, so the remaining beer is flat. I agree with freisste, it's probably foaming because you were trying to serve it warm. It's the same situation when you try to pout a keg with lines too short. I'd give it another day or so to equilibrate then try again before you decide if you need to de-carb. Is your system at keg temps usually balanced at the volumes that you carbed this beer to?

 

[TheZymurgist]

Your beer seeming undercarbed makes me think this is an issue with the temperature. More CO2 comes out of solution than it should because your picnic tap is too warm, then you cool it and the rest of the CO2 is not driven out because it is below its equilibrium point. So it seems flat.

That's the answer. You're getting foam because there's so much pressure in the keg just shooting the beer out. You'd need a really really long serve line to properly serve a keg with 30lbs of pressure in it. Let the temp drop, then give it a few days or a week to absorb the CO2 into solution, then try it.

 

[Hello]

Why are you trying to serve at 30 PSI? Is that normal?

 

[freisste]

Why are you trying to serve at 30 PSI? Is that normal?

My understanding is that it was pressurized to a certain point to achieve a certain number of volumes of CO2. It was carbed warm, so it required higher pressure. Presumably OP did not leave it hooked to that pressure while cooling.

 

[Hello]

Oh I get it. I had carbed root beet at 35 and tried to serve it. It was foamy but not like the OP's, it was also not warm but the pressure was certainly too high for serving. Now carbonated, I serve at a much lower pressure (12 PSI).

 

[chickypad]

Oh I get it. I had carbed root beet at 35 and tried to serve it. It was foamy but not like the OP's, it was also not warm but the pressure was certainly too high for serving. Now carbonated, I serve at a much lower pressure (12 PSI).

Yeah but you're going to lose your carb that way, unless you finish the keg quickly enough not to notice. For soda you need really long lines, like 25-30 ft.

 

[Munchkin]

Thanks for the responses.

To Clarify, The beer was pressurized to 30psi at room temp 68-70F for one week. I then put the keg in the fridge, turned the pressure down to serving pressure (10 or 12) and tried to pour (the keg was still at room temperature at this time).

I will try it again tonight after being in the fridge for 24hrs. This temperature thing is playing a bigger role than i thought here.

I like the idea of force carbing at room temperature since I dont have room for more than one keg in the fridge at a time and tend to finish the keg before brewing another batch, so theres always a lag time between batches which is unacceptable

 

[Munchkin]

problem solved guys thanks!

Temp is at around 36F and tried to pour at 12psi. Perfect! It may be slightly overcarbonated but im no expert so ill just have to play around with the settings. Outlet line no longer has any trapped co2 and its completely full of beer end to end.

 

[Hello]

^^ awesome!

I have found kegging is definitely something that has a slight learning curve but when you get it, it is glorious!

Yeah but you're going to lose your carb that way, unless you finish the keg quickly enough not to notice. For soda you need really long lines, like 25-30 ft.

Well, it has only been a week but I have 10 ft line, 15 PSI serving pressure and carbed for a few days at 35 PSI. Kegconnection seemed to think 10 ft lines were fine for soda. I'll have to research more.

 

[dobe12]

I routinely do exactly what you did and it works great! Precarb warm (room temp - 70F or so) at 30psi for about a week and then remove the gas connection. When a spot opens in my kegerator, I put the keg in and get it cold. This takes about a day (and where your initial problem came in to play). Once chilled to serving temp, hook up the gas at serving pressure and taste. From here I have to tinker with the pressure over a day or two to dial it in, but it's usually pretty close at this point.

Your problem was trying to serve the highly pressurized beer before it had chilled. Once chilled, the beer absorbs more CO2 and equalizes.

Glad you figured it out!

 

[chickypad]

Well, it has only been a week but I have 10 ft line, 15 PSI serving pressure and carbed for a few days at 35 PSI. Kegconnection seemed to think 10 ft lines were fine for soda. I'll have to research more.

Most of the vendors also sell 5 ft beer lines as a standard, but in practice that is way too short for most of us. Up to you, but like I said if you don't want to lose your carb over time you're better off balancing your system to keep the appropriate pressure for dispensing.

 

[dobe12]

if you don't want to lose your carb over time you're better off balancing your system to keep the appropriate pressure for dispensing.

This ^^^^ is so true. I started off with 5ft lines around 5-6psi and was able to balance properly to get a good pour, but over time the carbonation level would drop too low. I now use 10ft lines (give or take a foot) and can keep the serving pressure around 10psi for a good pour and an good average carbonation level.

 

[freisste]

Absolutely.

Don't determine carbonation based on line length; determine line length based on carbonation!

 

[FuzzeWuzze]

Yeah but you're going to lose your carb that way, unless you finish the keg quickly enough not to notice. For soda you need really long lines, like 25-30 ft.

Depends on the hose really i guess..i pressurize and leave Water carbing at 30PSI and serve it through 13 feet of BevFlex with no real issues...the water stays carbed fine...you could never get away with this and beer through all the protein would cause huge foaming issues...if a tiny bit of CO2 comes out of solution its not a big deal for soda water..it appears no different than if you poured a bottled soda into a glass, a bit of bubbles on top that quickly disappear.

 

[Munchkin]

Interesting talk about line length. I can pour at 12psi but I have alittle more head than id actually like. I get a much nicer pour around 9psi. My lhbs set me up with a 6ft line to begin with but i should probably get another one around 10 or 12ft and see if that makes the difference at 12psi.

 

[freisste]

The other thing is that I like to serve my beer where I get a little more aroma - like low to mid 40s. If I was serving in the 33-35 range I bet I could cut my lines in half.

 

[benzesp]

Cool to serving temp.Burp it completely off, hook up your CO2 adjust the regulator till it flows smoothly (might just be a couple psi @ first.) After you lose some volume you will have to bump it in to the 5-6ish range. It will mellow out.

 

[doornumber3]

I serve at 38 and have 6ft lines. 12 psi is golden for most of my beers. I don't force carb unless I have to.


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[kkramer56]

I always force carbonate my keg beer cold. Once the carbonation is finished, I turn off or remove the pressure line and purge the CO2 from the keg, then apply serving pressure.

 

[ColeVet67]

so i have a question (first time kegging) if i "trickle charge" (set and forget) my keg at say 38 deg @ 12 PSI, (for least 2 weeks) then take it out to an outdoor picnic, inside a bucket with ice... will the beer now be perfect carb for 40ish..? Overcarbed.. ? undercarbed..?

because i wouldnt have a fridge to maintain my temps that i carbed at.. ????

 

[TheZymurgist]

so i have a question (first time kegging) if i "trickle charge" (set and forget) my keg at say 38 deg @ 12 PSI, (for least 2 weeks) then take it out to an outdoor picnic, inside a bucket with ice... will the beer now be perfect carb for 40ish..? Overcarbed.. ? undercarbed..?

because i wouldnt have a fridge to maintain my temps that i carbed at.. ????

http://www.kegerators.com/carbonation-table.php

Take a look at that carb sheet. 12psi @ 38º will give you 2.57 volumes. If the beer increases in temp from there, some of the CO2 dissolved in the beer will come out of suspension, leading to a lower carbed beer, but a higher pressure keg. If it increases too much, you'll be pouring all foam, and once the foam dissipates, your beer will be under carbed.

The opposite will happen if the ice bucket lowers the temp of the beer. You'll end up with a higher carbed beer pouring at a lower pressure.

Make sense?

 

[ColeVet67]

http://www.kegerators.com/carbonation-table.php

Take a look at that carb sheet. 12psi @ 38º will give you 2.57 volumes. If the beer increases in temp from there, some of the CO2 dissolved in the beer will come out of suspension, leading to a lower carbed beer, but a higher pressure keg. If it increases too much, you'll be pouring all foam, and once the foam dissipates, your beer will be under carbed.

The opposite will happen if the ice bucket lowers the temp of the beer. You'll end up with a higher carbed beer pouring at a lower pressure.

Make sense?

Yes... i understand tha carb chart you are referring to, but i didnt quite understand what would happen if the keg got warmer/colder. Soooo, with that in mind should i just carb at the higher temp (say 40 ish @12 psi) that way setting the carb level for a higher temp. This way because the keg will be (outside during summer months).. the carb levels would be good for a higher serving temp. and i would just have to monitor the temps so they dont climb up too high.. ?

i assume if the keg isnt out in the direct sun for too long the temp should be ok.. as long as its insulated by ice.. your thoughts.. ?

 

[TheZymurgist]

Yes... i understand tha carb chart you are referring to, but i didnt quite understand what would happen if the keg got warmer/colder. Soooo, with that in mind should i just carb at the higher temp (say 40 ish @12 psi) that way setting the carb level for a higher temp. This way because the keg will be (outside during summer months).. the carb levels would be good for a higher serving temp. and i would just have to monitor the temps so they dont climb up too high.. ?

i assume if the keg isnt out in the direct sun for too long the temp should be ok.. as long as its insulated by ice.. your thoughts.. ?

I think you'll be fine, if you notice the pressure climbing, you can add more ice and bleed off the excess pressure so that you don't pour a bunch of foam. If your CO2 tank is small enough, keep that on hand so you can still pressurize it for pouring, and adjust the carb level if needed.

If you notice it getting flat, just up the pressure a little and give it a good shake. That'll help it absorb some of the CO2.

 

[ColeVet67]

I think you'll be fine, if you notice the pressure climbing, you can add more ice and bleed off the excess pressure so that you don't pour a bunch of foam. If your CO2 tank is small enough, keep that on hand so you can still pressurize it for pouring, and adjust the carb level if needed.

If you notice it getting flat, just up the pressure a little and give it a good shake. That'll help it absorb some of the CO2.

GOOD DEAL.. !! thanx.. yes i plan on bringin my 5lb tank along with me.