Filtering wort from Foundry to fermenter

[RyPA]

Does anyone use any type of filtering when transferring wort from the Foundry to the fermenter? I've tried letting the wort sit for 10 minutes, after running a whirlpool, but with the ball valve being at the bottom, it tends to just suck in everything.

I add all hops commando in the boil/whirlpool/FO stages, so a lot of that hop matter ends up in the fermenter. Not sure how much of a problem that is, but it's probably not ideal.

I was thinking of adding a filter of some sort when transferring to help get cleaner wort into the fermenter.

 

[Broken Crow]

Not sure how much of a problem that is, but it's probably not ideal.

That's truly a matter of opinion...personally I don't like having a lot of trub in the fermenter, but when I've filtered the heck out it it really doesn't make that big a difference and strangely if anything; It seems to take longer to clear when I have less trub... I really don't know, but if you haven't seen @Bobby_M s great long experiment thread, you can take a look here:
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/thread...e-boil-x-kettle-trub-in-the-fermenter.733837/
If you really wanna filter it, the simplest way is to either make a grant which can be as simple as putting a ball valve on a pasta-pot and throwing a hop-spider in it, or you spend lots more for contentious returns (like I did) and get one of these lovely TC inline filters: https://www.brewershardware.com/Wort-Strainers/
Let us know what you settle on.

 

[fluketamer]

i think most filters will clog quickly. i have noticed that if i tilt my aio a little to the opposite side of the ball valve then whirlpool and let it settle that the trub settles away from the bazooka filter. then i tip it too the other side when draining through the ball valve and i can drain clear wort and it doesnt clog up.

my aio is similar dimensions to the foundry so i think that may be an option.

i havent noticed much difference tho if the trub gets in.

 

[RyPA]

Thanks. If the juice isn't worth the squeeze then I won't bother. I always cringe at the end of transfer when I see all of that sludge going into the fermenter, but maybe it's not as bad as it looks.

i think most filters will clog quickly. i have noticed that if i tilt my aio a little to the opposite side of the ball valve then whirlpool and let it settle that the trub settles away from the bazooka filter. then i tip it too the other side when draining through the ball valve and i can drain clear wort and it doesnt clog up.

my aio is similar dimensions to the foundry so i think that may be an option.

i havent noticed much difference tho if the trub gets in.

My outlet/ball valve doesn't even have a bazooka filter, its wide open to let everything pass through. I am not so concerned with malt trub, it's all of the hop matter I would prefer to leave behind.

 

[redrocker652002]

I use a simple colander over my bucket when I transfer. I sanitize it and it seems to catch what the filter in the unit does not. This time, the hop spider was really clogged and had probably close to a cup or two of liquid that I had to filter out. Most of the time though, the colander catches some, but I seem to always have a small amount of crud at the bottom that settles out with time. I don't usually care if the beer is ultra clear as long as it tastes good to me.

 

[Willy]

That's truly a matter of opinion...personally I don't like having a lot of trub in the fermenter, but when I've filtered the heck out it it really doesn't make that big a difference and strangely if anything; It seems to take longer to clear when I have less trub... I really don't know, but if you haven't seen @Bobby_M s great long experiment thread, you can take a look here:
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/thread...e-boil-x-kettle-trub-in-the-fermenter.733837/
If you really wanna filter it, the simplest way is to either make a grant which can be as simple as putting a ball valve on a pasta-pot and throwing a hop-spider in it, or you spend lots more for contentious returns (like I did) and get one of these lovely TC inline filters: https://www.brewershardware.com/Wort-Strainers/
Let us know what you settle on.

Thanks for the experiment link. Interesting. Yet there's so much one can do to generalize. Too many styles and variations.

I did experiments on the "how clean to make the fermenter" side .

For the boil, I do commando on the hops - finding that I get much more of the hops goodness by letting it free range instead of stuck in a spider or a sock. I BIAB whenever possible since it is better filtering out larger stuff.

Depends on the style. But overall I think the "dirtier" it is, the more you get in hop "flavor & aroma". Also, depending on the yeast ... Has a lot to do with clarity with different foculation rates. And yeast has its own flavor profile - so it's not universally applicable.

Comparing styles - a pilsner, lager, (lighter on the SRM scale, 4-7 or 8) vs. an English Brown, or an Irish Stout.

I don't filter the lighter color beers especially if I am fermenting with 34/70 which cleans up great. (Novalager is nice too, but not as clean in my experience. Just by a little. Nothing to worry about).

If I am doing an English Brown with EKG and Fuggles, I filter. Especially if I am looking for pristine clarity of the final ale. Usually using US-05 or Nottingham yeast.

The pilsners and lagers benefit from the 6 week process needed to serve . (14 or more days fermenting, 4 weeks lagering). I don't need to filter that. Yes... I get a bigger trub cake.

But as others have said ... It really doesn't matter very much in most cases. I don't filter the "yellow/gold" styles ... It'll clean up over time. The English Brown Ale or Stout is often served in 3 weeks or less. And I like them clear... So I filter those. YMMV

 

[Broken Crow]

i think most filters will clog quickly. i have noticed that if i tilt my aio a little to the opposite side of the ball valve then whirlpool and let it settle that the trub settles away from the bazooka filter. then i tip it too the other side when draining through the ball valve and i can drain clear wort and it doesnt clog up.

my aio is similar dimensions to the foundry so i think that may be an option.

i havent noticed much difference tho if the trub gets in.

Yeah, most small internal filters will clog, but with whirlpooling and the close-to-edge pickup the Anvil has, the worst remains in a cone and a lot of silt passes through. Those large TC filters are up to the job even with a 12 gallon IPA batch provided you whirlpooled.
@RyPA ..I notice in other threads you use an All-Rounder..Though it's not made for it, you could probably hang one of those Fermonster filter bags in it for filling: https://www.brewhardware.com/product_p/fermonster-mesh.htm
Just a thought.

 

[redrocker652002]

I am going to do a simple SMASH I think next brew so I might try commando with a whirlpool at the end. The Grainfather has a bit of a dish in the middle that might hold some of the "stuff" if I do that. I am curious though if I use the counterflow chiller won't that stir up the crud after the whirlpool? Maybe the IC would be better this time?

 

[Bobby_M]

The valve on the foundry can also be rotated to get the pickup up about 2.5" off the bottom of the boiler. Just make sure you're always turning the valve clockwise.

 

[RyPA]

The valve on the foundry can also be rotated to get the pickup up about 2.5" off the bottom of the boiler. Just make sure you're always turning the valve clockwise.

Yeah, I have it tilted almost horizontal, but it still looks like a lot of crap goes into the fermenter. Plus, I am a sucker for leaving any beer juice behind.

It would be cool to have a siphon from the top, so you could let it settle for an hour or so, and then take the clean wort from the top down.

 

[redrocker652002]

Can you just add a hose to the pump where it hooks into the filter and run it over the top of the unit? Seems too simple, but thought I'd ask.

 

[RyPA]

It would work, but the challenge is getting the pump primed. Maybe you could get a siphon going to get it started, but that would be annoying.

 

[fluketamer]

I use a simple colander over my bucket when I transfer. I sanitize it and it seems to catch what the filter in the unit does not. This time, the hop spider was really clogged and had probably close to a cup or two of liquid that I had to filter out. Most of the time though, the colander catches some, but I seem to always have a small amount of crud at the bottom that settles out with time. I don't usually care if the beer is ultra clear as long as it tastes good to me.

clear wort does not equal clear beer .

Yeah, I have it tilted almost horizontal, but it still looks like a lot of crap goes into the fermenter. Plus, I am a sucker for leaving any beer juice behind.

It would be cool to have a siphon from the top, so you could let it settle for an hour or so, and then take the clean wort from the top down.

i have clogged the bazooka before and ended up siphoning the beer off the trub. that works well also.

 

[RyPA]

clear wort does not equal clear beer .


i have clogged the bazooka before and ended up siphoning the beer off the trub. that works well also.

I brew mostly hazy's, so I don't care about clear beer, my goal is better tasting beer.

 

[Broken Crow]

i have clogged the bazooka before and ended up siphoning the beer off the trub. that works well also.

Have you considered replacing the bazooka with an edge pick-up? https://www.brewhardware.com/product_p/diptube_edge.htm I know you've done some mods to your @Vevor and I have intentionally tagged them because I truly believe that as an early-adopter who posted a lot about the Vevor AIO, you have proven it to be a worthy AIO on a budget and given most homebrewers in the world eventually find this site, I have no doubt you have single-handedly sold a great many units for them and @Vevor aught give you a gift-certificate or something....
..just sayin

 

[fluketamer]

Have you considered replacing the bazooka with an edge pick-up? https://www.brewhardware.com/product_p/diptube_edge.htm I know you've done some mods to your @Vevor and I have intentionally tagged them because I truly believe that as an early-adopter who posted a lot about the Vevor AIO, you have proven it to be a worthy AIO on a budget and given most homebrewers in the world eventually find this site, I have no doubt you have single-handedly sold a great many units for them and @Vevor aught give you a gift-certificate or something....
..just sayin

agreed . lol

when i whirlpool i just stir with a big spoon. i dont use the pump . so although most trub is in the center there is still a lot on the sides. i am not sure if the edge pickup would work good without some sort of trub trapper which i think they stopped making. i usually leave behind a decent amount of wort (about 1.5 liters ) with trub because of this. i can get a lot of it later after the trub really sits and starts to seperate but i usually dont bother and just toss it and consider it waste.

 

[RyPA]

I whirpool with the pump and then let it rest for 5-10 minutes. When i get to the bottom when transferring, it seems like a relatively flat bed of trub/hops. Is the hypothesis that there should be a tightly packed pyramid of crap dead center?

 

[tracer bullet]

I whirlpool during cooling then walk away for a while. Clean up other stuff from the day, get something to eat, put the fermenter back together if it's been soaking in sanitizer, and so on. After that time I go ahead with it into the fermenter. Sure it's not totally clear but it's settled a ton by then. Hops and other stuff's on the bottom and even a bit cone shaped.

If you do angle the tube a bit high, you can still tilt the anvil to get more out if you want.

 

[AzOr]

I use a simple colander over my bucket when I transfer. I sanitize it and it seems to catch what the filter in the unit does not. This time, the hop spider was really clogged and had probably close to a cup or two of liquid that I had to filter out. Most of the time though, the colander catches some, but I seem to always have a small amount of crud at the bottom that settles out with time. I don't usually care if the beer is ultra clear as long as it tastes good to me.

This^
I place a colander on top of fermenter and also place a large hop bag on top of colander.
While my wort is cooling, I boil the hop bag in a small sauce pan.

 

[RyPA]

This^
I place a colander on top of fermenter and also place a large hop bag on top of colander.
While my wort is cooling, I boil the hop bag in a small sauce pan.

Does it catch a lot of vegetal matter from the hops?

 

[AzOr]

It catches quite a bit but I also use a hop spider thingy for my boil, so there’s not a ton of loose material anyway. Next brew day I’ll take a pic.

 

[Broken Crow]

I just remembered what's missing from this conversation: Do you use, or have you tried whirfloc or Irish moss? ...really helps with the cones integrity and out of the larger blobs that may pass through your pickup, it really does help more of it get retained by any manner of filter, be it a colander or mesh bag.

 

[tracer bullet]

Irish moss?

Good point. I put a smidge of super moss in about 10 minutes before flame out. It probably helps, I've not tried a side by side and I seem to always actually remember it.

 

[Willy]

I just remembered what's missing from this conversation: Do you use, or have you tried whirfloc or Irish moss? ...really helps with the cones integrity and out of the larger blobs that may pass through your pickup, it really does help more of it get retained by any manner of filter, be it a colander or mesh bag.

Yes ... 1/2 tablet of whirlfloc per 5 gallons. And whirlpool for 15 min, settle for 15 min. I do this late in the boil ... So I get some whirlpool action while my immersion chiller cools the wort. It is amazing how much hop particle debris gets packed on the Heat exchanger disk of my Brewzilla, especially on the 35L... Almost an inch high. With a larger, wider kettle (BZ 100 L) I get a much thinner layer due to the width of the bottom plate.

 

[RyPA]

I always use 1/2 tab of whirlfloc. I may try a colander with a muslin bag in it, or something

 

[szap]

This probably doesn't really answer your question, but I use some whirlfoc and a short whirlpool, then pretty much empty the Foundry into the fermenter trub and all. There will be some left in the Foundry but not much. I then let everything settle in the fermenter and pressure transfer to keg using a floating dip tube in the fermenter. This has turned out some clear beers

 

[tracer bullet]

Also, Devil's advocate, from what I can gather anyone that's done the "trub vs no trub" thing side by side has ended up deciding it makes no difference or even that "trub" is better.

It's tough to let all that stuff go into the fermenter, and I let some settle out to avoid it as well. I get it. But at the end of the day I can admit it's probably not actually important. At all.

 

[Bobby_M]

I'm firmly in the camp of "leave behind what you reasonably can" .....but not at the expense of more than a few minutes of time or a couple dollars in extra hardware.

 

[Indian_villager]

Have you considered throwing in a hop spider at the end of your whirlpool time and then having the return tube drop into the hop spider to catch most of the junk, then letting things settle for 5 mins, then transferring out?

 

[Bassman2003]

I have been brewing with the Foundry for 4-5 years and it is a challenge because of the small diameter. My advice would be to add a short bit of silicon tubing to the end of the spigot inside the Foundry. This increases the radius of travel for the "pickup tube". Now that you have this larger radius, here is my suggestion:

-Boil
-Whirlpool
-Rest for 20 minutes with the pickup tube down
-Rotate the pickup tube so it is facing up
-Start your transfer
-Follow the transfer level by rotating the spigot to stay under the liquid
-Stop the transfer when you start sucking up trub

The problem with the Foundry & boiling/transferring is that the spigot can't really get above the trub very far. Especially with a heavy hop beer. A wider diameter pot lets the trub line fall lower giving you more room to work with. Hope this helps. It is easy & cheap to try.